Leaking wheel motor

[davesisk]

He he he...

Believe it or not, I actually called Terry to ask this question (yeah, I'd be one of those guys using the cold chisel that Charlie mentioned... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif). He said, in a nutshell, use a cold chisel! (Well, actually he said there's only that one nut, use a pry bar and a big hammer!) Did somebody say hammer? That's the speed-wrench of choice, isn't it? /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

Dave

 

[Bird]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( speed-wrench of choice )</font>

Right!! I've actually done it both ways; spent a lot of time looking for another bolt when all I needed was a bigger hammer /forums/images/graemlins/grin.gif, but I've also been known to use the bigger hammer when I should have found that other bolt first. /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif

 

[duane]

Dave,

I think your hub is on with a tapered fit. If you have a puller, this along with your hammer may work. Since your getting new seals anyway, you may need to use some heat on the hub.

Duane

 

[davesisk]

I'm going to try using some of the goodies in one of those hydraulic porta-power kits to push it off tonight (if the rain will hold off!). (This is one of those kits with a hand hydraulic pump, and a few different rams and attachments with quick connects.) There's a half-ton spreader that may work. If not, I may be able to use one of the shorter rams to push it off from the frame...we'll see.

Final option would be heating it with a torch. I'll keep that as the final option, as I'd rather not set all the hydraulic oil on fire and torch the tractor trying to get the blasted hub off... /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif

Dave

 

[davesisk]

Well, good news and an interesting twist. I tried using the porta-power spreader (which is like a hydraulic-powered reverse jaw) to push the hub off. It can only apply about 1/2 ton of force, so no luck. I tried using the 10 ton straight ram to push it off, but discovered I was flexing the 1/4" thick plate frame, and decided to stop that approach before I ripped the wheel motor mounts off the tractor with this gadget... /forums/images/graemlins/shocked.gif

As usual, I ended up with my two neighbors over (we "trade" helping each other out with things), one of which was previously an auto mechanic for years. He brought a 2lb sledge hammer over, and we put the spreader back into the gap and cranked it to a little bit of pressure. He whacked the motor shaft (not the hub) twice, then we moved the spreader to the other side, and one more whack on the motor shaft and the hub came loose! Duh! I was going about this all wrong, trying to not the hub off of the motor shaft when I should have been knocking the motor out of the hub. I guess we actually knocked the whole tractor out of the hub, since the motor was still attached to the tractor... /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif. Go figure...anyway, next time I'll know the correct technique. And, I'd say this hydraulic porta-pack is a keeper as well!

Now for the twist: this wheel motor has a Parker label on it, while the other three are have Ross or something like that stamped into the back (can't tell for sure without taking them out, and I don't intend to do that anytime soon). Looks like this guy has already been replaced once! Now, what the heck do I do? I'm going to call PT in the morning, and see if they can rebuild this Parker motor (who knows, maybe it's the same thing but made without the markings just for them???). I'm thinking I probably need to check around locally and see if someone here in Raleigh can rebuild this thing. At least it has the metal tag on it, so the model number stamped on the tag should mean something to somebody. I guess it isn't too much of a big deal, because (as I understand it) many of these hydraulic motors are designed to be direct replacements for competing brands. Imagine that, mfg's consciously making things fit the same specs as similar products from different mfg's. Now, what were they thinking? /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Dave

 

[duane]

Dave,

Good job. What does the metal tag on the Parker motor have for a model number on it.

Duane

 

[davesisk]

Here's the Parker model#: TB0230FP250AAAA

Looks like Ross was purchased by Parker some time ago, so perhaps this different wheel motor is really the correct replacement for the original Ross wheel motor. Terry is doing some investigation at Power-trac to figure this out. About the biggest problem I seem to have is that my machine is so old, PT doesn't seem to have the best records about exactly what parts are in it!

Does anyone know where I could find the displacement of this model#? I've looked on Parker's web-site, and I don't find this particular part# (which probably just means it's been replaced by a newer model). If I know the displacement, I might be able to find a replacement that's about the same price as shipping + rebuild...just a thought...

Edit: Aha! Found it on Parker's web-site. Small Frame TB series...TB 0230...13.9 cubic in/rev displacement...handles up to 12gpm...max supply pressure 2750 PSI...max speed 246 rpm...this looks like it's definitely it. The rest of the part# describes the shaft size/shape/key/etc.

I'm searching www.surpluscenter.com... like 9-4124-14 is awefully close...apparently the FP part of the part number identifies the shaft...I should probably call them and see if they have one that's not on the web-site, eh?

Thx!
Dave

 

[duane]

Dave,

Good research. You could also look for a Parker Hydraulic distributor/service agent in your area.

duane

 

[davesisk]

OK, I haven't heard back from Terry, so I took the wheel motor down to Gregory Poole Equipment's hydraulic pump and motor shop. They tore into it, and looks like the gerotors have enough wear that a seal kit wouldn't last very long. Best choice sounds like replacement. They seem to have the best price ($268), so it's on order. They'll install the old fittings on the new pump, etc. Should be here UPS ground in a few days.

 

[duane]

Dave,

Last I remember, you had over 1000 hrs on your unit. Did the hydraulic shop think that the wear was premature for the number of hours, or normal. If it's premature, just wondering what the hydraulic shop's opinion would be for cause (type of lubrication, etc.)

Let us know how the re-installation goes.

Duane

 

[davesisk]

Good question, Duane. The shop said the gerotor's had enough wear themselves that a seal kit probably wouldn't be effective. However, there was a gash that appeared to have been caused by a piece of metal being pumped through the hydraulic motor. (Apparently, that isn't all that uncommon...???) Anyway, he said that given the wear and the gash, that a seal kit probably wouldn't last very long. I remember the guy that I bought this machine from telling me he'd "had some problems" with that wheel motor. Apparently he did the easiest fix, which was having a seal kit installed.

Regardless, a local hydraulic supplier and this hydraulic repair shop have both said that this Parker TB0230 model is a "throw away" wheel motor, meaning that when it wears beyond repair you just throw it away and replace it with a new one. Wish the previous owner had taken that approach!

Now, note that my unit is 13 years old, and the newer units may or may not still use "throw away" wheel motors. I know the current wheel motors are different (both 422 and larger 425 motors) because Terry had to do some digging for info and actually never did get back to me. So I'm pretty sure they're not still the same model as my old one.

HTH,
Dave

 

[davesisk]

Oh boy...when I took this wheel motor off, I looked to see if oil seemed to be gushing out of the hose. It wasn't, just what was in the hose appeared to run out, then it stopped. Well, discovered an oil slick under the tractor this weekend. I checked the hydraulic tank: empty! Best I can figure, as the oil got warmer and thinner, it started to run out of the open hoses, since the tank is above the open hose ends (ie. gravity plus temperature helped)...now I know. Don't leave any open hoses on your machine (I put a baggie and twist-tie over the open hoses to keep dirt or water out, so by "open" I mean "unable to hold minimal pressure"). I now have about a 7-8 gallon oil slick in my backyard. I guess I'm going to need a couple of gallons of Simple Green, eh? I know now, if I have to disconnect a wheel motor or cylinder, etc., in the future, I'll put a male-to-male fitting between the hoses to keep this from happening again. I simply wouldn't have expected this to happen.

Gregory Pool Equipment called and said the wheel motor is delayed, the supplier is out of stock and has to order one from Parker. I've checked Surplus Center, and I've also requested a quote from Baileynet. Anyone know of any other mail-order suppliers where I might find a reasonable price and in-stock availability?

Thanks,
Dave

 

[MossRoad]

Bummer! /forums/images/graemlins/mad.gif

 

[davesisk]

Yeah, really. I obviously have a love/hate relationship with this blasted machine!

Dave

 

[Sedgewood]

<font color="red"> I obviously have a love/hate relationship with this blasted machine! </font>

But that valuable growing knowledge base! We're all so grateful for your research /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif All you need now is a backup machine to take the pressure off the parts leadtimes. Ha!

Sedgewood

 

[davesisk]

He he...I'll take a backup machine as long as it isn't 13 years old like this one. I think my next tractor will be a new one! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

Anyone have any suggestions on how to clean up this massive oil slick? A couple of gallons of Simple Green? I now have oily mud under the tractor. Unbelievable. I'm still kicking myself for not putting a fitting between these two hoses. /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Dave

 

[MossRoad]

Dig the dirt out, bag it and get rid of it. I've also heard that DAWN dishwashing detergent does a great job.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

</font><font color="blue" class="small">( I've also heard that DAWN dishwashing detergent does a great job. )</font>

Yep...so I hear. We had a big accident here in Cincinnati a couple years ago where a tanker carrying a load of liquid animal fat (?!) overturned, spilling the contents all over I-75. The clean-up crew stood scratching their heads as nothing would get the oil off of the pavement. Proctor and Gamble called and suggested Dawn dishwashing detergent, and that's what they used to finally clean it up...it's a good emulsifier, but I'm not sure how it would work on a petroleum product...

 

[ernemats]

Dave:
Did you ever try using cat litter, I have found it to work real good on small oil spots on my garage floor when I had oil spilled.

 

[Anonymous Poster]

similar to kitty litter - speedy dry at your ocal auto
parts store also works great and it comes in 50 lbs bags

good luck