pull type grader

[Renze]

thats true, the tandem with center pivot also halves the bumps.

For road graders, the weight is 2/3 in the back. the blade is positioned in a way so that when applying downforce on the blade, weight is taken off the grader wheels equally: lifting the front will cause it to slide aside into the ditch, lifting the rear will give traction problems.

 

[Knotbored]

I have a box scraper suspended way back behind my small Kabota and have an exageration of this triangulation problem.
When a front tire goes into a 4" pothole the scraper raises six inches, onto a 4" bump or rock the scaper digs a 5" hole.
I need to add a skid or wheels to keep the blade closer to the average grade.

 

[Dirtnut]

yes u are right. the box scraper needs wheels,& behind it. the box scraper needs to be as independant of the tractor as possible. float on its own.

 

[Tractors4u]

yes u are right. the box scraper needs wheels,& behind it. the box scraper needs to be as independant of the tractor as possible. float on its own.

If you let the box all the way down, it will be floating and not be affected by the front wheels going up or down.

I know the response will be, "but I am trying to lay a finish grade or spread dirt/gravel to a certain depth". If this is the case then the proper amount of prep work wasn't done. Lower the box down and fill/fix the holes and then raise the box up.

 

[Dirtnut]

you are right. with a box scraper general use is scraping,pulling,leveling dirt over short distances,that is what i use mine for. that is why i built my grader i have over a mile of dirt road to grade i needed something faster. at 7' wide & 1000+lbs i can cut up to an 1" in wet conditons, with the blade angled i can make 4 continuous pass 2up&2down without stopping because the blade never gets full like a box scraper. then i revers direction and grade everything from the crown to the shoulder in 4 more passes. sorry i get to babbling . any ways if you look at my hitch hook up i practically eliminated the tractor wheel problem to. because my 3pt draw bar also turns in the lift arms when the tractor goes over a bump the draw bar turns with the grader to a point, big bumps matter like you said not enough prep work.

 

[ovrszd]

Dirtnut, not sure if your tractor has rear hydraulic remotes, but if so, wouldn't a cylinder operated assembly on the rear wheels of your grader be sweet??? That would allow more vertical blade movement and would give better blade control.

I too run a grader, JD770D, it has a 241" wheelbase (measured from front axle to center of rear tandem drive) with the 14' blade forward of center at 101" from front axle. On a grader the blade is located as far to the rear as it can be and still allow complete 360 degree blade rotation and give the operator maximum blade visibility. If located rear of center both of those would suffer dramatically.

Overall, blade control and effect would have probably also been maximized with your table centered on the beam. Would have also increased your blade vertical control. Good job on the build though, appears to be bullet proof!!!

A modern grader is a mechanical marvel to watch. It has the ability to offset front wheel side draft by utilizing the rear steer and placing the rear tandems toward the tow side of the angled blade. I can take a full cut of hard pack soil without sliding the front tires sideways.

With an overall machine length of 375" it has a turning radius of 276". Pretty amazing that it will turn in a circle smaller than it's length!!! For it's size it is an amazingly manueverable piece of equipment.

Here's a picture of my new baby!!! Ain't she cute!!!

 

[Dirtnut]

yes i have duel rear remotes & will be utilizing them this spring,power angle & tilt. wanted to use it awhile to make sure it would stay together & work before adding cylinders. i am more than impressed with it. i kept my blade back towards the rear more so i could turn 90 deg without hitting blade & if i ever get a bigger tractor. Amen on the explanation of a grader. that is a beauty but u need to get the paint off the blade to call it a grader.

 

[sandman2234]

The theory's decribed here have other uses in life. Remember all those cabover tractor trailer trucks? Know why they aren't around anymore? Cause the driver sat on top of the wheels, unlike the "Longnose" trucks, where he was in between. The bouncing of the driver is the same as the bouncing of the blade. It just rides better with a long wheelbase, especially if your in the middle of them.
Short wheelbases have their uses, but a jeep turns over a lot faster than my extended cab with 8' bed, and it isn't all the height doing it, although it does add to the problem.
David from jax

 

[Renze]

The theory's decribed here have other uses in life. Remember all those cabover tractor trailer trucks? Know why they aren't around anymore? Cause the driver sat on top of the wheels, unlike the "Longnose" trucks, where he was in between. The bouncing of the driver is the same as the bouncing of the blade. It just rides better with a long wheelbase, especially if your in the middle of them.

In Europe, 98% of the semitrailer trucks are cab over engine type. The better manoeuverabiltity outweighs the importance of looks and image..
Oh, and bouncing of the driver ?? European trucks ride on air... Many have optional cab air suspension too...

Actually its an amusing observation, that America is far ahead of Europe in the use of lightweight aluminium in trailers (though fuel costs half as much in America) yet they still seem to bounce around mostly on leaf springs...
Perhaps someone should set up an exchange program: European Air suspension technology for American lightweight aluminium construction technology, to everybodies benefit.. ???

Short wheelbases have their uses, but a jeep turns over a lot faster than my extended cab with 8' bed, and it isn't all the height doing it, although it does add to the problem.
David from jax

True, but the long wheelbase jeep can hang up with its belly on a hill top...

 

[sandman2234]

The last time I drove a truck with spring suspensions was in the early 90's. Most of todays road trucks have air ride suspension, air ride cabs and air ride seats. The truck I drove today had a broken air ride seat, and I figured out just how spoiled I was! Even the last couple of cabovers I drove were air ride everything, and they don't compare to a hood with the same options.
I understand about the cornering of a cabover, but some of the shorter wheelbase hoods will come close to the turning radius of a cabover. The placement of the cab has nothing to do with the turning radius, just the wheel base and with equal wheelbases, the turning radius is the same. You can get a shorter wheelbase in a cabover, though.
We would be happy to send you a few aluminum framed trailers but your going to have to pay for them, as we already have the air technology. Sorry...
David from jax

 

[Renze]

We would be happy to send you a few aluminum framed trailers but your going to have to pay for them, as we already have the air technology. Sorry...
David from jax

that makes 1-0 for you...

Last month there was something in a trucking magazine that said something about leaf springs and american trucks.. they must have been wrong then...

 

[sandman2234]

There are a lot of trailer still out there with springs, but just as many with air bags, so maybe that is what they were talking about?
David from jax

 

[Berniep]

Ok now we are in a thread about air ride suspension on roads trucks
But I gotta weigh in here.
The major reason we don't have air ride on ALL our new trailers is cost. It costs more to buy and it costs more to maintain. Every carrier has a different scenario but for many the ride benifits on cargo damage do not offset this added expense.
Thats the main reason I haven't put guage wheels on my blade, I don't need the hassle and expense of the extra parts, just takes me a litttle longer to get the drive smooth.

 

[sandman2234]

I think we ought to see how dirtnut is doing on his project...
David from jax

 

[Renze]

There are a lot of trailer still out there with springs, but just as many with air bags, so maybe that is what they were talking about?
David from jax

You might be right, as i think i've read it in the magazine of the Dutch organisation of trailer and bodyworks builders.

Indeed 99.9% of the European trailers is air suspension. The advantages of smoother ride, constant ride height regardless the load, and because its all integrated in the ABS and EBS/ESP systems that come standard on most full size trailers.
For us it saves a couple of hours assembly time when installing air suspension with EBS/ESP and a brake force adjuster sensing the bellow pressure, instead of a leafs, and a spring loaded arm that senses the ride height to adjust the brake pressure to the actual axle load.
The system itself is a bit more expensive, but EBS/ESP has less connections to make and is installed in half the time than a normal ABS system.

I am in the small drivers license trailer business: We had only 1 request for leaf springs this year, which was for a field drainage company who pulled a trailer full of tiles behind the tracked drainlaying machine through knee deep mud...

Anyways, we're hi-jacking the thread, so lets get back to the road grader