Please help, my tractor won't start!

[Harley T]

I have a 1958 International 350 Utility. While plowing snow this weekend, after about 1/2 hour the engine started popping, spitting, backfiring, running terribly.

Thought I might have gotten some snow/water in the gas, so put some drygas and STP gas treatment into the tank, and filled it up with fresh gas. Then it wouldn't start. Sounds like it's not getting spark. SO, I go to the store and buy four new plugs, put them in, and it starts right up. Purrs like a kitten. Put it away for the night, and now it won't start again. I pulled the distributor cap, it's clean and dry, the ventilation holes are clean. The plug wires are in good shape, no cracks, no corrosion inside. I'm running out of places to check. Any ideas out there? The snow is piling up, we've gotten 52 inches since Saturday morning and I HATE running the snowblower. PLEASE! Any ideas appreciated.

TIA.

Harley T.

Fulton, NY

 

[dex3361]

I had a IH 424 and it was gas and had a voltage reduction resistor to help the points last longer. Sometimes when it was hard to start I would jump around it to give it a bit more spark. While checking for that you didn't mention anything about the points or condenser. Did you check those?

 

[DJ54]

Coils have been known to give those type of symptoms too. If it does it again, carefully feel the coil, and see if it is hot. A thin pair of gloves may be an idea, or just give it a real quick slap with the fingers. Just don't grab it... They really do get hot..!! Don't ask me how I know...

 

[mrutkaus]

Check plug wires with ohmmeter?

Yes, coil sounds like something to look at.

Mike

 

[Harley T]

Randall, thanks for the reply....

I didn't check the points or condenser, but will tonight when I get home. Gonna try and jump it to see if I can get it started, too. After cranking last night in the cold, afraid I'm gonna wear the battery down.

DJ54, thanks also.

Funny, I called my grandpa last night. If ANYONE would know what was wrong, he would. He also said it sounds like the ignition coil to him, but couldn't be much help from 750 miles away. If I can get it started tonight, I will feel the coil (with gloves...LOL) to see how hot it is.

Thanks again to you both. I will let you know how I make out.

Harley

 

[Harley T]

Thanks, Mike.

If the coil is bad, will it start with a jump? Will it continue to run poorly until I get a new coil? TIA

 

[dqdave1]

Might want to clean fuel bowl and change/clean fuel filter.

 

[dex3361]

With the distributor cap off have someone turn the tractor (taking all safety precautions) and watch the gap open and close on the points the spark should be blue in color if its correct. Here is a tutorial on troubleshooting points.
TROUBLESHOOTING IGNITIONS SYSTEMS

 

[zzvyb6]

Make sure you are using gas without any ethanol added. Its up to 15% around here now. The ethanol compounds wreak havoc on spark plugs, o-rings, and loosen fuel sediments. New car engines are designed for use with it, but older motors are having trouble. Even my snowmobile had a spark plug problem before I switched to straight gasoline. The plug will show spark when pulled out of the engine, but is fouled under compression in the presence of ethanol. My Honda engines are the worst for plug fouling with it.

 

[DJ54]

If the coil has completely shorted out, then doubt it will run. Somethimes they will do this several times, before finally biting the dust. Get hot, then short. Cool off and maybe do it again.

As mentioned, try looking for spark in the points, or off a wire to plug.

 

[Scotty370]

zzvybb-Wonder if anyone else is getting fed-up with this Ethanol being shoved down our throats! 15%! WOW!

 

[Soundguy]

Thanks, Mike.

If the coil is bad, will it start with a jump? Will it continue to run poorly until I get a new coil? TIA

if the coil is bad.. it's bad.. a jump won't help.

you need to narrow this to a fuel or spark issue.

check spark after charging her up.. if it's got good spark, look at fuel, air, compression and timing.

post back.

soundguy

 

[PapaPerk]

Check points, condenser, coil, etc. Points may not be gapped.

 

[Soundguy]

zzvybb-Wonder if anyone else is getting fed-up with this Ethanol being shoved down our throats! 15%! WOW!

I just had to replace a 300$ carb due to that paint thinner stuff they sell as gas nowadays.. carbinards were green and so pitted that a rebuild kit couldn't seal all the seats and flanges...

soundguy

 

[Harley T]

Soundguy,

Thanks for the response. I went to the Tractor Supply store yesterday. Magically, they had an ignition coil on the shelf. While in line to pay for it, I was shocked that the guy behind me was the person that did ALL the work on my tractor for the guy I bought it from!

He said it sounded like the ignition coil (then I showed him it was in my hands) or the condenser and/or points.

I changed the coil when I got home, but the battery was dead. Charged it up, and it started just fine. I let it run for about 10 -15 minutes, then brought it out of the garage to start plowing. As soon as the engine gets under load, it starts spitting and popping again. It died again in the driveway, and there it sits with a battery charger on it again.

Gonna buy the kit at the tractor store that has all the parts I didn't buy....condenser, points, distributor cap and more plugs. If that doesn't do the trick, don't know what I'm gonna do.

Does it still sound like the points/condenser?

Harley

 

[Soundguy]

condensors usually fail in about a minute, then can 'heal' and then fail again.

a ignition switch could fail in 10 minutes from bad contacts that heat up... easy to check by bypassing with a wire.

fuel starvation will do the same.. and 10 minutes is a good number for one to starve that has a vacume on the tank, or has insuficient flow to meet demand once not idling.

need to check spark at stall to verify.. and or do a few things like jumper around switch and remove gas cap to rule those out.

it's strange that you have to keep charging it.. that's not right...

soundguy

 

[DJ54]

Hmmm..., You know... It may not be charging, and using up the charge in the battery...

 

[Soundguy]

them ignitions DO run on electrons.... when there aren't any electrons.. um..


soundguy

 

[Harley T]

Thanks again for the responses.

As far as the battery goes, I've had to charge it a couple of times because after I try cranking it several times, there isn't enough juice to turn much. Maybe it IS the battery?

The odd thing to me is that the power drop off is when the engine is under load. It idled ok both times before it "died" regardless of how much time it had run prior.

Don't think it's fuel starvation, I can smell gas while cranking, almost like it keeps flooding itself out. Would explain why it started right up after changing the plugs a few days ago, the new ones were dry?

Going home soon to see if she starts. If so, gonna nurse it back to the garage until the points/condenser/rotor/distributor cap get delivered to the tractor store tomorrow. I'll keep you posted.

Harley

 

[Soundguy]

a standard battery should have more than a few revs of cranking in it.. if not.. it's a bad battery.

and yes.. it could certaintly be flooding out.

post back what ya find ont he bat.. rule out one system at a time.

soundguy