New Solar PV System

/ New Solar PV System #1  

techman

Veteran Member
Joined
Mar 24, 2002
Messages
1,217
Location
N.E. PA
Tractor
BX22
Well I finally finished my new 9.2 KW solar system. Things started slowly. I was very optimistic back in March, expecting to be on line in a month or so. Well permits, approvals by the local utility and getting all of the required drawings, etc took nearly 3 months. Biggest delay was the utility and trying to get permission to encroach 25' into the transmission line right-of-way (on my land). The area was not cleared or maintained by the utility, but after a long wait it was off limits for any permanent structure, no iffs, ands or buts.

So I cleared some trees and had the neighbor (he has an excavating business) clear about 120' x 100'. After clearing, I waited for the final drawings of the ground mount, showing the footer locations. Once that arrived, the Kubota was put into action to dig the footers. A few heavy storms later, I dug them again, and then Hurricane Irene let me dig them a third time. Finally I got to put some yards on concrete in. I also dug 120' of trench for the conduit from the house to the solar array location.

In parallel, I got all of the inside work done at night. This included mounting and wiring the inverter, watt-hour meter and external AC disconnect. The DC wiring from the array requires metal conduit in the house, and the main breaker on my service panel had to be changed to meet code requirements for max. allowable currents.

Got the outside DC wire pulled and terminated in j-boxes at the array. The panels arrived within a few days of needing them (scheduled that way). It was a long day, but I got them all mounted in one long Saturday. The last of the wiring was completed, and I got the electrical inspector out for the final inspection. Once that was done, I submitted the signed paperwork to the local utility. Finally switched on , setup the inverter and started seeing the meter spin.

Now sin switching on, we have had only one partly sunny day. That day resulted in 39 KWH of generation. But in the northeast, we have had weeks of rain. This delayed every step of the process, and has limited me at the low end to 10 KWH to upwards of 30 KWH generation. I have been impressed with the surprising amount of power on damp, totally overcast days. Outputs range from 2.5 KW to 400 watts when it is completely overcast.

It will be interesting to see how things develop whenever the sun appears again.

paul
 

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/ New Solar PV System #2  
Looks great... I'm sure you will be happy with it for years to come.
 
/ New Solar PV System #3  
I hope this works out for you. But in all honesty, have you calced out how many years it will take to pay for itself. Id love to get something like this also, but here in north Idaho the sun doesn't always shine.

Looking at last years electric bills,I found that the worse usage amounted to 3,685 KWH used for the month ( or about 122 KWH per day. For me this relates to a $221.00) and the least used was 1,488 KWH (or 49 KWH per day for a bill of $89.92).

The size system i would need would cost a fortune. I don't see how it would pay for itself. I have tried to cut back on KWH used, but it never seems to help. Wife needs heat in greenhouse, heated horse water troughs, security and lighted arena, welders, plasma cutter, landscape lighting, and the fact that i cant ever get anyone to turn off the lights.

Ive even gone to the extent to install some motion sensors..those suck. Always turn off when you DONT want them to.
 
/ New Solar PV System
  • Thread Starter
#4  
I hope this works out for you. But in all honesty, have you calced out how many years it will take to pay for itself. Id love to get something like this also, but here in north Idaho the sun doesn't always shine.

Looking at last years electric bills,I found that the worse usage amounted to 3,685 KWH used for the month ( or about 122 KWH per day. For me this relates to a $221.00) and the least used was 1,488 KWH (or 49 KWH per day for a bill of $89.92).

The size system i would need would cost a fortune. I don't see how it would pay for itself. I have tried to cut back on KWH used, but it never seems to help. Wife needs heat in greenhouse, heated horse water troughs, security and lighted arena, welders, plasma cutter, landscape lighting, and the fact that i cant ever get anyone to turn off the lights.

Ive even gone to the extent to install some motion sensors..those suck. Always turn off when you DONT want them to.

Well my economics are not too bad. Burdened electric rate is about 15 cents/KWH, and we have net metering in PA. Since I did all of the work, and I got the panels through the company I work for, after incentives and rebates from federal and state govs, I will be about $10K out of pocket. With renewable energy credits to sell, my payback is 5 years max. If electric rates go up, even sooner. Estimates are that I will cut my utility bills by about 60%. If I went retail on the system (PV installer) I would need over 15 years to pay back.

paul
 
/ New Solar PV System #5  
Well my economics are not too bad. Burdened electric rate is about 15 cents/KWH, and we have net metering in PA. Since I did all of the work, and I got the panels through the company I work for, after incentives and rebates from federal and state govs, I will be about $10K out of pocket. With renewable energy credits to sell, my payback is 5 years max. If electric rates go up, even sooner. Estimates are that I will cut my utility bills by about 60%. If I went retail on the system (PV installer) I would need over 15 years to pay back.

paul

Were hydroelectric here, at $0.06/KWH. If i generated roughly 40 KWH/day (averaging summer & winter) x 365 x .06 = $876/year savings. thats my problem here...ive seen estimates for a good system at the $20-25,000 range. it would take me 22 years to recoup $$, not to mention any maintainance costs.

My best savings would be if i could cut down my useage. Ive been using alot of compace florescents outdoors and some indoors (but wife likes to dim lights....errr). Id love to try LED but not at $15 - $90/light bulb.
 
/ New Solar PV System #6  
My retired utility worker neighbor put in his own system... in CA, a Kw can run as high as 29 cents...

He spent about 40k on his system, doing the work himself... lot of cost was in his copper cable run...

He is a new man... every morning, the first thing he does is see how much he generated the day before.

He has not paid for electricity for over 2 years... is running a surplus so he is on the list for the Nissan leaf and swapped out his gas dryer and water heater for electric.

At 77, I have no idea if it will every pay off in dollars and cents... it sure has paid off in satisfaction...

He did say the panels would be significantly less if bought today.
 
/ New Solar PV System #7  
Nice set up. What brand of panels did you go with? Did you consider mico inverters for each panel?

HS
 
/ New Solar PV System #8  
I forgot to ask about micro inverters... seems it would be beneficial where I am.
 
/ New Solar PV System #9  
My retired utility worker neighbor put in his own system... in CA, a Kw can run as high as 29 cents...

He spent about 40k on his system, doing the work himself... lot of cost was in his copper cable run...

He is a new man... every morning, the first thing he does is see how much he generated the day before.

He has not paid for electricity for over 2 years... is running a surplus so he is on the list for the Nissan leaf and swapped out his gas dryer and water heater for electric.

At 77, I have no idea if it will every pay off in dollars and cents... it sure has paid off in satisfaction...

He did say the panels would be significantly less if bought today.

$0.29/kwh....yeiks. that sucks. Makes my 6 cents seem nice :licking:. At $40,000 it would take me almost 20 years to pay for itself....hmmm, not looking good.
 
/ New Solar PV System #10  
Nice set up. What brand of panels did you go with? Did you consider mico inverters for each panel?

HS

Do the microinverters fix the problem where if shade gets on 1 panel, it limits the rest of the grid's panels output?
 
/ New Solar PV System #11  
Thanks for posting Techman. I would be glad if I could put up a system half the size of yours. But I live in a coop that does not offer any subsidies. Our power cost about .09 if you take away the $22.50 base meter cost. My average usage is about 2500kWh a month.
 
/ New Solar PV System
  • Thread Starter
#12  
The panels are 230 watt Bosch monocrystalline. I did not go with micro inverters. I have a Fronius 10 KW. They have a unique system using 3 3.3 KW units inside and bring them on line as needed. This keeps efficiency up under varying loads. I have the panel strings set up in east-west configuration, so morning and evening shading will only knock out one or two strings. Individual panel shading seems not to be a problem, clear sky views.

Microinverters would cost me more money, with no clear advantage in my setup.

paul
 
/ New Solar PV System #13  
Nice. I was just pricing PV systems yesterday. Just the panels run around $20k, another $10K probably for the inverter, plus mounting and cables. For most of us that is a $40K system self installed. How does the renewable energy credits work? Where do you get the mounting rails?
 
/ New Solar PV System
  • Thread Starter
#14  
The mount rack is from Schletter. Cost was about $0.50/watt. Inverter was under $4K.

The credits are to help states meet renewable energy requirements. Look at srectrade.com I see you are in MD which is paying $200/MWatt. It is a monthly auction. You need to do some paperwork to register.

paul
 
/ New Solar PV System #15  
Thanks, would love to do a solar system if the price was right, but first I gotta get my geothermal system finished. The solar panels I looked at yesterday were between $400-$500 each, I see Bosch are closer to $600.
 
/ New Solar PV System #16  
I had planned on putting in a solar system this year but after seeing the results of the geothermal on my electric bill I decided it was no longer worth the investment vs the payoff period. It would still be worth it if I were younger though.
 
/ New Solar PV System
  • Thread Starter
#17  
I guess I have a good combo. I put in geothermal 5 years ago, and now added the solar. The geothermal has been a real plus in the utility savings, and now I will cut it even more.

paul
 
/ New Solar PV System #18  
Do the microinverters fix the problem where if shade gets on 1 panel, it limits the rest of the grid's panels output?

Yes, Mico inverters are the way to go.

HS
 
/ New Solar PV System
  • Thread Starter
#19  
Yes, Mico inverters are the way to go.

HS

Micro inverters have advantages, but for my system it would cost nearly 2x for the inverters, not to mention added wiring cost on the AC side. The biggest advantage is shading on a small number of panels. This may be caused by clouds, birds, planes, etc. All of these are usually fleeting in time and of little consequence. There is some more advantage with large scale shading by trees and buildings, but in my case that only occurs around sunrise and sunset, which are lower power phases of the day. For me the single inverter made more sense.

paul
 
/ New Solar PV System #20  
Yes, Mico inverters are the way to go.
I am looking at installing PV panels now. Micro inverters are great if you have an obstical that might block some of the panels for a short while, or if you want detailed monitoring. For me, they would add over $2K to the system. I have nothing blocking where my panels are going and for that much money.. I don't need that level of detailed monitoring.
 

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