OMG! please help hydraulic plumbing

[kirvin]

I hope someone can please help me, I have asked, what feels like everyone.:confused2:

Massey 165, Buhler/Allied FEL. I bought with FEL not working. I'm adding a front stinger pump and I cant figure how/where to run the lines. The suction and pressure ports on the pump are huge. I am going to add a hyd tank also. I am going to try to add a diagram to better explain my situation.
Thank you!

 

[David Devuono]

I am new to hydraulics, but I can imagine others are thinking the same thing. The 165 has an internal hydraulic system, one could say tried and true, so you appear to have written the internal system off? I have a 135 which needs hydraulic work so I am in a similar boat, but not sure I would go to the extent of a second system before trying to repair what I had. Tell us more about "FEL" not working. Does the 3PTH work? It is run off the internal hydraulics, so if it works you have a good internal pump. Just need to figure out why you cannot direct the flow to the FEL.

In my opinion, that is a huge pump, 4 x the factory pump. Tell us what you plans are that require a pump that wants 1/2 your masseys 60 hp?

 

[jpm]

to go from the first set of valves to the second you will need a power beyond valve on the first set

 

[aczlan]

Your valves MUST be sized to match your pump. Otherwise you will burn up a pump (see here for an excellent explication).
Additionally, your hydraulic reservoir should be at least half the size (in gallons) as your pump is (in gallons per minute). In other words, your 20 GPM pump should have AT LEAST a 10 gallon tank that it feeds from.

I would drop down to a 6-10 GPM pump if you are bent on not using the onboard hydraulic system (which at 4.5 GPM should be capable of handling a loader). Parts for a 6-10 GPM system will be 1/4 the price of ones for a 20GPM system.

Aaron Z

 

[kirvin]

OK.... I'm going to try to cover all the bases.
I bought the tractor from a dealer where my friend works. He told me that they took it in on trade, thinking the pump that can be removed through the seat pan was bad.
Later they (not a Massey dealer mind you) determined both pumps were bad and wouldn't make enough money on the tractor with the repairs involved and decided to sell "as is".
I priced the pumps and a new clutch (since I figured I would have to split anyway), I figured I could have a good tractor with (basically new) FEL for under $5000.
When I went and looked at the tractor, I quickly found the Multi-Power worked as did the three point. (I have not had a chance to test with an implement, but it will lift my lumpy butt without juttering). The loader did not move. So I bought it, with the intent of splitting it to replace which ever pump was bad.
I was reading "Big Dean's" archived website. Saw that he recommended at least a 17 GPM pump for a FEL. I also read numerous posts about the slow function of the FEL with stock Massey Hydraulics. I figured if the Multi Power and the three point worked, why not just put a front pump on it and not worry about the non fuctioning portion of the stock hyd. I could save money and have a normal operating FEL
I bought the pump, shaft and mounting plate from my "local" dealer. When the pump came in (same pump as the ones used on 8N's) it had a round shaft and my connecting shaft was splined. It came with a coupler to weld on my shaft to fit the pump. I felt cutting my ($125) shaft and welding on the new coupler was "rigging" it, "why not just get the pump that goes with the shaft". The new pump came in and I did think that it was large, but the bolt holes lined up on the tractor and it fit the shaft. Of course I installed it and went on a quest for a remote fluid tank, thinking that everything was on par....... I was wrong!
So here I am...... I hope this clears up the mud a little on my situation.
Thanks to all!

 

[David Devuono]

Feel ackward giving hydraulic advise, as I am a greenhorn, but....That 3ph will lift a good 3,000 lbs, probably lift the front tires if you chain it off to a heavy object. So if its working you probably have a good pump. Otherwise big Dean is the best place for information on masseys and it sound like you have a pump designed for your tractor. I am not an expert but with the size of that pump you could probably get away with a 10gpm per side flow divider and feed each spool separately. Then you can use both spools at the same time if you develop a third arm. I would also investigate if you can tap off the tractors hydraulic tank, maybe replace a drain plug with an inlet line for your pump, and the upper fill plug for your return line? Not sure what kind of relief valves are in your spools but most systems have a main relief valve prior to the spools. My 135 does not have a spin on hydraulic filter so not sure about your 165 but this would be a good time to add one as well.

 

[kirvin]

OK..... After I read JPM's reply about the Power Beyond - I called Cross Mfg and explained what was going on. I have two "basic" options.

1. I can buy a larger capacity FEL control valve.
2. I can put a power beyond valve in my BA spool.

I'm most likely going with option 2. I'm still concerned, will the pressure also go into the crankcase? I dont know how the BA spool works.

Thanks!

 

[J_J]

What is the model number of your valve?

Kanamak, Cross hydraulic valves


http://www.kanamak.com/pdf/dcvbatech.pdf

 

[kirvin]

The only numbers I could find on it (that I could read) were
-18-
4Z0008
02C???

3 spool
It does have the BYD letters
The left lever is able to be locked in the forward position (detent open?)
The plugs on the top have 3 4 on them. I don't know if its supposed to be 3/4 or 34

I looked at the link to Kanamak, but it only made me crosseyed :confused2: