Slip cluch on post hole digger?

[Rancher Ed]

Grrrrrrrrrrr. (I broke 3 shear bolts digging one hole and only got it 2' deep, I had to finish it by hand.) Other than to keep the bolt manufactures in business, is there a reason all post hole diggers have shear bolts instead of slip cluches? Or at least have it as an option?

Ed

 

[mjncad]

How fast were you running the PTO?

 

[RickB]

Bush Hog 2103 PHD's have a slipclutch driveline.

 

[Rancher Ed]

How fast were you running the PTO?

I had the tractor at an idle (700rpm), I don't know what PTO speed this is. We have lots of rocks here.

Bush Hog 2103 PHD's have a slipclutch driveline.

Cool. So there isn't any real reason other than shear bolts are cheeper than slip cluches?

 

[mjncad]

Well there's your problem...rocks.

 

[Timber]

I know I have said this many times and I also live in very rocky Massachusetts. My 1st question is what brand of PHD are you using and how big is the auger? I have laid miles of fencepost in New England & I can tell you that the PHD is just 1 of many that I brake out when digging holes. I have 5 different bars, a clam shell & spade. It is rare that a PHD alone will dig a 4' hole. Do you clear the hole as your drilling or are you just plunging to full depth.When you encounter roots and stone you have to get off you tractor and work the hole by hand. The bottom of any hole has to be cleaned with a clam shell. Many people seem to think that once they buy a PHD they can do all their post holes from the seat of the tractor & that is just not the reality of it. That all said the PHD is my favorite implement.

 

[Rancher Ed]

I know I have said this many times and I also live in very rocky Massachusetts. My 1st question is what brand of PHD are you using and how big is the auger? I have laid miles of fencepost in New England & I can tell you that the PHD is just 1 of many that I brake out when digging holes. I have 5 different bars, a clam shell & spade. It is rare that a PHD alone will dig a 4' hole. Do you clear the hole as your drilling or are you just plunging to full depth.When you encounter roots and stone you have to get off you tractor and work the hole by hand. The bottom of any hole has to be cleaned with a clam shell. Many people seem to think that once they buy a PHD they can do all their post holes from the seat of the tractor & that is just not the reality of it. That all said the PHD is my favorite implement.

It is a massey ferguson model 900 with a 12" auger. I do clear the hole every 8" or so. We have anywhere from 8" to 2' of top soil that doesn't have too many rocks and it has been digging through it fine. The problem comes when we get below this where we have glacial deposits. This is a blue clay mixed with gound up granite that holds the rocks together. Most of the rocks are <2" but there is at least one per hole that is 6" or bigger.

Sounds like our best bet will be to dig till we hit the clay/rocks and then finish the hole with the crow bar and clam shell. It is still way better than digging the whole hole by hand:thumbsup:

Ed

 

[flusher]

It is a massey ferguson model 900 with a 12" auger. I do clear the hole every 8" or so. We have anywhere from 8" to 2' of top soil that doesn't have too many rocks and it has been digging through it fine. The problem comes when we get below this where we have glacial deposits. This is a blue clay mixed with gound up granite that holds the rocks together. Most of the rocks are <2" but there is at least one per hole that is 6" or bigger.

Sounds like our best bet will be to dig till we hit the clay/rocks and then finish the hole with the crow bar and clam shell. It is still way better than digging the whole hole by hand:thumbsup:

Ed

Your 5-ft digging bar is your most useful tool when using your PHD. It dislodges those pesky rocks at the bottom of the hole so your auger can get a bite again. And if you have a helper working with you, that bar makes a handy lever to get some added down force on the auger.

 

[Rancher Ed]

Your 5-ft digging bar is your most useful tool when using your PHD. It dislodges those pesky rocks at the bottom of the hole so your auger can get a bite again. And if you have a helper working with you, that bar makes a handy lever to get some added down force on the auger.

I agree it is very useful, the problem is any rock over 5" or so must be taken out of the hole by had. One hole I dug yesterday I broke 3 shear bolts, each time taking out a 6-8" rock and I was still only down 24" I think with all the rocks we have we will just drill down to the clay and rock and then dig the last 6-12" by had.

Ed

 

[Timber]

The 12 inch drill is working against you on this & I am sure it is the source of your shear pin problems. The larger the diameter of the drill increases the stress on the shear pins. I do everything with a 9 inch drill, yes you do have to be tighter on your tolerances but it is easier drilling a smaller hole

 

[Verticaltrx]

The 12 inch drill is working against you on this & I am sure it is the source of your shear pin problems. The larger the diameter of the drill increases the stress on the shear pins. I do everything with a 9 inch drill, yes you do have to be tighter on your tolerances but it is easier drilling a smaller hole

I can certainly attest to this. Today I drilled 8 holes using a 12" auger for a small cross fence and broke 6 shear pins. Last year I drilled 50 holes around the same field with a 9" auger and didn't break any.

 

[Denwa]

.....I do everything with a 9 inch drill, yes you do have to be tighter on your tolerances but it is easier drilling a smaller hole

........ Last year I drilled 50 holes around the same field with a 9" auger and didn't break any.

No PHD experience at all here, but very interested. I've some rocks and lots of big tree roots. Obviously not drilling near a big tree would be helpful. However, IF one desires a larger hole than 9" can one chase the same hole with a larger auger with much more ease than using the larger auger for the whole operation? Would seem so, as with drilling a pilot hole in metal or wood.

If functional, would the two auger process actaualy be quicker than battling with the larger auger alone?

And, while I'm at it, any particular gear that works better w/ roots?

Seeking Wisdom,
Dennis (WA)

 

[Rancher Ed]

The 12 inch drill is working against you on this & I am sure it is the source of your shear pin problems. The larger the diameter of the drill increases the stress on the shear pins. I do everything with a 9 inch drill, yes you do have to be tighter on your tolerances but it is easier drilling a smaller hole

That would be nice, however, we are drilling the holes for corner posts and we are using old power polls that we got for free for the posts. Most of them are 12" at the base so we don't really want to go any smaller. With the rocks, the 12" auger seems to dig about a 15" hole which works well.

No PHD experience at all here, but very interested. I've some rocks and lots of big tree roots. Obviously not drilling near a big tree would be helpful. However, IF one desires a larger hole than 9" can one chase the same hole with a larger auger with much more ease than using the larger auger for the whole operation? Would seem so, as with drilling a pilot hole in metal or wood.

If functional, would the two auger process actaualy be quicker than battling with the larger auger alone?

And, while I'm at it, any particular gear that works better w/ roots?

Seeking Wisdom,
Dennis (WA)

I don't know how well this would work. If you were digging a lot of hole it might well be quicker to drill a 6" hole everywhere and then change to a 12" auger and make all the holes bigger. For just one or two holes it would take more time to change from the one auger to the other than you would save by doing it.

If you have lots of tree roots I think you best bet is to get a hydraulic PHD. This would let you spin it backwards if it caught on a root and screwed into the ground. It would also have a relief valve insted of a shear bolt for when you hit rocks or roots.

Ed

 

[Don87]

That would be nice, however, we are drilling the holes for corner posts and we are using old power polls that we got for free for the posts. Most of them are 12" at the base so we don't really want to go any smaller. With the rocks, the 12" auger seems to dig about a 15" hole which works well.



Ed

Your not using the proper size backhoe to pound the posts after drilling the smaller hole.

My BIL and I installed several hundered post by using the small post hole digger(on his JD790), then..............I held the post while he pounded them in with the Case backhoe. We also use telephone poles, just sharpened the ends with a chainsaw.

 

[Verticaltrx]

No PHD experience at all here, but very interested. I've some rocks and lots of big tree roots. Obviously not drilling near a big tree would be helpful. However, IF one desires a larger hole than 9" can one chase the same hole with a larger auger with much more ease than using the larger auger for the whole operation? Would seem so, as with drilling a pilot hole in metal or wood.

If functional, would the two auger process actaualy be quicker than battling with the larger auger alone?

And, while I'm at it, any particular gear that works better w/ roots?

Seeking Wisdom,
Dennis (WA)

It would be very hard to drill out a smaller hole with a larger auger. It would try to screw itself into the ground pretty quick. Also, it wouldn't really help as the problem is the outer portion of the cutter edge catching things. Since the outer edge is further from center with a larger dia. auger it puts more force on the shear pin.


My only success with large diameter augers in bad ground it to run at idle and keep my foot on the clutch (B3200) to gently slip it when it starts to bind. The auger is turning slow enough at idle you can catch it in time, and slip the clutch/lift up the auger a little to prevent breakage. This of course wouldn't really work on a tractor with an independent PTO and is certainly not ideal on mine. One of my next projects might be a hydraulic powered auger to mount on the loader.

 

[Andrewnewy]

First up, Phd by law here(Australia) have to have a slip clutch, and to be honest after using one like that for years I couldn't think of anything worse than having sheer pins! With a slip clutch, you can keep the rpm up, and when the auger gets caught, the clutch will slip a couple of time's then pull up the rock, the worst is roots, if you hit a big root, the auger will get stuck, but often what you can then do is just lift it and use the 3pl to break the root out. ( if your tractor is big enough)
As for augers as someone else has said, go as small as you can, the bigger the auger the more engine HP you need to move the dirt, the length also plays a factor, a long wide auger will take more HP than a short wide auger.
I have had success drilling a small hole then enlarging with a bigger auger, but it can be a bit hit and miss, if you hit a rock, or root the larger auger will skid off course

The best thing we have done lately is buy a hydraulic drive head, we mount this on our fel , this allows us to put pressure down on the auger when we are drilling, when you hit rock it just drills right through it, it's slow but haven't dug out a single hole since we got it. I'll try and find some photos .

 

[Rancher Ed]

Your not using the proper size backhoe to pound the posts after drilling the smaller hole.

My BIL and I installed several hundered post by using the small post hole digger(on his JD790), then..............I held the post while he pounded them in with the Case backhoe. We also use telephone poles, just sharpened the ends with a chainsaw.

We, unfortunatly don't have a backhoe The post are getting set in the holes and then tamped by hand.

First up, Phd by law here(Australia) have to have a slip clutch, and to be honest after using one like that for years I couldn't think of anything worse than having sheer pins! With a slip clutch, you can keep the rpm up, and when the auger gets caught, the clutch will slip a couple of time's then pull up the rock, the worst is roots, if you hit a big root, the auger will get stuck, but often what you can then do is just lift it and use the 3pl to break the root out. ( if your tractor is big enough)
As for augers as someone else has said, go as small as you can, the bigger the auger the more engine HP you need to move the dirt, the length also plays a factor, a long wide auger will take more HP than a short wide auger.
I have had success drilling a small hole then enlarging with a bigger auger, but it can be a bit hit and miss, if you hit a rock, or root the larger auger will skid off course

The best thing we have done lately is buy a hydraulic drive head, we mount this on our fel , this allows us to put pressure down on the auger when we are drilling, when you hit rock it just drills right through it, it's slow but haven't dug out a single hole since we got it. I'll try and find some photos .

Having shear pins in defiantly not all that great. We have plenty of HP, the problem is getting it to the auger without destroying the gear box or the drive shaft.:laughing: (We accidently put a grade 8 bolt in place of the shear bolt on our brush hog once and it was fine on the 30 horse tractor but when we put it on the 70 horse and then hit a rock it twisted one of the u joints on the drive shaft apart) I would love a hydraulic one but the cheap ones cost 3 to 4 times as much as we paid for the one we have. We only dig 10 to 20 holes a year so buying a really nice one is...

We shall see, I might see about changing it to a slip cluch or i might not:laughing::laughing: Even the way it is now it still beats digging hole by hand.:thumbsup:

Ed

 

[Denwa]

We, unfortunatly don't have a backhoe The post are getting set in the holes and then tamped by hand.
Ed

My neighbor (hi Jim) doesn't have a BH either. He uses his FEL to pound stakes. Seems to work just fine.

Don't know how that would work with phone pole sections however.

Dennis