Snow Equipment Owning/Operating Questions on hydraulic blower on FEL

[Chaostamer]

We moved to our property in 2007; by mid Jan 2008 we found out the value of a PTO run snowblower (paid for itself in a matter of days). The problem was our Mahindra is open station and going backwards was not fun. In 2014 we bought a tractor that can lift the larger square bales to help insure we could find good hay. We bought the 6040 which has a cab but has a shuttle shift (not HST like the Mahindra). Unfortunately laughing the width was 6+ feet and our snow blower was only 5 feet. We pieced together a system to run a QuickAttach 2010x hydraulic unit (we being a friend of mine that lives 5 hours away). I now deal with snow in style. However, I have some learning to do on this equipment and hoping you all can help.

Between blowing and fresh snow, I have been on the unit every day for the last five days. This more than tripled my hours with this equipment. I found a few things that really bothered me and am hoping to fix. Here is how I generally run the system. I crank the RPM to 2500 and put the tractor in low-1 or low-2. I snowblow mostly downhill but will run back uphill on the returns. I have to clutch the unit when I get into heavy or deep snow and the blower will really bog down (something that just didn't happen with the PTO driven unit). When this is the case, the discharge is only thrown 3 feet or so and the pressure on the hydraulics jumps from ~1000 to 2500+. If I don't have drifts or the snow isn't wet, I usually have no problem with the speed and the distance of the snow being thrown is 20+ feet.

Here are my questions:
1. Is the up and down PSI normal for this type of set up or do I have something wrong with my pump?
2. If my pump is okay, what if anything am I doing wrong or have setup wrong that might cause the unit to bog down so bad?
3. What modifications would you suggest to optimize performance? I saw a video of a guy on TBN clear a 9+ foot drift with no problem with a unit on the FEL.

Any help you all can give me would be much appreciated. I have been trying to learn from reading posts but I have not had luck finding these specific issues.

AND, Merry Christmas everyone!

 

[lungdoc]

What sort of hydraulic flows do you have? Any specs, any photos? I have a new MK Martin 86" blower on a 6060 Kubota. Haven't had snow to use it but almost identical to the setup in their video (5740 used there). Their specs are here MK Martin | Loader Mount. Their power pack runs 30 GPM at 2500 PSI and I suspect that will be the main determining spec.

 

[JCByrd24]

Up and down PSI is very normal. The pressure in the system is related to how much resistance there is. If you lift a light load with a loader the pressure is less than if you lift a heavy load, etc. Is your tractor engine bogging down as well or just the hydraulic system? Have you verified everything is in good working order and spins freely? What is your flow and your hose size?

 

[Chaostamer]

Is your tractor engine bogging down as well or just the hydraulic system? Have you verified everything is in good working order and spins freely? What is your flow and your hose size?

The tractor is bogging down as well when I get into heavy stuff. Everything is working freely when not under the load. I have 22 GPM from a 50T033-LTASB Cross Gear Pump. Specs on the pump are: Flow @540 rpm - 20.8 gpm * Flow @ 1000 rpm - 38.6 gpm * Rotation - Left Hand (from 50T033-LTASB Cross Gear Pump - Northern Hydraulics.).

I am not sure on the hose size (will get pics up in a few).

 

[Chaostamer]

lungdoc - good suggestions! In my insomnia I didn't even think of the specs or pics. Here are the blower specs:

Model 2010 79
Part Number 900964
Stage 2
Width of Cut 79
Cutting Height 29
Cutting Edge 5/8 x 6 bolt-on
Auger Diameter 16 open flight
Fan Diameter 20 4-blade
Chute Rotation Hydraulic 270ｰ
Pressure Relief Fan/Auger
Casting Distance Up to 30
Shipping Weight 859 lb.
Mounting Plate Universal
Hoses Included
Hydraulic Flow?? 11-25 GPM
Operating Pressure 2500-3500 PSI

Also, I am working on pics but the system isn't working with me.

 

[Chaostamer]

Pictures at last (unfortunately the wait didn't help the quality.

 

[oldnslo]

You have discovered the sad truth that hydraulic drive systems are far less efficient that mechanical PTO systems. Mechanical probably 95% of the input power is available for work while on hydraulic drives from 60 - 90 % depending on the quality of the components. 90% is a very good closed loop hydrostatic system with minimal pressure drop in the lines.

What pressure is required to run the blower under no load? You state the pressure jumps from 1000 PSI to 2500 PSI. Is the 1000 PSI with little or no snow going through the unit? If yes that is over a 1/3 of your power being used to just turn the blower.

Not trying to poo-poo hydraulic drives but some consideration needs to be given in hose sizes, quick disconnects (typically very high pressure drop items) fittings, motor style (some require 500 + PSI just to turn under no load) etc. Pressure drop is wasted power so the lower this is the more power you can use in the blower.

If you want this blower to perform at it's best I would suggest taking a few pressure readings at different points to where your losses are. I.e. at the pump outlet, at the inlet and outlet of the motor. These will give you an idea f what the losses are in the different parts of the system.

good luck

 

[Chaostamer]

Thanks oldnslo! I knew this was the case but your post here helped me understand it in a new way. If I could put a mechanical driven system on my fel I would in a heartbeat. Trouble is I need my FEL for feeding hay twice a week and dealing with the mechanical systems that go on the front would be too troublesome if not make it impossible to feed. If anyone knows of another system that I am missing, please let me know.

 

[grsthegreat]

My system puts out 15 gpm at 3,000 psi. It uses 3/4" hoses between powerpack and blower. I generally run in 2nd range but have hydrostatic drive.

I can blast thru some real deep drifts. I actually powered thre some 24-28" snow yesterday making a path thru my arena. Did a wonderful job. I dont think it would have been so good if i had a standard shift tranny because i can really control distance of throw beautifully with the hydrostatic unit.

 

[leonz]

You have discovered the sad truth that hydraulic drive systems are far less efficient that mechanical PTO systems. Mechanical probably 95% of the input power is available for work while on hydraulic drives from 60 - 90 % depending on the quality of the components. 90% is a very good closed loop hydrostatic system with minimal pressure drop in the lines.

What pressure is required to run the blower under no load? You state the pressure jumps from 1000 PSI to 2500 PSI. Is the 1000 PSI with little or no snow going through the unit? If yes that is over a 1/3 of your power being used to just turn the blower.

Not trying to poo-poo hydraulic drives but some consideration needs to be given in hose sizes, quick disconnects (typically very high pressure drop items) fittings, motor style (some require 500 + PSI just to turn under no load) etc. Pressure drop is wasted power so the lower this is the more power you can use in the blower.

If you want this blower to perform at it's best I would suggest taking a few pressure readings at different points to where your losses are. I.e. at the pump outlet, at the inlet and outlet of the motor. These will give you an idea f what the losses are in the different parts of the system.

good luck

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Well as you have discovered you have gone down in flames !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

UGH!! Now down to business;

The only way and I mean the only way your going to improve
the efficiency of your system is to invest in a vane pump and
replace the gear pump.

Then you have to replace the gear motor with a vane motor on
the snoiw blower attachment

They sell these things and they should not be selling them because they are limited by the

1. pump displacement
2. motor displacement
3. snow pack settling/compaction
4. plugging and snow buildup
5 open auger
6. poor design


They build these bloody things and tell everyone they wil work in every snow condition and they lie through their teeth. I wont hesitate to teel some that even with all their wondeful brochures in their hands because the issue is physics plain and simple.




Since your saddled with this one trick mule:

The only way to improve is to invest in Vane Pump for the Power Take Off and a vane motor for the snow caster.
Short of cutting toothed edges in the cross augers to cut the snow into smaller chunks to break the snow up faster I see no other option short of convereting it to a sensible single stage snowblower.

I would rather see you invest in rear mount with an extended chute-they wont plug and you wont go snow blind from blowing snow.

I am sorry your dealing with this ,and I am sorry your dealer did not help you deal with it the right way.

A rear mounted snow caster with an extended chute is a lot less work.