Rockbadchild
Elite Member
bureaucracy at its finest
Playing bill collector
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Alan W.
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Local hospital went from doing their own billing to outsourcing it a few years ago.
I was my Great Aunts power of attorney when she passed. She was a poor woman who was on Medicare and Medicaid and due to her income status never had to pay anything for medical services the last three years of her life.
Over a year after her death I get a call from the billing company telling me that she owes thousands of dollars for her last hospital visit.
They had failed to bill Medicare and Medicaid in time and was trying to cut their loss. I informed them the estate was closed and their stupidity was not my problem.
I was my Great Aunts power of attorney when she passed. She was a poor woman who was on Medicare and Medicaid and due to her income status never had to pay anything for medical services the last three years of her life.
Over a year after her death I get a call from the billing company telling me that she owes thousands of dollars for her last hospital visit.
They had failed to bill Medicare and Medicaid in time and was trying to cut their loss. I informed them the estate was closed and their stupidity was not my problem.
thclimer
Veteran Member
I wonder what the percentage of a medical bill is associated with bureaucracy of billing...maybe 20%? Just think of all the people who are employed by insurance companies, by hospitals, by doctors offices..........by companies who write the software to manage the billing system.
We go to a small dental group who has 2 dentists and probably 6 dental hygienists, but there has to be 3-4 people who are doing billing in that office.
Its no wonder the United States has the highest healthcare cost in part due to the high prescription costs but the system as a hole sure seems to be overly burdened with a complicated process for insurance and billing.
ultrarunner
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As some say it's enough to make you sick...
Every week maybe 2 or 3 out of 125 elective surgery patients will make the effort to understand costs... the rest simply sign with the vast majority not understanding how their carrier pays claims.
If hospitals were like car repair a ok would be needed for complications resulting in additional work but the patient in the middle of the procedure isn't available to say yes or no should a case go over...
That said we have patients that travel to the United States from Canada choosing to pay out of pocket instead of using their covered Canada plan
Every week maybe 2 or 3 out of 125 elective surgery patients will make the effort to understand costs... the rest simply sign with the vast majority not understanding how their carrier pays claims.
If hospitals were like car repair a ok would be needed for complications resulting in additional work but the patient in the middle of the procedure isn't available to say yes or no should a case go over...
That said we have patients that travel to the United States from Canada choosing to pay out of pocket instead of using their covered Canada plan
dodge man
Super Star Member
I’ll chime in and my wife has gone through our wonderful healthcare system with a problem and similar results. She finally found a doctor that went through the trouble to diagnose her. She was waiting to get her insurance to approve a test and they said the hospital never requested it. Somebody had sat on it for 3 weeks. I feel the doctors and nurses attempt to do a good job it’s the administrative staff that is lacking.
EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
When my mom had her knee replaced, the cost was about $75,000. Her insurance covered most of it and my parents paid when they where required to pay. They never got a list of what they where paying for. When it turned out that the Surgeon had messed up and they had to bring in a specialist to do it all over again, her insurance paid for everything. We never found out what that amount was.
When I had the knee replaced on one of my dogs, the total cost was $2,500. When I asked the surgeon if there was any difference between replacing a dogs knee and replacing a human knee, he said that it was all the same thing. The extra money spent for a human knee is to deal with the regulations and liability issues, along with what we assume is a bigger profit for everyone involved.
A friend back in California is a CFO for a medical clinic with multiple locations from SF to Napa. Her biggest challenge is from being forced by the government to provide service to people in the country legally that plan their trips to the country to get sick and receive treatment. Most of them come from Asia, and once they enter the clinic for an "emergency" they are required to get treatment. The clinic has a fund set aside to handle these people, but it's limited, so they swap people with other clinics and hospitals to maintain their budget. This fund comes from everyone who actually pays for services there. They have to add on to everyones bill a certain amount to have the money available to treat the medical tourists.
When I had the knee replaced on one of my dogs, the total cost was $2,500. When I asked the surgeon if there was any difference between replacing a dogs knee and replacing a human knee, he said that it was all the same thing. The extra money spent for a human knee is to deal with the regulations and liability issues, along with what we assume is a bigger profit for everyone involved.
A friend back in California is a CFO for a medical clinic with multiple locations from SF to Napa. Her biggest challenge is from being forced by the government to provide service to people in the country legally that plan their trips to the country to get sick and receive treatment. Most of them come from Asia, and once they enter the clinic for an "emergency" they are required to get treatment. The clinic has a fund set aside to handle these people, but it's limited, so they swap people with other clinics and hospitals to maintain their budget. This fund comes from everyone who actually pays for services there. They have to add on to everyones bill a certain amount to have the money available to treat the medical tourists.
oosik
Epic Contributor
My situation is a bit larger but it came out just fine. During her final days my wife was confined to a hospital bed.
About a month after she had passed and everything had settled - I get this large package from the hospital.
It was the hospital bill. 112 pages - single spaced. Just a tad under $400K. I still have the damn bill - its in the bottom drawer of my dresser.
I had a meeting with the hospital administrative staff. I was allowed to file several forms and the hospital wrote this entire bill off. $400,000 and I did not have to pay a nickle. The hospital told me this was more common than you would realize. This $400K was a wright off against their federal taxes.
Otherwise - I have no idea what would have happened. The bank would not give me a loan for that much. Besides - if they did - it would have been high interest and I could not have even paid the interest generated by the loan.
And - yes - the wife was covered with insurance. But why they refused to pay the bill is an entirely different story - for another day.
About a month after she had passed and everything had settled - I get this large package from the hospital.
It was the hospital bill. 112 pages - single spaced. Just a tad under $400K. I still have the damn bill - its in the bottom drawer of my dresser.
I had a meeting with the hospital administrative staff. I was allowed to file several forms and the hospital wrote this entire bill off. $400,000 and I did not have to pay a nickle. The hospital told me this was more common than you would realize. This $400K was a wright off against their federal taxes.
Otherwise - I have no idea what would have happened. The bank would not give me a loan for that much. Besides - if they did - it would have been high interest and I could not have even paid the interest generated by the loan.
And - yes - the wife was covered with insurance. But why they refused to pay the bill is an entirely different story - for another day.
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EddieWalker
Epic Contributor
Sorry to hear about your wife.
When my brother passed away last year, the hospital, and several doctors all sent bills. His insurance covered most of it, but they wanted me to pay $75,000. Since I'm still dealing with his estate, and will be for a few more years, I ignored the bills, which eventually led to more bills from collection companies. Every month, the amount that they where demanding decreased. I think the total is now in the hundreds of dollars amount. I'm still not paying any of those bills until I'm forced to by the Judge, when we get to that point. My dad passing in October has affected my brothers estate, and now that has become the priority.
When my brother passed away last year, the hospital, and several doctors all sent bills. His insurance covered most of it, but they wanted me to pay $75,000. Since I'm still dealing with his estate, and will be for a few more years, I ignored the bills, which eventually led to more bills from collection companies. Every month, the amount that they where demanding decreased. I think the total is now in the hundreds of dollars amount. I'm still not paying any of those bills until I'm forced to by the Judge, when we get to that point. My dad passing in October has affected my brothers estate, and now that has become the priority.
ultrarunner
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When dad passed I answered every letter asking for more information and later for a sit down with all the doctors involved… of course that was never going to happen.
Eventually they collectively tired of my requests… they were very well paid but on the last 3 days a battery of tests were ordered against dads wishes…
Eventually they collectively tired of my requests… they were very well paid but on the last 3 days a battery of tests were ordered against dads wishes…
buckeyefarmer
Epic Contributor
Been there also. Had Johns Hopkins threaten me with a collection agency, over a bill I had paid.
Just before my last colonoscopy, the Dr practice got bought by a different company. The insurance now said, Out of network, I owe thousands, yet the Dr who did it was in network. Took a bunch of calls and emails and such to get them to cover it. And when they did, they didn't tell me or send me any papers (I have them mail be my EOB), I found out by going online and finding it. They all make mistakes.
Just before my last colonoscopy, the Dr practice got bought by a different company. The insurance now said, Out of network, I owe thousands, yet the Dr who did it was in network. Took a bunch of calls and emails and such to get them to cover it. And when they did, they didn't tell me or send me any papers (I have them mail be my EOB), I found out by going online and finding it. They all make mistakes.