M Series Kubotas

[W5FL]

I was afraid that was the case. Kubota really made a brilliant decision to move the shuttle lever to the dash and put the fully synchronized transmission in the smaller M Series. They always had it in the 75HP and up.

I expect you will wait a long time for a hydro in the M Series. First there are obviously technical difficulties in pumping enough fluid to transmit the huge amount of torque required. Slippage is inevitable and builds lots of heat beneath your feet. Many people use the M Series on larger pieces of land and would not pay more money for less performance. [hope mark doesn't read this - but he shouldn't be reading about the M Series anyway] /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

The hydro got a bad rap for a number of years. My brother in law was the maintenance supervisor for the local school district and he absolutely hated them and had some convincing reasons.

I will be pulling a fertilizer wagon for several hours in very soft dirt and a hydro would not be a benefit for this. Nor would it be any benefit for mowing acreage (unless you have to dodge a bunch of trees or other obstacles - and I don't). Certainly no advantage in pulling a tiller all day long in your lowest gear or in pulling any heavy implements. The B & L series are less likely to pull heavy ground engaging loads all day long. For those that do like the L35 I believe they use a GST which is a fluid clutch rather than a fluid transmission.

Kubota really did well on the new M Series. I haven't heard a gear grind since I received the tractor and maneuvering in close areas with the shuttle lever is very good - kinda like a poor man's hydro where you wiggle your hand instead of your foot. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[Billc]

Wen, if you want to hear a gear grind come on over when my wife is using the tractor! Actually I must say that my wife is great on the tractor. She had never diven anything with gears (or a tractor for that matter)and picked up the knack right away. I love watching her working with it.

I agree that Kubota has made a great M series (though I haven't seen nor driven the newest models yet). When I did my reseach I did not find one bad thing said about them. I just got in from dragging some big oaks to the wood pile. I was pulling 3 big trees at a time up a slight hill in low 3rd gear. Not a problem. It is a hell of a work horse. This afternoon I am going over to my neighbors to help him move a pile of dirt. The dirt is in a low area and it's pretty muddy around the pile. When he tries to pick up a load of dirt his rears spin (no 4 wheel dive on his Massey). My 5400 just digs in, scoops up a bucket full and off we go. It makes him sick cause he bought his Massey less than a year ago.

 

[W5FL]

I would be sick if I had bought a Massey less than a year ago, too. I would be equally sick if I had followed some advice and not bought the 4WD. When you can pick up over 1/2 a yard at a time (twice what my 5 ft bucket held on the Massey) you can afford an extra 1/2 a second to move the shuttle lever. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[MChalkley]

Sorry, I read it. Actually, I expect we'll see lots more hydrostatics in larger and larger pieces of equipment. For a long time hydrostatics got a bad rap because they deserved it. They were far less efficient than they are now, overheated easily, and didn't have much power, especially after they got hot.

Fendt recently introduced an amazing hybrid transmission. It's a considerably more efficient hydrostatic (with lots better low end torque) combined with a planetary gear mechanism that splits the load between the hydrostatic and the direct gear. The system steplessly varies the load split from 0% planetary and 100% hydrostatic at the slowest speed to 100% planetary and 0% hydrostatic at the fastest. Efficiency at the highest speed is the same as straight gear transmissions and, at the slowest, still considerably better than standard hydrostatics. In North America, they are only using this transmission in the larger tractors 70hp and up, but in Germany they are supposedly working on a Compact Utility Tractor using this transmission. Fendt N.A. will neither confirm nor deny this, though. I'm definitely going to be interested in it when it comes out, though, I can tell you that. Fendt makes some innovative stuff.

Mark

 

[W5FL]

Oops...Mark did read it. /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif /w3tcompact/icons/blush.gif Mark, I asked my dealer why the hydraulics got so warm in a gear tractor. It turned out that just pumping the hydraulic fluid around when the pump is mounted on the engine gets it warmed to about 130 degrees F (and that is about as hot as you can touch). It would be interesting to see what the fluid temp gets to in a hydro under high load conditions. It might be a very convincing argument for Amsoil. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[MChalkley]

Wen, check out my post entitled "Chapter 2" about halfway down the page at http://www.tractorbynet.com/tractortalk/messages/1/1681.html?MondayDecember619990617pm. That's pretty close to what you were talking about, isn't it?

Mark

 

[Billc]

Mark, the new transmission is a good thing to know, thanks. I am hoping within another 4 years a hydro M will be out. If it will be much longer than that then you know what that means, don't you? Yep, Amsoil for the 5400.

Wen, I am not knocking the GST, it is easier to use than the gears, but for my money HST is king. (Let's take a moment knowing that Mark is smiling after the last sentence.)

Wen, how are you using your 6800? When I bought my 5400, there was a 6800 (not GST) with 12 hours on it at a dealership just north of me (Mason Tractor). We tried to get together on a deal but we ended up $1,500 apart. Since I was getting a much better deal from Goss I went with the 5400. But I sure liked that 6800.

 

[MChalkley]

Bill, if you're interested there's a lot of interesting info at http://www.fendt.com/north_america/index.html. Near the bottom of the page, there's also a link to their Vario (their trade name for the transmission) site, too.

Mark

 

[W5FL]

Yes Mark, I believe that is what I was referring to; however, the reports of power loss after the transmission get hot seemed to be a lot hotter than 143 degrees (that is the temp of water coming from your hot water faucet). The Amsol cooled it down significantly, even though that makes no sense to me. I would have thought the Amsoil would have been much better if it didn't cool the oil down any at all. For some reasons I was expecting to see the Hydro oil temp significantly above 200 degrees. Amsoil will have to have some air conditioning properties as the metal on the tractor gets hotter than 160 degrees on a hot sunny Texas Day when the tractor is NOT running. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[MChalkley]

Wen, my tests were done under considerably different ambient temperatures - between 60 and 70 degrees - which is one reason I made sure to check the temp before it went through the cooler. But the idea of lower heat is simple - it's not just pressurizing the oil that raises its temperature, but friction. Lower the friction and the temps go down. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

Mark

 

[W5FL]

BillC

I had the exact same problem you did, but took my lumps and waited for the 2000 models to come out. The M6800SD was only being shipped on confirmed customer orders. The dealers did not have any and the loaders were not available at that time either. I only had to wait about three weeks to get the tractor with loader.

My place has a lot of rock on it, so everything is harder to do than it should be. The M6800SD tractor is almost the exact size of the smaller M Series but is built heavier and that really comes in handy to have the heft without the size that so often goes with it. It is heavy and is about 8500 pounds with tire ballast, loader and tiller.

After my wife and her sister hooked up the mower a time or two, just the fact that the M6800 had adjustable links on the three point was enough for her. Just get within a few inches, get off, and hook it up. Guess I won't be a good candidate for a quick hitch adapter. /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

I use a 6 ft medium duty mower with chain guards to keep down the weeds and grass without throwing rocks through the windows. Use a tiller to make rocky soil plantable. Coastal Field, Garden, Orchard, and Grapes have been planted. Still have a lot of fence building to do this summer and driveway and entrance need work. The loader on the M Series is very strong. I use the loader to pull old fence posts, lift all sort of heavy things, in addition to handling dirt, gravel, etc.

Isn't it amazing that all the really hard things to do on a small acreage become so much easier with a tractor around to do the heavy work? /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

I really like the M6800. It seems to come equipped with everything I need or wanted and everything seems to be in the right place. (Mark - No hydro pedal in front of the brake pedal) /w3tcompact/icons/smile.gif

 

[MChalkley]

Well, nothing is perfect... /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

Mark