Need Tranny Swap Info

[s1120]

bgott,

Can't happan. Other then GM, most other car makers use a different bell housing pattern for there big, and small blocks.[heck, Ford has three]You can not interchange cases.

 

[s1120]

JMIII,
You got that right John. I just bought an 92 Grand Caravan last year in perfict shape, with 160k on it for only $1500. But, on the other hand, I have dumped over 10 grand into my Mustang, and thats just a pile of parts, and will only be worth about 9grand when done. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif So what do I know. BTW, the stang will NEVER be sold.

 

[JohnMiller3]

Sample list of auction sales Dec. 19, 2002

Make
Model
Subseries
Year
Color
Drs
Cyl
Fuel
Trans
4x4
EW
Radio
Top
Int
Mileage
Price

DODGE TK CARAVAN 1991 BLUE V 6 Gas A Y 146867 $350
DODGE TK CARAVAN 1997 GREEN V 6 Gas A Y Tape HT C 100701 $1250
DODGE TK CARAVAN GRAND SE 1994 BLUE V 6 Gas A X 142843 $400
DODGE TK DAKOTA 1987 GRAY P 6 Gas A X 148589 $250
DODGE TK DAKOTA 4X2 REG SPORT 1995 GREEN R 4 Gas M X 66399 $1850
DODGE TK DAKOTA 4X4 EXT BASE 1993 GREEN X 6 Gas A Y 10604 $1600
HYUNDAI ACCENT GL 1997 SILVER 4 4 Gas A X 68643 $875
HYUNDAI ELANTRA GLS 1997 BLACK 4 4 Gas A X 78513 $325
HYUNDAI ELANTRA GLS 1997 RED 4 4 Gas M X 91741 $1050
KIA SEPHIA BASE 1999 PURP TAN 4 4 Gas 73826 $450
KIA SEPHIA BLANK 1998 PURPLE 4 4 Gas A Y Tape C 82499 $250
KIA SPORTAGE EX 1998 DKGREEN 4 4 Gas A Y Y CD L 90485 $350
PLYM TRUCK GR VOYGR SE 1997 GRAY V 6 Gas A 95234 $1050
PLYM TRUCK GRAND VOYAGER 1994 GREEN V 6 Gas A X 101030 $700
PLYM TRUCK VOYAGER SE 1988 SILVER V 6 Gas A X 122003 $100
PLYM TRUCK VOYAGER FWD 4C 1997 WHITE M 4 Gas A X n/a $925
PLYMOUTH NEON NEON 1998 BLUE 4 4 Gas A X 121160 $350

~~~

Happy New Years Paul!

I almost forgot... you being in the auto business.../w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif
Here's a sampling from our area - auction results on 12/19/02... /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif

 

[Bird]

What?!! You list Chrysler products and even Kia and Hyundai, but no Fords./w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif I just bought my wife a slightly used 2001 Ford SE Sport Windstar for her birthday yesterday./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif After 10 years of driving Escorts, she decided she wanted something bigger./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

 

[JohnMiller3]

<font color=blue>...2001 Ford SE Sport Windstar ...</font color=blue>

Happy New Year Bird!

... and a very Happy Birthday to Mrs. Senter... /w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

Now... Bird... you don't really want me to post auction prices on a Windstar do ya... and see some grown men cry...? /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

 

[Bird]

/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif/w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gifI can imagine what the auction prices might be, John. In fact, I bought this one from CarMax and a title search showed that they bought it at auction, and we know they made a profit when they sold it to me./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif But I don't begrudge businesses a profit, and I did buy it several thousand dollars under Kelly Blue Book and NADA retail prices.

 

[Von]

John, What auctions are those sold at? I need to get a cheap car for my daughter. Or are those wrecks that are being sold at those prices?

 

[JohnMiller3]

Well Bird... this is the best I can do on short notice... You have multiple auto auctions in Texas.../w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif
The closest match is from Dallas-Fort Worth...



Region: Seasonal Adj: Off Avg Mileage: 22,351 Avg Price: 12,176













___________ ___________ ___________ _________ ____. ___________ _____ ______. ____. ________

01,FORD,WINDSTAR FWD V6,4D PASSENGER 3.8L SE SPORT



12/04/2002 ALOHA $ 14,900 32,176 BLACK 6G A X WC
12/19/2002 CINCINNA $ 13,200 18,573 RED 6G MW
12/04/2002 DET METR $ 12,900 29,795 BLUE 6G A X MW
12/12/2002 DET METR $ 10,400 40,018 SILVER 6G A X MW
12/18/2002 DET METR $ 15,500 9,328 SILVER 6G A X MW
12/12/2002 DET METR $ 13,600 27,968 RED 6G A X MW
12/03/2002 DETROIT $ 13,500 12,465 BLUE 6G A X MW
12/17/2002 DETROIT $ 14,900 9,708 SILVER 6G A X MW
12/12/2002 DFW $ 12,400 31,444 WHIT-WT 6G A X SW
12/10/2002 GA DLRS $ 13,600 24,675 BRT.RED 6G A X SE
12/04/2002 KC $ 13,700 9,136 RED 6G A X MW
12/12/2002 MID AMER $ 14,200 27,240 LTGREY 6G A X MW
12/11/2002 MILWAUKE $ 11,500 37,336 GRAY 6G A X MW
12/18/2002 MILWAUKE $ 15,000 10,552 SILVER 6G A X MW
12/18/2002 MINNEAP $ 14,000 21,852 RED 6G A X MW
12/11/2002 NADE $ 11,000 27,927 2 RED 6G A X NE
12/18/2002 NADE $ 12,800 21,636 WHITE 6G A X NE
12/19/2002 NORTHSTR $ 13,200 22,872 BLACK 6G A X MW
12/17/2002 NORTHWY $ 14,200 26,429 LTWHITE 6G A X NE
12/03/2002 OHIO $ 11,000 40,899 WHT 6G A X MW
12/17/2002 OHIO $ 13,800 22,058 GRY TS22 6G A D MW
12/17/2002 OHIO $ 10,000 65,720 BLULYH2 6G A X MW
12/05/2002 OHIO $ 11,700 26,551 RED E4H2 6G A X MW
12/17/2002 SKYLINE $ 11,800 48,758 LTGREY 6G A X NE
12/05/2002 ST LOUIS $ 13,600 17,003 VIB WHI 6G A X MW
___________ ___________ ___________ _________ ____. ___________ _____ ______. ____. ________

 

[JohnMiller3]

<font color=blue>...What auctions are those sold at?...</font color=blue>

Happy New Year Von!

These are dealer only auctions. Those I listed first locally were all running under their own power as they drove through the auction lanes... I can't verify body condition as I wasn't there...

I have seen the Korean units look like brand spanky new... go for these prices however... they certainly don't hold their resale value... perhaps the worst... /w3tcompact/icons/frown.gif

 

[Von]

John, Happy new years to you!!.......I guess I'll have to go with some of my friends who are dealers. Wouldn't mind getting one of those little 4WD units for her. At those prices you could buy a few and have parts cars for the one on the road!

 

[Bird]

John, I don't know how you keep up with so many numbers./w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif Anyway, the Windstar I bought had 27,087 miles on it and I gave $14,599 for it, and since it was the best price I found for one loaded out with all the bells and whistles, I spent a lot of time looking it over, underneath, under the hood, under seats, dash, etc. trying to find something wrong with it and really couldn't find anything other than the normally expected light rust on the exhaust system underneath (it was originally registered in Michigan so I hunted pretty hard for rust on the assumption that it was probably driven on roads that had been salted). So, I'm happy with it, and assume the dealer's happy with the deal or they wouldn't have sold it to me/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif, and most importantly my wife's happy with it./w3tcompact/icons/grin.gif

This was the first time I'd ever had anything to do with CarMax and that $14,599 was the price they listed on the Internet; I didn't try to negotiate at all with them and they offered (and gave) me $4,600 for the '99 Escort. Local Ford dealer had tried to sell me a new Windstar (without the rear air, CD player, power seat, roof rack, adjustable brake and accelerator pedals, anti-lock brakes, and quad seating) for over $23,000 (claiming that was $100 over invoice/w3tcompact/icons/shocked.gif) and only offered $2,800 for the Escort with 48,000 miles on it.

 

[bgott]

I seem to have missed your point, I think. Chrysler built a small block patterned 727 case. For trucks and cop cars and 340 hi-po cars and whatnot.

 

[ScottAR]

As I remember, the 727 has a one piece case/bellhousing. So, there is a big block patterned case and a small block patterned case and they don't interchange. So, one could not have a small block trans behind a big block. It would be possible to rebuild one to small block specs I suppose as I am not that familar with the mopar trans...

 

[Kelvin]

I looked up some transmission information in an old 1974 Chrysler/Plymouth Shop manual that I have. Here goes:

The A-904 transmission was used with the 198, 225, and 318 engines.
The A-727 transmission was used with the 225, 318, 340-4, 360-2, 400-2, 400-4, 440-4 (standard), 440-4 (hi-performance), and 440-6.

In the rebuild section for the A-727, there are different numbers of front clutch plates & disks as well as front clutch springs depending upon which engine the A-727 was matched up with. For example, the number of front clutch plates & disks is "3" for the 225, 318, 340, 360, and 400-2; the number of front clutch plates & disks is "4" for the 400-4 and 440-4; and the number of front clutch plates & disks is "5" for the 440-6.

So it may be that your transmission rebuilder may have used the parts required for the slant-6 engine instead of a 440 engine.

Kelvin

 

[bgott]

That core he bought might have come from a 400-2 with only 3 clutches and the builder went ahead and built it that way instead of upgrading it. I don't know the guy whom he had build it so I wouldn't want to talk bad about him but I do know Aamco is notorious for replacing just what is wrong in a transmission. Front clutches burnt? That's all you're getting outside of a paper and rubber kit. You don't have to buy a kit to build a transmission, the wholesale trans parts house will sell you each and every part separately. It might pay to go to an RV website and find out who they get to build their transmissions. I do know it would be an unnecessary PITA and expense to convert that truck to a THM 400 when the 727 is as good as or an arguably better trans.

 

[ewoss3]

Well the CFO laid her foot down and decided the original builder after having this many opportunities to get it right will never see any more equipment from us.

Kelvin, Thanks for the re-build info, I'm taking the truck over to a new re-builder today and will discuss the options with him to make sure he uses the heavier kit.

 

[MikePA]

<font color=blue>Well the CFO laid her foot down and decided the original builder after having this many opportunities to get it right will never see any more equipment from us.
</font color=blue>
I heartily agree with your CFO. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif No offense intended, but when the first rebuild only lasted 13 months and 1500 miles, the guy who rebuilt it should have fixed it for free, or I would have gone somewhere else.

 

[RobertN]

Rob,
I would still pursue some warranty refund or something from the guy who did the tranny. I just can't see all that money paid for assumed quality work being lost.

I would definitely pursue a second shop too.

It would be interesting to here the new guys theory on why the tranny has had so many problems.

 

[ewoss3]

Well finally got our truck back from the new builder. After talking with him there is a ring at the tail of the tranny that is held on with four small bolts. Apparently this is the most frequently broken piece in the heavy dodge transmissions. These pieces get broken by having too high of an idle and shifting from park or nuetral into gear. He showed me the pieces taken out and the bolts were bent and sheared.
They lowered my idle settings and changed the rubber cooler lines that connect the cooler to the hard lines. Apparently there is a larger size rubber hose than I had used that allows sliding over the hard lines without the chance of cutting small chunks of rubber. They found 2 small pieces of hose in the filter when they took it apart. I went to autozone and o'reilys and neither of them carry this hose, but the builder did offer to let me buy it direct from him for later modifications.

Oh well hope this one last longer