Seller reneges...options?

zuiko · Apr 14, 2004

( On the telephone, he has no idea if you are a multi millionaire looking to save a couple of bucks or a tire kicker that has to beg and borrow to come up with the money and might not get all that is needed in time to close the deal.)

That's true enough... I would apply that to in person deals too. There are a lot of people whose eyes are bigger than their wallets. If you ever sell a used car you run into this all the time. They want to buy the car but they go to the bank and they find out they have no money (how could they not know this ahead of time?) or they try to get financing or borrow the money and can't.

I would never hold an item without a deposit myself, unless it was for a good friend. Even then not for very long. Something unexpected could easily happen to derail the deal even if they fully intended to go through with it. Even with the deposit I would have an agreement in writing about how long they have to come up with the rest of the dough.

Junkman · Apr 14, 2004

I would like to point out to all readers, that as I posted a reply more details were being posted by the original author. Some of these details would have altered some of my comments, but in the end, not to change my basic thoughts. The one thing that this does point out though is that there is always more to the "story" that has yet to be told and there is always the other side. I am not saying that the author deliberately withheld facts, but with additional posts, more details come to light. Like many things in life, there is more than the splash of the rock thrown into the pond. The ripples will continue for a while afterward.

CtRick · Apr 14, 2004

At least he told you the truth about selling it at a higher price. Years ago I agreed to buy a CJ5 from a "friend". I gave him a deposit and was to pick the Jeep up in a couple of days. The next day he stopped by with my deposit and told me that he had taken the Jeep out for one last romp in the woods and had "damaged" some stuff on it. He said he didn't feel right selling it to me because we were friends. After he left I thought we were the best buds ever. Imagine my surprise when I found out that he had actually sold it for more money the same day I agreed to buy it. He could've at least been honest.
I don't think what that person did to you was right but unfortunately, business is business.

Rick

GerardC · Apr 14, 2004

( You are not wise, you are wisdom! )

It's the truth! /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Buy KIOTI! Problem solved. /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

AndyM · Apr 14, 2004

Aw, there ya go again startin' trouble! 

Junkman knows I'm justing pickin' on him. He'll get back at me when I least expect it and everything will be even again.

Seriously though, not only is Junkman a wiseguy, but he has some very valuable posts, with excellent advice.

leaddog · Apr 14, 2004

Yup, I sold a s-10 once to a guy. He was going to give me a deposit but then said he would give me a check and asked if I would wait for 3 weeks until his tax rebate came back before cashing it. I said no problem I would just hold on to the truck untill it would clear and he could pick it up. He said he would call as soon as the check came and I could cash it and he would get the truck.---Well three weeks went by and I didn't hear from him so I called and THEN he said his wife didn't want him to buy the truck. So here I sat with a worthless check. I should have at least have gotten a deposit. The sorry part was right after I thought I had sold it a guy from the other side of the state stopped and wanted to give me cash for it. I told him it was sold and didn't get his number. Oh well, next time first GOOD money buys it. PERIOD
leaddog

jpr62902 · Apr 14, 2004

Legally, the problem isn't that the buyer didn't have a witness to the oral contract. The problem is that the buyer did not tender, nor did the seller accept, any consideration (value) for the promise to hold/sell the tractor. A contract without consideration is not a contract and is therefore legally unenforceable.

Now, had the buyer travelled 600 miles, only to hear that he tractor was sold, then there would be an action for detrimental reliance, or promissory estoppel. The damages would be the cost of the trip (gas hotel, etc). Wow. I still remember something from my Contracts class. /forums/images/graemlins/laugh.gif

Poncho · Apr 14, 2004

To me a deal is a deal.... I've made deals on vehicles over the phone without looking at it... drove to the dealership later that afternoon or next day and sealed the deal. My suspicion is the wife got "blamed" for selling it for more money. In selling something like that.... my wife is going to know what's going on and that I have a seller. An oral contract is binding... but the burden of proof is on the buyer. When stuff like this happens to me.... it's just viewed as it was meant to happen that way and something else is waiting for me down the road. Good luck on your search for a tractor... you'll eventually get the deal you're looking for.

GerardC · Apr 14, 2004

( Aw, there ya go again startin' trouble! 

Junkman knows I'm justing pickin' on him. He'll get back at me when I least expect it and everything will be even again.

Seriously though, not only is Junkman a wiseguy, but he has some very valuable posts, with excellent advice. )

I totally agree! Just breaking your chops /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif.
He, along with many others, are invaluable to many of us here on TBN! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

jpr62902 · Apr 14, 2004

Most states also have a Statute of Frauds pertaining to the sale of goods or services over a certain amount of $$$. Essentially, if the contract is over, say $1,000.00, it must be in writing to be enforceable. A phone conversation would not be in that circumstance.

Junkman · Apr 14, 2004

( To me a deal is a deal.... I've made deals on vehicles over the phone without looking at it... drove to the dealership later that afternoon or next day and sealed the deal. )

Am I correct in assuming that you are talking about the purchase of a new vehicle? I doubt that I, nor any one with a lick of common sense, would buy any used vehicle without first examining it. There might be some exceptions, but those would be exceptional, such as your father in laws car or some extenuating circumstances such as this.

AndyM · Apr 14, 2004

Am I correct in assuming that you are talking about the purchase of a new vehicle? I doubt that I, nor any one with a lick of common sense, would buy any used vehicle without first examining it. There might be some exceptions, but those would be exceptional, such as your father in laws car or some extenuating circumstances such as this. 

I bought a car, sight unseen, on Ebay once.
Of course it was only $300, and it was only about 25 miles away. I started the car, paid the guy, and drove it home!

Has anyone else ever make a major purchase sight unseen?

GerardC · Apr 14, 2004

( ....over the phone without looking at it... drove to the dealership later that afternoon or next day and sealed the deal...... )

"Drove to the dealership" then sealed the deal!

After you had seen what it was you sealed the deal.... paperwork can be done through postal service, fax, or e-mail. I've done it! You looked at it first, sorry. /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

MossRoad · Apr 14, 2004

If you saw it, then paid the guy, it was not sight unseen. /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

AndyM · Apr 14, 2004

If you saw it, then paid the guy, it was not sight unseen. 

But Ebay is a binding contract, and anyone honest would have gone through with the deal no metter what. Right? /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif

SteveH_CT · Apr 14, 2004

Same type of deal - More $$ - about $2400 I think - I bought a car from a guy on ebay who had an excellent rating - sight unseen...BUT - it was with the provision that I could get out of the deal if the car didn't pass my inspection once I did see it. No problems it was a wonderful car and I ended up giving it to my nephew.

Poncho · Apr 14, 2004

Yep... new car dealership. But actually there are quite a few things that are bought without someone examining them such as antique cars, furniture etc. These are not considered exceptional or extenuating... but rather the norm today... and they are done by people with lots of licks of common sense

OkeeDon · Apr 14, 2004

The problem is that the buyer did not tender, nor did the seller accept, any consideration (value) for the promise to hold/sell the tractor. A contract without consideration is not a contract and is therefore legally unenforceable.


Isn't a promise consideration? "I promise the tractor in exchange for the money"; "I promise the money in exchange for the tractor." I don't think the wording has to be that exact; "I'll sell you the tractor for $10,000"; "I agree to pay you $10,000 for the tractor." Each party has made a promise, the repective promises construe the consideration; is there not an oral contract?

GerardC · Apr 14, 2004

( ....I don't think the wording has to be that exact.... )

If you go to court, then wording is everything! /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Junkman · Apr 14, 2004

Now you have changed this from used vehicles to antique cars and furniture. Since you have upped the ante to antique cars, something that I am very experienced with, how many do you think are sold sight unseen, no pictures, without a sellers history of good faith for big dollars? I can tell you from many friends experiences, that when it comes to antique cars, it is even more difficult to purchase sight unseen than a used car. With a antique, you have no idea of what could be wrong, from the engine having been replace and being incorrect for the car to a host of other problems. I stand by my original statement. The more the $$ the more important it is to examine the item. Fraud abounds the world over and just because there are a lot of good and honest people on TBN, that doesn't mean that there might not be some bad apples in the bunch. I don't believe that most of the people of TBN would send money to someone that they didn't know to purchase a expensive tractor that they have never seen. The same goes for a used car. If you have done so and haven't gotten burned, consider yourself lucky. Keep doing what you have been doing successfully and I am certain that one day you will bemoaning some bad deal on these forums also as a result.