Property Value/Appraisals RANT

[LWG]

Some refuse to acknowledge the reality or stay ignorant by believing the talking points. Unfortunately, these same people vote.

Which explains why we're in the trouble we are.

 

[vtsnowedin]

I have no idea where your 60% number comes from but I did not say what you purport. Even in the city of Seattle the number of folks in walking distance is relatively small. There are park and rides that folks drive to to even get close to transit. Your response and the words you chose prove my statement about the differences between east and west. They are as large as the differences between conservative and liberal and have no correlation between.

The 60% comes from a goggle search of Washington state and Wiki. And yes I realize that things are set up in western urban areas so that cars are almost mandatory and that the mindset east and west is markedly different. I'm not arguing with that but it cost just as much to drive a mile in the west as it dose in the east or nearly so and rising fuel prices will drive us all to using less of it.

 

[two_bit_score]

Not to diverge from the OP original intent but...

It is always interesting to note opinions and experiences of those that live back east versus those that live out west. Probably less than 0.5% of the homes fit the category of walking distance to transit terminals and there is probably not a single member of this site that would live in the locations that fit those homes. The smallest state out here would fit the size of 5 of the east coast states and most of the eastern seaboard could fit inside one of the states and definitely inside three of them. The concepts that eastern residents have are so much different that west of the Mississippi states. It is a difference that is fascinating to observe.

I've been observing the same thing.

Its very interesting.

 

[jonnyc1999]

David, I just read that you are commuting 160 miles a day on your truck, and since we have the same truck I KNOW it must hurt. I was doing something similar and made the decision to spend a few thousand dollars and buy a reliable commuter car. My Miata gets over 30mpg and has less than 100k on the odometer. I've already made up the $2400 vehicle cost in the first few months of ownership, and putting $25 worth of gas into the tank sure beats $70!!!!

As far as your housing situation, have you considered having the kids stay in a camper/portable housing for a few years? Building something like a small guesthouse might give your girls a little bit of freedom to make your housing situation work while also providing a novelty of "living on their own". Sort of like having a treehouse! In our visits together it seemed like your house needed a gradual rebuild from the ground up based on the corners that the original owner cut (roofing, lots of angle iron use/poor craftsmanship). I don't know the numbers, but I've heard of people PAYING to have their mobile homes hauled off from trailer parks and such. It might be a cost effective solution to free up more space short-term.

Keep the faith David, things will be looking up in time!

 

[MossflowerWoods]

David, I just read that you are commuting 160 miles a day on your truck...

Keep the faith David, things will be looking up in time!

Jon!!!

How are you my friend!

I could not go out and buy a commuter car while I was trying to get the remodel approved, maybe now that will change...

We shall see...

Hey I just ordered the stuff to finish the wooden pasture fence, $2000 of posts, poplar bds, and 12' gates... When its done it will be more than 1000' of 3 board...

Work invites will come out shortly :thumbsup:

David

 

[buckeyefarmer]

I don't disagree but many people completely underestimate the costs of building or owning their own home.

Agree, but I also know a lot of people that rent and pay a whole lot more than what my house payment is.

I've been keeping an eye on property prices in central VA (shenandoah valley), and they seem to be staying steady. I haven't seen much of a drop in land prices the last couple years.

 

[dave1949]

Agree, but I also know a lot of people that rent and pay a whole lot more than what my house payment is.

I've been keeping an eye on property prices in central VA (shenandoah valley), and they seem to be staying steady. I haven't seen much of a drop in land prices the last couple years.

Listed prices have been steady here too, but not much land is being sold. I see the same parcels listed month after month after month with the same prices. I figure people are sitting on it waiting for the market to improve.

 

[300UGUY]

Listed prices have been steady here too, but not much land is being sold. I see the same parcels listed month after month after month with the same prices. I figure people are sitting on it waiting for the market to improve.

We have a couple of customers that are realtors, and they are telling me that they are short of listings - at selling prices. Basically, a lot of folks are still uderwater on mortgages, and are waiting until prices come up. Might be a long wait, prices dropped here by 40 to 50%, and are increasing by 1 to 3% per year.

 

[dave1949]

We have a couple of customers that are realtors, and they are telling me that they are short of listings - at selling prices. Basically, a lot of folks are still uderwater on mortgages, and are waiting until prices come up. Might be a long wait, prices dropped here by 40 to 50%, and are increasing by 1 to 3% per year.

It probably will be a long wait. A lot of the potential land buyers in this area are folks from out of state looking for a site for a second home, vacation/get away home, snowmobile/hunting/atv base, etc. I don't think very many look at it as full-time retirement location. So, it is a market driven by wants, not needs, basically. People are holding back on the nice to have "wants" while they repair their retirement savings or whatever.

 

[newbury]

David -
Long thread but hang in there.

Appraisals should be called assesments because the first three letters would more accurately describe those that make them.

I have two "places" to park my vehicles at my retirement home:



The carport pictured here, appraised at $9,000. $15/square foot, with bricks laid in sand for a floor.



The 5,500 sq ft of warehouse, which includes a 1 bedroom apartment of about 800 sq ft, with full bath and kitchen. All wired, lit etc. All with good thick concrete floor.
Which appraised at about $10,000. Or less than $2/sq ft. II've been told the concree floor was worth $15/sq ft

In addition the "appraiser" had the house on 2.5 acres, when the county, and the survey showed 3.5 acres.

And amazingly enough the appraisal came in $100 above what we requested.

I strongly suspect the appraiser just fudged numbers around.

I'm sure there are honest hard working appraisers out there. But some aren't.

Also, as others have written you might want to look at "separating" some of the land to go with the house. Navy Federal drowned on loaning for more than a few acres.

And to move the clutter from your house look into 40' long Hi-Cube shipping containers.
I've seen some nice barns made with 2 containers separated by a bit with a roof put between them.

That way you have 2 large storage areas.

/edit - And take care getting loans - DOD is in for some major cuts, just like they were pre 911 when Rumsfeld was about to cut. Few remember:

The proposal to reduce manpower—part of a congressionally mandated defense review due next month—calls for the Army to trim as many as 2.8 of its 10 divisions, or about 56,000 troops. The Air Force would lose as many as 16 of its 61 fighter squadrons, according to the plan, and the Navy would drop one or two of its 12 carrier battle groups, defense officials said. Mr. Rumsfeld and top generals of each military service were briefed on the recommendations for the first time yesterday.

from http://www.maebrussell.com/Articles and Notes/Rumsfeld Aides Seek Cuts in Armed Forces.html
the WSJ, Aug 8, 2001.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

David -
Long thread but hang in there.

Appraisals should be called assesments because the first three letters would more accurately describe those that make them.

Also, as others have written you might want to look at "separating" some of the land to go with the house. Navy Federal drowned on loaning for more than a few acres.

And to move the clutter from your house look into 40' long Hi-Cube shipping containers.
I've seen some nice barns made with 2 containers separated by a bit with a roof put between them.

And take care getting loans - DOD is in for some major cuts...

Newbury,

I'm hanging in there... Just really needed to vent my spleen over how ridiculous this whole thing is...

1 - I'd LOVE to BUY a couple Connex Hi-Cube containers. Renting them is ridiculously expensive, and I've not figured out how/where to buy them...
2 - I'm open to subdividing the property, but the note currently covers the whole place, I suspect I'd need to pay off what I'm subdividing, right?
3 - I know, and I firmly believe, the Feds need to severely cut spending. I'd rather they cut elsewhere than DoD & IC, but... Yes I am a sales guy calling on an "agency", and even if they cut deeply, there will still be need for my job (I will just have at least one really bad commission year). I am very cautious taking out loans. Almost exclusively for real estate...

I appreciate the advice, and I must say your appraisal story is FAR WORSE than mine! Outright ridiculous in fact...

Thank you sir.
David

 

[MossflowerWoods]

The wife and I spent LOTS of time talking yesterday and venting on both sides about some of the stuff that is killing us in this house situation, and exploring various ideas. We are still mid discussion, I suspect we will not make final decisions for a while, but I suspect we are closing in on an idea that should work. I'll keep y'all posted as the dust settles...

I appreciate all of the support, advice, an even the judgements to a certain extent here on TBN. I learn lots from all of you who are ahead of me in this journey, and from different perspectives wether I agree or not.

God Bless you all.
Be well,
David

 

[tkappeler]

What bank are you approaching? I don't need the name, just saying that if you are going to the larger ones, this is not uncommon. Try to approach the smaller, local bank, especially one that is more likely to hold onto the mortgage and not sell it off at the settlement table. This is what I did for my construction loan for the new home and it made all the difference.

Good luck.

 

[Vtnewbie]

Originally Posted by Furu "Not to diverge from the OP original intent but...

It is always interesting to note opinions and experiences of those that live back east versus those that live out west. Probably less than 0.5% of the homes fit the category of walking distance to transit terminals and there is probably not a single member of this site that would live in the locations that fit those homes. The smallest state out here would fit the size of 5 of the east coast states and most of the eastern seaboard could fit inside one of the states and definitely inside three of them. The concepts that eastern residents have are so much different that west of the Mississippi states. It is a difference that is fascinating to observe."


Lived out west for many years, including 6 years in Lacey, Washington; now live in Vermont. Your point is valid in some respects but not all. In the Everret/Seattle/Olympia corridor, the roads are more developed and far more public transportation is available, than in the rural Northeast (Maine, New Hampshire and Vermont). Your chances of living near a transit terminal are much higher in western Washington.

 

[MossflowerWoods]

What bank are you approaching? I don't need the name, just saying that if you are going to the larger ones, this is not uncommon. Try to approach the smaller, local bank, especially one that is more likely to hold onto the mortgage and not sell it off at the settlement table. This is what I did for my construction loan for the new home and it made all the difference.

Good luck.

Small local bank, just like you describe...

 

[Loren49]

Just thought I'd add my 2 cents. I've read much of this and but am confident I don't really know your situation. The "closer to desired" home you feel you need may bring some unintended consequences. The first being more debt and higher taxes. I feel there are advantages for children who share a rooom. I have a friend whose 3 daughters have shared a modest sized room for years and they are great kids. (one now a junior in college).

There may be some advantage to waiting until you have sold your other house(s). I don't know your daughter's ages but at some point they will move on and you will have a much larger house than you may want.

It does appear that the first land appraisal was bad which has left you with the problem of not being able to borrow more money.

Best wishes to you and your family!

Loren

ps: I know you'll make a good decision....you did with your tractor:laughing:

 

[KYErik]

Hey I just ordered the stuff to finish the wooden pasture fence, $2000 of posts, poplar bds, and 12' gates... When its done it will be more than 1000' of 3 board...

Work invites will come out shortly :thumbsup:

David

Have you considered finishing part of the attic yourself? Construction (framing, plumbing, drywall and electrical work) isn't rocket science. If you already have a stairway leading to the attic, $2-3K would likely be enough for materials to modestly finish at least one room of your attic (you would just need to cover the floor with low end carpet). Finishing part of the attic on your own would help to alleviate your crowding issue and possibly increase the appraised value because you would have more finished square feet.

I knew next to nothing about construction 14 years ago when my dad and I began building my 1500 square foot 1.5 story home. My dad had done some of his own remodeling, but never a whole house. I read a few books, looked up the plumbing codes (it still took 2 tries for me to pass the plumbing inspection), but I saved a ton of money and increased the appraised value by $30K more than I had in construction materials.

Once you have an area like your attic dried in, you can move at your own pace. Yes it can be a messy/dusty and consumes A LOT of time, but that is the tradeoff for saving lots of money. If you keep an eye on craigslist- there are mechanical drywall lifts that allow a person to hang drywall alone (you still need a helper to load the next sheet onto the lift).

Whatever you decide, I wish you the best.

 

[dave1949]

Shipping Containers for Sale in Norfolk, VA - Storage and Shipping Containers for Sale | ConGlobal Industries

 

[ultrarunner]

I will never understand the how and whys of lending...

It seems like folks with a proven track record can be easily disqualified because they don't fit the mold... there is little discretion left anymore.

Maybe it is because the lenders for the most part are not really lenders... instead they are processors, paper shufflers, with the only goal of packaging a product for sale.

I'm still old enough when Banking was more personal... my brothers and I always worked. I have been paying into Social Security since age 12.

The local Savings and Loan treated us like adults when we went in to open accounts to deposit our paychecks and our parents didn't even bank there... heck, they gave my 16 year old brother a credit card with a $200 limit without any adult and still remember the branch manager saying the bank and he peronally was going out on a limb because being a minor, the bank had no recourse if my brother decieded not to bay and this was in the late 70's... My brother has done millions in business with them to this day because he remembers how they treated him 35 years ago.

Today, there doesn't seem to be many that can make a decision unless it is no...

I don't fit the boxes either and in many ways, it has made me stronger by forcing me to make my own way.

I'm certain you will find a way and feel free to vent anytime... I know I have and the advice here has been very helpful...

 

[sdkubota]

I will state it again, the government has placed severe restrictions on banks and who they can lend too. If you want a boogyman...it's Big Daddy Gubnut screwing with Capitalism.