Rotary Cutter New to rotary cutters, have questions, help please

[Soundguy]

I guess your idea and my idea of close are different. 5" is not close (that's what she said! Doh!)

Kidding aside, I guess it's just my L3400 then. There's simply no way to make it fit unless I flip the lift arms over. But then my turnbuckles wouldn't reach the lift arms. Oh well...
j

Dito what Farm said... IE.. I can bunji my lift arms together , nearly touching.. my cat 2 tractors .. one can ( has flex-link ends ).. the larger 7610s with non-deluxe link ends one can get to about 8"


soundguy

 

[N80]

Yep, I think on my Kubota L4400 (similar to a 3400) they won't touch but they'll come within a about a foot of each other.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

I had a few minutes to kill this morning and was standing in the shop waiting on my son to show up. I threw a tape measure on a couple tractors. My 150 Massey is a CAT I hitch. Outer swing of the draft arms depends on height of the hitch. Approx. mid way through it's up/down travel, it will open to 35-1/2" and close to 4-1/4" at the ball ends. The 2440 Deere is a CAT II hitch with sway blocks instead of stabilizer bars. They can be turned inward to allow CAT I implements or turned out to stabilize a CAT II implement. At their widest point, the ends can get to 39-3/4" apart. With sway blocks set at CAT I position, the ball ends will close to a measurement of 25-5/8" apart.

Both tractors are more than capable of anything commonly needed from the hitch. Neither have any liabilities in their design. They're just totally different in their approach to the same job.

 

[Soundguy]

If you used a stab chain setup on the cat 2 machine.. would it go any closer.. like for an 18" cat0 sized, cat 1 pined drawbar?

soundguy

I had a few minutes to kill this morning and was standing in the shop waiting on my son to show up. I threw a tape measure on a couple tractors. My 150 Massey is a CAT I hitch. Outer swing of the draft arms depends on height of the hitch. Approx. mid way through it's up/down travel, it will open to 35-1/2" and close to 4-1/4" at the ball ends. The 2440 Deere is a CAT II hitch with sway blocks instead of stabilizer bars. They can be turned inward to allow CAT I implements or turned out to stabilize a CAT II implement. At their widest point, the ends can get to 39-3/4" apart. With sway blocks set at CAT I position, the ball ends will close to a measurement of 25-5/8" apart.

Both tractors are more than capable of anything commonly needed from the hitch. Neither have any liabilities in their design. They're just totally different in their approach to the same job.

 

[StrangeRanger]

A picture might help. I also thot of flipping the arms, but then they'd swing back and forth as the turn buckles won't reach.
j

 

[Farmwithjunk]

If you used a stab chain setup on the cat 2 machine.. would it go any closer.. like for an 18$ cat0 sized, cat 1 pined drawbar?

soundguy

NOPE. Rear end housing is wide enough to prohibit draft arms from going much narrower than where the sway blocks already stop them. Why on GODS green earth would anyone want to put a CAT 0 width drawbar on a CAT II machine anyway? A 60 hp/7500lb tractor would pretzel a CAT 0 drawbar.

 

[Soundguy]

Ahh. I see it's a design issue.. IE. the designers made the mounting ears so close that the draft arms don't have a large range of motion.. I've seen similar setups that have the draft arms with large balls with ears that allow the arms to have much more range of motion.

If your turn buckles don't reach.. that's when you scab on a nother bit of chain if needbe.

soundguy

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Ahh. I see it's a design issue.. IE. the designers made the mounting ears so close that the draft arms don't have a large range of motion.. I've seen similar setups that have the draft arms with large balls with ears that allow the arms to have much more range of motion.

If your turn buckles don't reach.. that's when you scab on a nother bit of chain if needbe.

soundguy

Take a look at a CAT II Deere produced from the first 3-point hitch models in the 50's through the XX55 series of the early 90's. There are NO turnbuckles. Some have a limiter chain that keeps the draft arms from swinging out too far and hitting the tires, some don't. Then there's sway blocks on the inside of each draft arm to limit movement of the arm towards the centerline of the tractor. Simple, effective, little need for adjusting, and not designed to facilitate the use of grossly undersized drawbars on the 3-point hitch.

 

[Soundguy]

Plain and simple...A design that has the most range of motion seems like it would be the most desireable. That's my entire point. I applaud designers who incorporated this into their machines. Looking at his pic... moving those ears another 3/4" apart, and adding a lip and large(er) ball for the end of the draft arms.. he would have gained much more range of motion.

"Grossly undersized" is a completely arbitrary term. If person A has a cat 2 tractor that can hitch to a cat 0 implement, and person A has said cat 0 implement and can use it, and does,.. more power to him. If person B has a cat 2 tractor that is unable, by design, to hitch to that cat 0 implement.. and then person B calls the implement 'grossly undersized'.. then I'd have to call that a case of sour grapes, as per the fable. Nothing more.. nothing less.


soundguy

Take a look at a CAT II Deere produced from the first 3-point hitch models in the 50's through the XX55 series of the early 90's. There are NO turnbuckles. They have a limiter chain that keeps the draft arms from swinging out too far and hitting the tires and sway blocks on the inside of each draft arm to limit movement of the arm towards the centerline of the tractor. Simple, effective, little need for adjusting, and not designed to facilitate the use of grossly undersized drawbars on the 3-point hitch.

 

[Farmwithjunk]

Plain and simple...A design that has the most range of motion seems like it would be the most desireable. That's my entire point. I applaud designers who incorporated this into their machines. Looking at his pic... moving those ears another 3/4" apart, and adding a lip and large(er) ball for the end of the draft arms.. he would have gained much more range of motion.

"Grossly undersized" is a completely arbitrary term. If person A has a cat 2 tractor that can hitch to a cat 0 implement, and person A has said cat 0 implement and can use it, and does,.. more power to him. If person B has a cat 2 tractor that is unable, by design, to hitch to that cat 0 implement.. and then person B calls the implement 'grossly undersized'.. then I'd have to call that a case of sour grapes, as per the fable. Nothing more.. nothing less.

soundguy

You may well see Grossly undersized as an arbitrary term, but using a drawbar intended for a 20 hp or smaller tractor on a 50 hp or larger tractor is, well, grossly undersized.

"Sour grapes" as per fable? That's laughable... And why would I even want to hook a toy-like CAT 0 implement to a 60 hp tractor. SOME of us have more sense than that.

I'm sure John Deere's design engineers are quaking in their boots now that you've declared their hitch system undesirable. Why, I bet they recall and scrap the millions of tractors they,ve built just because you don't "applaud" them.

Probably the most successful and popular modern "big tractor" ever produced is the John Deere 4020. The 3-point hitch on all 4020's has the same sway block stabilization I described. So, maybe a few hundred thousand farmers don't know squat and should look to you for enlightenment?

 

[Soundguy]

I'm merely using the small 18" drawbar as an example.. it's cat 0 sized.. but cat 1 spec'ed.

Just because your opinion does not match my opinion does not make my opinion wrong...it means we disagree.

As for 2 machines having different ranges of motion.. I see that as one have a more utilitariand design.. I don't see a tangible downside to that either.

Why you simply can't debate like an adult and leave the personal remarks out is beyond me. There is no where in this conversation for telling someone they have 'no sense'.. because they watn .. or MAY want.. or 'simply 'COULD' hook up a small implement to one machine.. compaired to another.

if I were buying a new cat 2 tractor today.. and i had brand A and brand B in front of me.. both otherwise identical down to price, dealer, financing, options i wanted.. fuel usage.. etc.. both otherwise 100% equal.. and then the salesman said.. well brand A can hook to any cat 0, 1, or 2 implemnt that you would like to drag behind it.. Brand B can hook to any Cat1 or 2 implement.. yada.. yada.. Seems to me there is a , albiet small, choice that can be made... that could sway the deal... Brand B has 'X' degree range of motion on the lift arms... and brand A has "X+1" degree range of motion.. etc.. It all comes down to numbers at that point.

I'm not trying to prove that your opinion is wrong.. I'm just trying to show that there can be many non-exclusive opinions on the subject.

On second though.. this has gone on way to far.. I must be a glutton for punishment to debate you.... It's widely known here that you only respect your own opinion anyway...

As of this post.. I'm throwing in the towel on this discussionwith respect to any of your direct replies or comments . If you take that as a win.. go for it.. It's not worth my time trying to defend an opinion to someone that is totally unwilling to give any credit to anyone else's words.. other than their own.

soundguy

You may well see Grossly undersized as an arbitrary term, but using a drawbar intended for a 20 hp or smaller tractor on a 50 hp or larger tractor is, well, grossly undersized.

"Sour grapes" as per fable? That's laughable... And why would I even want to hook a toy-like CAT 0 implement to a 60 hp tractor. SOME of us have more sense than that.

I'm sure John Deere's design engineers are quaking in their boots now that you've declared their hitch system undesirable. Why, I bet they recall and scrap the millions of tractors they,ve built just because you don't "applaud" them.

Probably the most successful and popular modern "big tractor" ever produced is the John Deere 4020. The 3-point hitch on all 4020's has the same sway block stabilization I described. So, maybe a few hundred thousand farmers don't know squat and should look to you for enlightenment?

 

[Farmwithjunk]

I'm merely using the small 18" drawbar as an example.. it's cat 0 sized.. but cat 1 spec'ed.

Just because your opinion does not match my opinion does not make my opinion wrong...it means we disagree.

As for 2 machines having different ranges of motion.. I see that as one have a more utilitariand design.. I don't see a tangible downside to that either.

Why you simply can't debate like an adult and leave the personal remarks out is beyond me. There is no where in this conversation for telling someone they have 'no sense'.. because they watn .. or MAY want.. or 'simply 'COULD' hook up a small implement to one machine.. compaired to another.

if I were buying a new cat 2 tractor today.. and i had brand A and brand B in front of me.. both otherwise identical down to price, dealer, financing, options i wanted.. fuel usage.. etc.. both otherwise 100% equal.. and then the salesman said.. well brand A can hook to any cat 0, 1, or 2 implemnt that you would like to drag behind it.. Brand B can hook to any Cat1 or 2 implement.. yada.. yada.. Seems to me there is a , albiet small, choice that can be made... that could sway the deal... Brand B has 'X' degree range of motion on the lift arms... and brand A has "X+1" degree range of motion.. etc.. It all comes down to numbers at that point.

I'm not trying to prove that your opinion is wrong.. I'm just trying to show that there can be many non-exclusive opinions on the subject.

On second though.. this has gone on way to far.. I must be a glutton for punishment to debate you.... It's widely known here that you only respect your own opinion anyway...

As of this post.. I'm throwing in the towel on this discussionwith respect to any of your direct replies or comments . If you take that as a win.. go for it.. It's not worth my time trying to defend an opinion to someone that is totally unwilling to give any credit to anyone else's words.. other than their own.

soundguy

Uhhh?.?.?.? Personal remarks? Did Chris get his feelings hurt when a general statement struck a raw nerve?

Your "opinion" seems clear. Anything you don't understand is therefore wrong. We've been down that long dead end road countless times.

Read back a few post's. You'll no doubt see where I said BOTH concepts are workable and correct in their own way. It's YOUR opinion that anything OTHER THAN what you understand can't concievably be correct.

Lock your thoughts and ideas into a small box and the grow very stale very quick.

 

[Bird]

I'd really hate to have to close this thread until we learn what the original poster does with that machine, but it's definitely time for this quarrel to end. Please!

 

[H.D.Tool]

It looks like you could could take a piece of steel round stalk the right size and U-Bolt it to the bottom of the angle iron. You might need spacers. If it works then invest in welding it on.

Eric

 

[StrangeRanger]

Ok, to close this thread and address some points.

No, I can't really modify the cutter b/c there is a small chance a friend of mine will take it off my hands. He's got an old Ferguson that is much smaller and will actually fit the cutter properly.

Last night my friend, same one w/ the Fergy, and I dug out his dad's old walk behind brush mower. This thing is ancient and must weight a couple hundred pounds. Again, scary looking rig. Looks like it would eat your car if it got away from you.

The thing is far from fun to use, but we were able to use it w/ some success. And, in doing so we realized, after all this nonsense, that a 3pt cutter on my L3400 would actually not have worked very well after all! The side slopes along my driveway/road (my main reason for wanting a bad *** cutter) are too steep and narrow to fit the L3400. And since I don't have thousands to drop on a boom mounted cutter I guess I'll explore the option of a hand held brush cutter. The brush saga continues....
j