MF3165 AD4.203 won't start after replacing power steering pump

[dirtrancher]

Hello,
I have an old MF 3165 with a Perkins AD4.203. I finally got her running, but then the power steering pump blew a seal. I replaced the power steering pump. Now the tractor won't start. I bled the fuel system and primed it with ether (bad i know). The engine tried to turn over but seemed to be straining, and the steering wheel pulled to the left as the engine cranked.

I guess the logical thing would be to bleed the fuel system again, but I'm hoping that someone with more knowledge than me might have some advice. Could it be something more than the fuel system?

Any help is greatly appreciated!

 

[redman135]

Is the power steering pump correctly fitted?
You have described an engine trying to start under load.

 

[dirtrancher]

Is the power steering pump correctly fitted?
You have described an engine trying to start under load.

Thank you for replying. I believe it is the correct model and that I installed it correctly.

The fluid level may have been low when I tried to start the tractor, because the power steering cylinder is leaking pretty bad. I have topped it off but haven't tried to start it again.

One other note. Upon removing the old power steering pump, I found part of an old gasket lodged in the housing. I removed it and cleaned out any other debris I could find. I wonder if something else could be in there causing problems?

Thanks again for your help. I've put so much time into getting this tractor running, it kills me to get this close and not get her all the way running.

 

[PatrickS2222]

It sounds like a stuck valve in the power steering is loading up the pump, resulting in the starter motor having to work hard cranking the engine. Research on forums - may help, also AGCO parts catalogue (click on "view books as Guest") could also help. AGCO Parts Books
Wish I could help more - some better minds will read this though and be glad to assist. :laughing:
Great pic of a 3165 on TractorData - impressive in the '70s styling. :thumbsup: How about some pics of yours?

 

[banjodunn]

G'day the steering should not try to move as you crank it as mentioned something is loading up your new pump you should be able to pull the pump off and try and start it as the drive gear should be on the outer of the timing gears ( i.e not timed ). I think you need to look further into the steering system.


Jon

 

[dirtrancher]

Hello,
Sorry for taking so long to respond. I greatly appreciate your replies! Ive since removed the power steering pump, but haven't tried cranking it over yet. I decided to remove and service the power steering cylinder which is leaking really bad. I'll try to crank her up and post an update.

If anyone has any tips for removing the power steering cylinder, any help would be appreciated! I posted a thread about the trouble I'm having here: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/parts-repairs/379925-help-removing-power-steering-cylinder.html

Thanks again!

 

[dirtrancher]

Update: I finally started it without the power steering pump, and it ran like a champ. I put the power steering pump back on, but purposely didn't connect the hydraulic lines to the cylinder. I tried starting it and it did fire up ok. I only ran it for a second because fluid was flying out of the pump (I put a plug in it but it flew out). So far, so good. But after connecting the hydraulic lines to the steering cylinder, problems occurred.

Problem 1: Exhaust is burping out of the intake manifold. At one point a large flake of carbon flew out of the intake. After searching this forum, it sounded like a valve could be the problem. I removed the valve cover, and all of the rockers were moving and the springs were going up and down. Any suggestions for next steps?

Problem 2: The starter circuit is sparking. It sparked at the starter button and positive battery terminal. After cleaning the positive terminal and bypassing the starter button, the sparks started coming from the starter motor (from one of the bolts).


Could it have been caused by too much strain being put on the starter because of the power steering motor problem?

This evening I removed the power steering motor and charged the battery. I plan to reinstall the rocker assembly, adjust the tappet clearance, then try starting her again tomorrow. Any suggestions for troubleshooting are greatly appreciated.

Thanks again for all of your help.

 

[redman135]

Dirtrancher,2 possible solutions.
when you refited the power steering ram could you have crossed the hoses? This may explain the engine under load situation.
Also when you put the steering back togather, did you leave a little bit of "slack"( there is a grub screw with a lock nut to make the adjustment)? The manual will tell you exactly how much. I had a 1971 MF178 with the same power steering design and if there was not the correct amount of "slack" then you had no power steering.
Your steering bias should be centre, to self centre when driving, if it is to the left then this may explain the pulling to the left immediatly you start up.
The starter motor is outside my experiance, so hopefully fixing the power steering problem will fix the starter motor problem before some thing is broken.
Good Luck.

 

[WilliamTO-35]

My neighbor has a John Deere diesel that, in cold weather, only starts if he turns the steering wheel back and forth while cranking it. That action apparently unloads the engine enough to help it start. About 4 years ago, someone on this forum explained that to me , but I don't recall the explanation. Another neighbor has an older John Deere ( 440I) that burns up alternator , fan, and power steering belts frequently . The power steering seems to be the culprit . Sometimes, I wish I had power steering on my Ferguson TO-35 with a front end loader, but maybe simple is better.