Portable welding/generation options

[zuiko]

I have a pretty decent 220V MIG welder already but I would like to be able to weld outside the shop. I'm thinking about getting a generator that will run that (for $1000 or less). In that price range, it seems like I have 3 options: Gas, Propane, or PTO.

Pros of PTO:
One less engine to maintain
Lots of power for the buck (more than I need to run the welder, but could be good for backup power).
Less fuel cost than probably any other option.

Cons of PTO:
No place to put the welder
Can't use the PTO generator while I am using another implement
If using for backup power, the tractor will be tethered to the house and not usable for anything else

The first two cons are pretty big ones. My plan if I went with the portable would be to run it out of the back of one of my trucks, so no issue finding a place for the welder there and it frees up the tractor to do other things.

What I'm not sure of is how the PTO generators compare to portables in terms of harmonic distortion, etc. I'm also not sure whether you can believe the harmonic distortion numbers the manufacturers offer to compare. One more thing, do PTO generators have to be run at 540rpm or can you adjust the speed to the load required? I am guessing they do in order to get 60Hz out of them, but I don't know for sure.

On the portable side, there is also the question of propane vs gas. I think I would lean towards gas just because I believe it would end up being cheaper to run on gas given how much they ream you on the 20# cylinder exchanges and it is much easier to deal with gas generally (you can see how much fuel you have, you can top off whenever you want, etc).

A generator with a built in arc welder would be another option, but the portables that offer that are all well over 1k and I haven't ever seen a PTO generator that offered that.

Any thoughts? Other options in my price range?

 

[greenmule]

Might be hard to find a gen for 1000 bucks that you can use to power that 220 mig.

Course your best bet would be to buy a welder/gen that puts out both constant current and constant voltage,so you can mig/tig/stick and flux core all on one machine,that is portable and probably puts out 10,000 watts of 120 voltage,northerns got one in latest cataloque for 4,200.

Never could figure out why anybody buying a generator for emergency use[2-3 days at a time maybe twice a year] and wanted a welder,would ever buy two different machines,if your just talking dc stick/gen,you can buy a miller,for 2,300 or so,will burn a 1/8 inch rod all day on dc plus it puts out 6,000 watts of 120 ac. They even make one like it[welder/generator] that is a mig welder instead of stick,for about same price.

 

[zuiko]

It's a small 220V MIG so max power draw is only 3800 watts or so... I don't think finding something that will power that for under 1k will be much of a problem. A welder/generator would probably be the best option, but that is a ton more than I really want to spend. I've never been able to figure out why a welder and a generator get (much) more expensive when you stick them together in the same box, but they sure seem to.

 

[greenmule]

Not really,again out of northern cataloque,10kw generator,cheap one,northstar,2350 dollars,hobart welder gen 10kw out put dc stick welder,2950 dollars,so....you are paying just 600 bucks for a very good stick welder,that is portable.

 

[Wis Bang]

We have an old Hobart gasoline powered welder that has two 110v and two 220v outlets that we bought used. Works great!

 

[chh]

A PTO generator has to run at 540 rpm to put out the correct voltage and the correct hertz.
My Lincoln Ranger 10 says it can be used for emergency power, BUT that it is not "clean" voltage and not to use it with sensitive electronics or damage may occur. I believe Hobart/Miller have the same warning. i actually called Lincoln about that and they explained that the unit is primarly a welder, generator use is a byproduct of that. I really don't understand that reasoning since my the $500 5000 watt Coleman is approved for electronics with "clean wave" power and the Lincoln cost considerably more than that. How hard would it have been to make it a "clean" power source?
I have a Generac PTO generator(actually they are alternators) with the wheel kit(13" tires, frame, and tounge to tow with). It would be pretty easy to add a rack onto the angle iron of the wheel kit and make a place to mount your welder if you decided to go that route.

 

[Reg]

True, the shaft has to turn at 540 and most compact tractors are geared to put out their max PTO power when the pto is at 540.

Howeverrrrrrrrrrrrrrr,
If you have a dual range PTO; say 540 and 1,000 you could run in the 1,000 gear with the engine at 54% of the usual PTO speed.
You wouldn't get MAXIMUM power, but for standby power and most light welding jobs it would work fine.
Example; Not 2600 RPM close to the house, but about 1400 to run a few household appliances, keep the freezer safe, etc.

 

[greenmule]

Probably something to it,but have powered new oil furnace with welder,[got all computor controled pump and such],works fine,powered my tv,never tried computor but believe that kinda stuff may be exaggerated by generator companies.I mean,if the stuff works,than it works.

 

[Soundguy]

here's my opinion of your cons on the ptogenset.

1, why no room? I have a 3pt carry-all with a pallate bolted to it.. and the pto gen bolted to the pallate. there is room to the right and left of the genset. i have had my hobart stickmate on one side and a bucket of tools on the other while in the back of my pasture using the tractor for portable power and welding.

2, in an emergency power outtage.. you likely don't need power 24/7/365.

keep the power on for a bit to pump up some water.. heat some water.. cool the reefers.. get weather and tv.. etc.. then use the tractor for cores for a couple hours.. like pulling trees out of the road / driveway.. etc.

just kkeep that rythm going.

it's hard to get more power cheaper than a ptogenset.. plus.. your tractor should be more reliable than a small aluminum block engine made in china that is turning at max rpm.. made as small as humanly possible and still run the rated load. when the lights go out.. do you want 'lawnmower' engine technology making power for you? or your trusty tractor.

i've never regretted my 12.5kw pto genset. i used her extensively after the florida hurricane seasons back 4-5 years ago.. plus before I got power to the end of my farm.. my old 1955 ford 660 and that genset was the 'power company' for many weeks to get the well pumped up for irrigation and stock tanks for the animals.. and for power tools to help with fencing and animal pen construction... I trust that old 54 year old tractor more than a new chinese aluminum whizzbang....

soundguy

I have a pretty decent 220V MIG welder already but I would like to be able to weld outside the shop. I'm thinking about getting a generator that will run that (for $1000 or less). In that price range, it seems like I have 3 options: Gas, Propane, or PTO.

Pros of PTO:
One less engine to maintain
Lots of power for the buck (more than I need to run the welder, but could be good for backup power).
Less fuel cost than probably any other option.

Cons of PTO:
No place to put the welder
Can't use the PTO generator while I am using another implement
If using for backup power, the tractor will be tethered to the house and not usable for anything else

The first two cons are pretty big ones. My plan if I went with the portable would be to run it out of the back of one of my trucks, so no issue finding a place for the welder there and it frees up the tractor to do other things.

What I'm not sure of is how the PTO generators compare to portables in terms of harmonic distortion, etc. I'm also not sure whether you can believe the harmonic distortion numbers the manufacturers offer to compare. One more thing, do PTO generators have to be run at 540rpm or can you adjust the speed to the load required? I am guessing they do in order to get 60Hz out of them, but I don't know for sure.

On the portable side, there is also the question of propane vs gas. I think I would lean towards gas just because I believe it would end up being cheaper to run on gas given how much they ream you on the 20# cylinder exchanges and it is much easier to deal with gas generally (you can see how much fuel you have, you can top off whenever you want, etc).

A generator with a built in arc welder would be another option, but the portables that offer that are all well over 1k and I haven't ever seen a PTO generator that offered that.

Any thoughts? Other options in my price range?