Sanity Check - Kioti

borderm3 · Apr 17, 2019

Hi all,

I have been reading here for a little while, first time posting. I purchased a ~2.5 acre foreclosure that sets on a grade that is roughly 4 time deep as it is wide. The deep runs along the grade, e.g. I drive up my driveway to the front of my house. I have a blacktop driveway thats fairly steep, thus far I have been plowing and salting it in the winter with a Yamaha Wolverine side by side that I bought in hopes to do estate maintenance work and have some fun with. Two years later, it's depreciating like crazy and I have only used it for plowing and salting. I am looking to sell it and purchase a tractor to take care of bunch of things around the place. I need to dig a rather large (to me) retaining wall, about 5 foot high and 100-150 feet wide, plow snow, remove some tree stumps, dig drainage, dig a 10' x 8' x 8' area, grade where the retaining wall is, and perhaps clear out some wooded area to prepare a foundation for a garage at some point (wishful thinking).

I am looking at the following machines all with the loader and backhoe, below are the prices I got over the phone, without any negotiations:
Loader and Tractor

CK2610hst 18,400
CK3510se 22,100
CK4010hst 22,500

Backhoe is 7,500

All these machines have the same GPM hydraulics, will I notice any difference in digging between them? It seems like the more powerful tractors have more responsive hydraulics, but maybe this is just in my head.
Will I kick myself in the butt if I don't get a factory cab? The dealer installed cabs don't look like they are NOT built as well, does anyone have any input on this? I live in central PA and it gets cold here.
If I find a few years down the road, I no longer need the tractor, will any one of these be likely to have better resale? I'm being told the bigger tractors have better resale.

Am I crazy for wanting to buy one? Being completely honest, part of it is the fun factor.

Thanks so much for everyone's help

BoylermanCT · Apr 17, 2019

All 3 are from the same series tractor, CK10, and all weigh the same with the same general dimensions. Seems like you are getting more HP as you move up models, but is anything else different? Do they have the same loaders? Any difference in lift capacity?

I am a fan of hydrostatic transmissions, especially for loader work and plowing or snowblowing. So I would forget the CK3510SE. They do sell a CK3510HST.

If you have the money, get the 40HP. You won't regret it. If you want to save $4K, the 26HP should do everything you want to do with it. I have a 28hp and have never wished I had more HP. But more HP will let you do the work in less time.

Let us know what you decide. Good luck!

prof fate · Apr 17, 2019

Above is correct.

Teh SE has more options - tilt wheel, horn, floor mat, telescoping 3 pt arms, cruise, link pedal. I got a 'plain' ck3510 hst and added floor mat, link, cruise, horn, loaded tires, 2 rear remotes all for 695, total was just over 20k last june (before financing and insurance.) 40hp would have been nice but 5hp...?

I was quoted $7500 for the hoe. You'll need that with your list of projects.

Cab..5k or so, includes heat and a/c, lighting.

I'm in western pa on a horse farm - gotta hay and plow snow too.I've got to dress warm to be outside anyway...don't see the merit of a cab for snow plowing for an hour here and there 5 times a winter..

My main use has been loader work, dirt moving (box blade, back blade) and brush hogging 20 acres once a month. Got a 3pt finish mower to add 2 acres to that this year. A cab for the brush hogging would be nice - cooler and cleaner, quieter. But most of the time I do it in the evening..so not so hot and sunny anyway.

I'm on/off the tractor a LOT - gates to pastures, changing implements or settings on them, etc. A door on a cab would be one more thing to deal with.

Extra HP is handy for hills and PTO work - bigger mower or tiller mainly. Most are 1' per 5hp - so a 25hp tractor will have 20hp at the PTO, 4' implement. 35hp has 30 at the PTO, so 6', and 40 will be 35, so 7'.

Resale...they're all about the same in 10 or 15 years if in good condition. And they all lose 10-20% as soon as they go from new to used - as a buyer I want a discount for buying used, a dealer can't sell used for as much as new so has to pay lower yet on a trade in. Can't say any brand holds up better than another, and some cost several grand more up front for no more usefulness or reliability.

rScotty · Apr 17, 2019

borderm3 said:
Hi all,

I need to dig a rather large (to me) retaining wall, about 5 foot high and 100-150 feet wide, plow snow, remove some tree stumps, dig drainage, dig a 10' x 8' x 8' area, grade where the retaining wall is, and perhaps clear out some wooded area to prepare a foundation for a garage at some point (wishful thinking).

Am I crazy for wanting to buy one? Being completely honest, part of it is the fun factor.

Thanks so much for everyone's help

Yes, you have that right. A large part of the compact tractor popularity is simply the fun factor.
It's a neat hobby as well as a way to get things done....and more healthy exercise than you might think at first.
You will maximize all those benefits with the right machine.

Looking at your projects the big thing that jumps out is the quantity of dirt to be moved, and also the slope. Slope is particularly important in compact tractors.

If it were my choice, I'd at least take a look at Kubota's purpose built compact TLB Line. For new ones, that would be the B26, L47, and M62. I'd say that the best buy right now is on low hour used L39s. Some have aftermarket cabs. I see at least one L39 with 600 hrs for sale online with a nice cab.

Compared with compact tractors, compact TLBs are built heavier, have a lower center of gravity, more of that important slope stability, stronger loader & hydraulics. They are made more for working dirt and rock than for pulling agriculature implements. However, the biggest immediate difference you will notice between TLBs (Tractor/Loader/Backhoes) versusTractors is that TLBs are made so that the backhoe is primary to the tractor and it is detatched to mount the 3pt hitch. On Tractors, the 3pt hitch is the dominant attachment and the backhoe attaches either to it or in place of it.

The only downside is that compact TLBs tend to cost more than compact tractors - although not by so much when you add up all the options to make a tractor do the same work. To compensate, resale also tends to be higher for TLBs.

Not saying you should go that way; though we did and like what we got. But you might check them out just to know what is available. Or rent one for a week...... That's a real good test and lots of rental yards have L39s. I think it is a shame that only Kubota makes compact TLBs. Would love to see some competition.
good luck,
rScotty

fried1765 · Apr 17, 2019

borderm3 said:
Hi all,

I have been reading here for a little while, first time posting. I purchased a ~2.5 acre foreclosure that sets on a grade that is roughly 4 time deep as it is wide. The deep runs along the grade, e.g. I drive up my driveway to the front of my house. I have a blacktop driveway thats fairly steep, thus far I have been plowing and salting it in the winter with a Yamaha Wolverine side by side that I bought in hopes to do estate maintenance work and have some fun with. Two years later, it's depreciating like crazy and I have only used it for plowing and salting. I am looking to sell it and purchase a tractor to take care of bunch of things around the place. I need to dig a rather large (to me) retaining wall, about 5 foot high and 100-150 feet wide, plow snow, remove some tree stumps, dig drainage, dig a 10' x 8' x 8' area, grade where the retaining wall is, and perhaps clear out some wooded area to prepare a foundation for a garage at some point (wishful thinking).

I am looking at the following machines all with the loader and backhoe, below are the prices I got over the phone, without any negotiations:
Loader and Tractor

CK2610hst 18,400

CK3510se 22,100

CK4010hst 22,500

Backhoe 7,500

All these machines have the same GPM hydraulics, will I notice any difference in digging between them? It seems like the more powerful tractors have more responsive hydraulics, but maybe this is just in my head.

Will I kick myself in the butt if I don't get a factory cab? The dealer installed cabs don't look like they are NOT built as well, does anyone have any input on this? I live in central PA and it gets cold here.

If I find a few years down the road, I no longer need the tractor, will any one of these be likely to have better resale? I'm being told the bigger tractors have better resale.

Am I crazy for wanting to buy one? Being completely honest, part of it is the fun factor.

Thanks so much for everyone's help

Suggest you enter your general location in your profile.
Someone here may be able to comment on a particularly good (or bad) dealer in your local area, wherever that may be..

MaineGuy1 · Apr 17, 2019

I have a Kubota with no cab, it was cold in the winter but I dressed for it. I just purchased a cabbed tractor and now move snow at 10 below with just a T shirt. It is also nice to listen to music while I perform snow removal activities. The Ck3510se HC on Tractorhouse goes for 28,700 with no backhoe. A cab adds about 5k to the price. I have friends with dealers installed cabs and they are not as nice as the OEM cabs.

cphilip · Apr 17, 2019

The 2610 has no EPA regeneration emissions related stuff... the rest of those models you listed do.

LS Tractor Owner · Apr 17, 2019

If you can get the CK2610 WITH THE BACKHOE for $18,400, as you stated, BUY IT !
I just saw the lowest price for one with a backhoe is at $24,700. I think all those prices are without a hoe.

LS Tractor Owner · Apr 17, 2019

Sorry, my bad reading... First you said "all with loader and backhoe", but then said "tractor and loader"

chim · Apr 17, 2019

What part of PA are you in? I don't know much about Kioti tractors but they do have a devoted following. I shopped for used tractors in late 2018 and looked at a Kioti. It was a nice tractor, but wasn't in great shape. It was a brand I've considered when shopping the past two times.

I would say that a factory cab really gets the edge in my opinion because of the factory A/C. I built a cab for a Kubota and it has been great in the cold weather. In hot weather I can lift the doors off and it's better than baking in the sun. We recently bought a used Kubota with a factory cab and it's been wonderful. I'm looking forward to being out of the dust and pollen the RFM can kick up.