Oil light on startup for CK2610H : how long is too long?

[mangler]

First off I am using fairly heavy oil in my (15W40 Amsoil diesel synthetic). I am posting this because it seems to take 2-3 seconds to get the oil light to go out on dry starts. Last start was around 12degC (54F), so it was not overly cold. I swear I had not seen the oil light delay before the last 5 starts or so, currently at 84hrs.

I have a bloc heater, and it seems to help quite a bit when I plug it (did not notice the oil light when plugged in for 1hr+, even at winter temps). But now it seems the bloc heater has conked out, so I am wondering if I should be switching to 0W40 synthetic for the next oil change. The heavier weight (15W40) oil is "better" for most of my summer high heat use, but it may be worth it to go down a smidge in durability and protection to avoid dry starts.

 

[5030]

If I were you, I'd switch to a 5-40 oil. Most tractors (I believe Kioti as well) will shut down when the sense no oil pressure within a set amount of time. I know my Kubota's do. The term dry start is a misnomer anyway because the boundary layer of lube oil remains on all the moving parts after shutdown and prior to and during startup. The oil pressure is just replenishing it with fresh lubricant from the sump. Been using Shell Rotella T6 for years now in both mine, one with 6500 meter hours on it and the other with 1800 hours and never has issue one with any lubrication related failure. Neither one is ever plugged in when cold, I rely solely on the glo plugs (and a good starting battery to pop them off.

 

[Roadworthy]

The oil light measures pressure, not flow. After changing oil pressure will be delayed by refilling the oil filter and any drained passages. In my car or my tractor I have no problem with a two to three second delay on the light going out after an oil change. Although my manual permits a variety of viscosities I tend to stick with 15W - 40 Shell Rotella T6 synthetic.

 

[Will S]

Don't think the oil light coming on for 2 or 3 seconds, has anything to do with the type or viscosity oil you are using, at 54 deg F.
I've been using 15w-40 Amsoil synthetic in my Kubota, since new. I bought it in 1997 or 98. Engine doesn't use or leak any fluids, and I'll be using it in the JD 2032R, when the first oil change comes due.

 

[RalphVa]

First off I am using fairly heavy oil in my (15W40 Amsoil diesel synthetic). I am posting this because it seems to take 2-3 seconds to get the oil light to go out on dry starts. Last start was around 12degC (54F), so it was not overly cold. I swear I had not seen the oil light delay before the last 5 starts or so, currently at 84hrs.

I have a bloc heater, and it seems to help quite a bit when I plug it (did not notice the oil light when plugged in for 1hr+, even at winter temps). But now it seems the bloc heater has conked out, so I am wondering if I should be switching to 0W40 synthetic for the next oil change. The heavier weight (15W40) oil is "better" for most of my summer high heat use, but it may be worth it to go down a smidge in durability and protection to avoid dry starts.

Both the 0w40 and 15w40 are the same weight at operating temperature, essentially. In actuality, the 0w40 would be slightly more viscous at temperatures above 212 F where it is "40w".

I've done the calculations of starting viscosity temperatures of various oils. 15w40 is particularly gooey when cold. Even a 10w40 would help a lot.

Too bad they don't make transparent valve covers. Then you guys could see the valve train smoking before it gets oil to it.

 

[Robin Veerman]

Well what does your tractor manual recommend? I have a 2014 CK30HST and I’m using the Amsoil DHD 5w30 Max Duty year round and I’m in Ontario too. Whether middle of winter or middle of summer the oil light takes 2/3 seconds to go out. I was originally using Amsoil AMO 10w40 after break-in, and a rad hose heater when really cold until the heater caught fire right before my eyes. I removed the heater and replaced the hose and changed to the lighter oil. Didn’t want a fire repeat. Anyways the oil light time didn’t change enough to notice…but it always starts nicely, even without the heater. Just my 2cents.

 

[5030]

Too bad they don't make transparent valve covers. Then you guys could see the valve train smoking before it gets oil to it.

I've started many engines with the valve covers removed (after a valve adjustment) and I've never seen any smoke at all. Curious to know where it might be coming from??

 

[RalphVa]

I've started many engines with the valve covers removed (after a valve adjustment) and I've never seen any smoke at all. Curious to know where it might be coming from??

With cover off, it would cool it. Smoking would come from lack of lubrication. Our research people with startups of a Dodge 024 with transparent valve cover in a -40 C/F cold room with various lubricants. Only one that did not smoke the valve train was Mobil 1 0wxx.

 

[5030]

With cover off, it would cool it. Smoking would come from lack of lubrication. Our research people with startups of a Dodge 024 with transparent valve cover in a -40 C/F cold room with various lubricants. Only one that did not smoke the valve train was Mobil 1 0wxx.

Without a substantiating link or reference documentation, I call your comment pure phooey.

In that cold of an atmosphere (what you observed was condensing water vapor coming from a dead cold engine, nothing more and it was not 'smoke' from the oil, merely visible water vapor that all internal combustion engines produce as they warm internally and why it's always important to operate any engine long enough for it to attain operating temperature and evaporate any condensed water internally.

Smoke and condensed and visible water vapor are 2 different animals entirely.

 

[Robin Veerman]

You do know how cold -40 is right? That’s quite common out in western Canada. Actually it’s kinda moderate…. I’m sure that a 0W oil would be desired and probably super beneficial in the cold of a western winter

 

[RalphVa]

Without a substantiating link or reference documentation, I call your comment pure phooey.

In that cold of an atmosphere (what you observed was condensing water vapor coming from a dead cold engine, nothing more and it was not 'smoke' from the oil, merely visible water vapor that all internal combustion engines produce as they warm internally and why it's always important to operate any engine long enough for it to attain operating temperature and evaporate any condensed water internally.

Smoke and condensed and visible water vapor are 2 different animals entirely.

The Mobil 1 0wxx oil did not smoke though. It was definitely smoke from the overhead valves stuff not being lubricated.

 

[holeycow]

I've been running 0/40 in everything for years, year-round.

block heater failures are usually just the plug or cord, not usually the heating iron...

North western Canadian prairies..

 

[toukow]

First off I am using fairly heavy oil in my (15W40 Amsoil diesel synthetic). I am posting this because it seems to take 2-3 seconds to get the oil light to go out on dry starts. Last start was around 12degC (54F), so it was not overly cold. I swear I had not seen the oil light delay before the last 5 starts or so, currently at 84hrs.

I have the same tractor with 105 hours, so just ran an experiment (friggin’ engineers, don’t ya know!) timing the oil light using a stop watch. I have:

• no block heater
• Rotella 15W40 T4 conventional oil
• 55 F ambient and stable in shop
• last start 6 days ago
• time for oil light to go out after starting 1.1 seconds

If it had always been 2-3 seconds, OK, but when things change I know it would bother me. So I would-
1. Change the oil filter and use with existing oil- retest.

2. Pull the oil pressure switch, which is easily accessible above the starter, and install an oil pressure gage if you have one. Factory service manual page 3-235 says oil pressure at idle is ‘more than 9.95 PSI’ (OK, 10 PSI amongst friends).

3. And if I didn’t have the gage, I’d just order the switch from Michigan Iron or the like for $17 plus shipping, and swap it out. Kioti Part # E5500-39013 if I did it right. Worst case you’d have a spare oil switch for a new tractor.

For what it's worth, Toukow

 

[5030]

The Mobil 1 0wxx oil did not smoke though. It was definitely smoke from the overhead valves stuff not being lubricated.

Again, I say phooey on your comment without any substantiating link. There will always be lube oil on the overhead when the motor is off. Called a boundary layer, same deal with the lower end bearings.

Your no link opinion is worthless in my view.

 

[mangler]

I have the same tractor with 105 hours, so just ran an experiment (friggin’ engineers, don’t ya know!) timing the oil light using a stop watch. I have:

• no block heater
• Rotella 15W40 T4 conventional oil
• 55 F ambient and stable in shop
• last start 6 days ago
• time for oil light to go out after starting 1.1 seconds

If it had always been 2-3 seconds, OK, but when things change I know it would bother me. So I would-
1. Change the oil filter and use with existing oil- retest.

2. Pull the oil pressure switch, which is easily accessible above the starter, and install an oil pressure gage if you have one. Factory service manual page 3-235 says oil pressure at idle is ‘more than 9.95 PSI’ (OK, 10 PSI amongst friends).

3. And if I didn’t have the gage, I’d just order the switch from Michigan Iron or the like for $17 plus shipping, and swap it out. Kioti Part # E5500-39013 if I did it right. Worst case you’d have a spare oil switch for a new tractor.

For what it's worth, Toukow

Extensive testing, thank you...One thing that has a big influence for me is time sitting. Less than a day i will get the same 1.1 sec. But 3days or more sitting I get 2-3 seconds. And that is with synthetic... Hopefully the pressure switch is OK. Already bummed my engine blockheater seems dead after less than 2 years and 10 plug-in cycles (does not make the hum anymore, confirmed no power draw with a P3 P4400 power meter, maybe a cord/connection issue).

 

[Username Taken]

Oil Filter's Anti-Drain-Back valve

 

[5030]

Already bummed my engine blockheater seems dead after less than 2 years and 10 plug-in cycles

Replace it. Simple answer.

 

[5030]

Never been overly concerned with how long the oil pressure light stays illuminated on either of my Kubota's. If it stays on longer than 3 seconds the engines shut off. Usually happens when it's below freezing in the barn and I don't ever plug them in. I just initiate the start sequence a second time and all is good.

 

[mangler]

Replace it. Simple answer.

Not really the point. Since this is not normal wear and tear, I was looking on user experiences to see if this is typical, or not. One user mentioned the connector is typically at fault, not the element. Hoping this is the case as it would be much easier to repair.