Tractor Sizing SO many factors to consider... but ground clearance and +/- backhoe may be the top

[DVMSteve]

Greetings, all. Had the day off, and it was too cold and windy to do my outdoor plumbing repair. So it was tractor research pretty much all day... I've been all over the board for the last couple of weeks. Checked out three machines today, and read a lot on TBN, and now my head is spinning more than ever.

I have 14 acres. 2 is former horse pasture, now mostly centipede grass to mow, and lots of trees to go around. 1 is centipede grass around my house that I mow. The rest is either pine jungle that I've been slowly cleaning up by hand or swampy river back flow. My "garden tractor" (hmmpff), that has been perfectly fine as a mower, had an epic failure the first time I tried to move dirt with the "box blade". Transmission is toast.

What I've been looking for is a Swiss Army tractor that can do it all: mow 'pasture' and lawn mainly, move dirt, tow a rotary cutter in the 'jungle' areas once I get some of the smaller trees out, and dig out the swampy areas eventually. Oh, and dig post holes too.

I would have bought the JD 1025R already, but the (very good, helpful) salesman expressed concern about the low ground clearance, at like 7". He thought I might get it stuck in the woods if a small tire went down in a hole (from a former pine tree, and he's right, there are many!). So, I started looking at the taller 2025R and 2032R. Next I checked out the Massey GC17xx's, and the Massey 1526. Lastly the Kubota BX's and B's. Those are the three closest dealers, at 25, 35, and 65 minutes.

Like I said, MANY features and differences, pluses and minuses with all. But I think these two are the most important for me:

1) Is ground clearance likely to be a big problem with the subcompacts, for my intended uses? If so, that would steer me away from this class altogether. I would still like a MMM, though, and don't want to go too big. THINKING that this was the main issue, I've looked hard at the new 2017 JD 2032R...

2) How much would I really use the backhoe? If I want to keep that as a potential now or later option, then the Massey 1526 and the Kubota BX's won't work. As an important aside, I'm friends with a couple who own a tool rental company. I take care of their cats and rabbits, and they let me borrow their stuff. Cool deal! BUT, I would only borrow their stuff say from Saturday noon until early Monday morning, to not deprive them of some revenue opportunities. Maybe a bit of a pain to load up my trailer, run into town and back, and then return it a day later, but if I might only use it a couple of times per year, may be worth it.

Also, I've been blessed, and cost is not a HUGE factor. I've also considered buying two machines, one dedicated for grass either just around the house, or house and pasture, and then a second for dirt moving and digging. But I'd rather just have one engine to worry about.

Yuck, apologies for the length! If I had listed all of the other comparisons I've made, well.... too long already.
Thanks in advance for any advice offered,
Steve, from the very flat and sandy eastern NC.

 

[JD 4520]

Welcome!

From what you describe as your property and goals, you would be disappointed with anything smaller than a utility sized tractor. I have a similar situation and I thought I bought a little big but in hindsight it definitely sized well for the work that I put it through. Power is good and size is good.

 

[4570Man]

I'd highly recommend buying a second machine to cut grass. $ probably wouldn't be that different since a MMM is pretty expensive and you wouldn't need that anymore. I think you'd be happier with a bigger machine. My L3240 with a BH90 isn't enough machine for any real digging. The ground clearance in its self isn't a big deal, but I get hung up crossing ditches because the end of the backhoe sticks quite a ways past the rear axel. Assuming you have free access to a backhoe or excavator that's not far away I'd skip buying a backhoe. Usually I'm not a fan of renting equipment for a permanent solution, but your circumstances are unique. I've never had my tractor actually stuck with a backhoe attached. I've been hung up a few times, but TLBs ( tractors with backhoes aren't real TLBs but they fit the definition) are pretty good at getting out of a bind.

 

[MossRoad]

Welcome to TBN! :thumbsup:

 

[RNeumann]

From my reading here most recommend a dedicated zero turn mower over the MMM.
The ground clearance is typically a non issue as you can typically aim the front tires. Breakover can be a problem which leads to being high centered. But given the visibility and speeds (slow) it is not a major issue either.
The BX size it too small in my opinion. Once you get mowing out of the tractor I think you will find the B or L series (similar size in other brands- just trying to keep it simple for discussion) will work much better for 14 acres. It's hard to find folks who wished for a smaller tractor. You will read several stories of folks moving up though.
BH or not is up to you. Most that don't have them say it's not worth the cost. They feel it is for projects and when a project needs to get done they rent or borrow that piece. If you have a driveway that will need maintenance switching back to the box blade or similar is a PITB. But those that have BHs love them and swear they have a million uses beyond just the occasional project. If you stick with a major brand adding the BH later will be an option.
Enjoy the hunt!

 

[jeff9366]

I have 14 sandy acres.

Two acres are former horse pasture with lots of trees to mow around. I mow one acre of centipede grass around my house.

Get a Zero Turn dedicated mower for this.

The rest is either pine jungle that I've been slowly cleaning up by hand or swampy river back flow.

How much pine jungle, how much swamp?
What are you attempting to accomplish in your pineland?
What tree spacing do you have to deal with? In rows or random?

I work in sandy Florida Oak jungle regularly. A 60" wide tractor, pulling a 60" wide Bush Hog works fine for me, where a 66" wide tractor would be too wide.

The tools I use for clearing are a pro-grade chainsaw, a battery powered reciprocating saw, a Ratchet Rake bucket attachment and a Dirt Dog (brand) All Purpose Plow, which is more commonly called a Field Cultivator. I use chains to tow downed tree trunks.
I burn the debris.
Bush Hog is for post-clearance maintenance.

No compact tractor can be used in a swamp or bog. Tractors bog easily. For digging in bogs you need a track mounted mini-excavator with a long-reach arm.


These are important for me:

1) Is ground clearance likely to be a big problem with the subcompacts, for my intended uses? If so, that would steer me away from this class altogether.

Yes, 12" to 14" ground clearance is hugely better than 9" ground clearance, reduced to 4" ground clearance with MMM attached. Subcompacts are fine as MOWERS; pretty limited at real tractor tasks.

Tractor manufactures have at least one entry which is relatively heavy, but has an engine just below 25-horsepower, which is where strict/expensive diesel emission controls become mandatory. Kubota's entry is the L2501.

Subcompacts are around 1,400 pounds, bare tractor. "Cheaters", like the L2501, are typically around 2,600 pounds, bare tractor. This is an important category for you to research.

2) How much would I really use the backhoe? I might use it a couple times per year.

Rent/borrow a Backhoe when you need it. A Backhoe is $7,000 and you have to remove the Backhoe to mount implements on the Three Point Hitch. Dedicate that $7,000 to a heavier tractor, you will use the heavier weight, which makes the tractor more capable, all the time.


VIDEOS:

ratchet rake brush clearing - YouTube

field cultivator small tractor - YouTube

excavator with long reach - YouTube

small tractor bogged - Google Search


Having a good dealer near adds value to any tractor you buy.

YOU HAVE FOURTEEN ACRES. BUY ENOUGH TRACTOR.

 

[DVMSteve]

Thanks to all who have responded so far. When I built my house 10 yrs ago, I got great advice from electrical, plumbing, and tile setting forums, and my house is so much better due to the generous help of some really great people. I had guessed the same would be true for my tractor advice solicitation, and I was right!

I REALLY thought that what I wanted was ONE jack-of-all-trades machine, but I see that this was likely misguided. ****. Now I have to research a whole 'nuther thing! OK, so I've been drooling over some of the Snapper ZTR type machines whenever I drop off or pick up my seven or eight small engine machines for service or repair... which is fairly often. Now I have a good excuse. Fortunately I have the most supportive wife, ever!

I have probably 7 acres left of pine jungle; 1 has been cleaned up with a chainsaw, stump grinder, DR brush mower. I've cut down the little trees and bushes, pulled down the pricker vines and poison ivy, all that. The big trees to keep are random, not in rows, and 6-10' apart or more. I really liked the Ratchet Rake video: that looks a lot like what I want to do. IF I had a machine with MMM, I would remove it before taking it into the woods. The subcompacts have a ground clearance of only 7-8" without mower; the larger tractors (cheaters?) are more like 11-13".

Speaking of the "cheaters", it was only the Kubota salesman that even mentioned the Tier IV emissions threshold and the expense of dealing with filters eventually. JD and Massey salesmen never brought it up. For me and my needs, does it sound like staying under 26hp would be worth it, or should I look to go to maybe 32-36 or even more to get the jobs done? The Massey 1736, and the JD 30xx's just looked too big when I checked them out, but again that was when I had been contemplating mowing with them...

The swampy areas, maybe another 3 acres, are a cypress swamp with lots of knees and tons of plant and tree trash. This area is occasionally just muddy, but when the river is high, it fills up to various heights, and then there is a stream going through most of the time. I was thinking of cleaning up some of these areas. Not wanting to drive a tractor down in there, stuck for sure, but to possibly use a backhoe to clean it up. I get that the reach of these machines is limited, and they are expensive to boot. I could just borrow-barter my friend's, but for the inconvenience of transport. That's why I was asking what else I could or likely do with one? "...a million uses beyond the occasional project". I'd love to hear just a few!! That's the main reason I was looking at tractors that would leave that option open for maybe later...

Thanks again.

 

[TheMadOne]

I have about 10 acres total, split by a neighbor's property. I wouldn't want to go any smaller than my L for doing the work I do as far as cleaning out brambles, maple saplings, and multi-flora rose. In fact I'm currently mulling over the idea of trying to get a larger tractor to complement the 3301. If I can find the money or the dealer can work some financing I might. If Tier IV scares you for eventual cost, there's plenty of older tractors on the used market. The ratchet rake is the way to go. It lets me get at stuff that I can't drive over and mow with a bush cutter.

 

[CDN Farm Boy]

Welcome!

From what you describe as your property and goals, you would be disappointed with anything smaller than a utility sized tractor. I have a similar situation and I thought I bought a little big but in hindsight it definitely sized well for the work that I put it through. Power is good and size is good.

Perhaps some clarification on what you mean by 'utility sized' would be useful. In my area, that would mean 60 hp+ full sized farm tractor which would be WAY overkill for 14 acres.

When I was shopping I compared everything from the sub-compacts up to 40 hp and settled on the B3300SU and couldn't be happier. I did get the backhoe with it and am glad I did but if I had the arrangement that you do I'd skip it and borrow a mini ex when ever you need it. I'm with the others on a separate machine for mowing. I had a rear finishing mower but traded it in after only one season for a regular ride-on mower as I have too many trees to cut around and it was too much hassle with switching between it and the backhoe. I would't exclude front mount mowers as an option to the zero-turn though. I'm hoping to buy either of these but plan to have my dealer let me demo them for a bit first to ensure I make the right purchase. The little bit of experience I have on a zero-turn I hated it.

There's lots of folks on here that encourage going bigger than smaller on purchase. There's just as many that have a smaller machine and are amazed at how much work you can get out of them...BUT, I wouldn't want a sub compact for 14 acres

 

[newbury]

<snip>
I have 14 acres. 2 is former horse pasture, now mostly centipede grass to mow, and lots of trees to go around.<snip>

<snip>
I have probably 7 acres left of pine jungle; 1 has been cleaned up with a chainsaw, stump grinder, DR brush mower. I've cut down the little trees and bushes, pulled down the pricker vines and poison ivy, all that. The big trees to keep are random, not in rows, and 6-10' apart or more.<snip>

The swampy areas, maybe another 3 acres, are a cypress swamp with lots of knees and tons of plant and tree trash. <snip>

I'd recommend a robotic mower for the lawn and limiting the lawn to what a robotic mower can handle. My Father and Grandfather had 30 acres plus in Northern Vermont which we built a house garage and big shed on where there was road frontage about 1200' long. All of the road frontage had been grown over cow pasture.

Started out there was the house and maybe 1/2 acre of lawn, and life was good. Then my Grandfather gradually started making the frontage lawn. Ended up with about 4 acres of lawn. Dad mowed the lawn. During most of the summer his main activity after work was coming home and mowing the lawn. Life was not as good. Keep the lawn small.

For the other 7 acres of pine jungle a 30 HP or less should be plenty. If you are looking new I think the sweet spot in the Kubota lineup (from what I've read here) is the L2501, which is apparently the DEF defiant entry, just squeezing under the DEF requirements. I'm sure other manufacturers have similar entries.

Definitely take advantage of getting mini-ex's on rental from your buddies. Put the $$ toward rear remotes and a grapple.