LA 272 Loader Problem

[PSDStu]

I was using my loader today and had the bucket pointing straight down doing a little cleanup with my toothbar and as luck would have it I must have caught a tree root and it caused the bucket to roll back and I belive pop the relief valve.

I can raise and lower my loader fine, but the curl back function doesn't work and the curl down seems to work ok, but it could just be working to curl down because of the weight of the bucket.

There are no hyd oil leaks, and need to know is there anything I can do to restore my curl function short of taking it to the dealer?

Thanks!

 

[PSDStu]

I disassembled both bucket cylinders and found out what the problem is. One cylinder is fine, the other cylinder I somehow managed to break the retaining nut off the rod inside the cylinder. This will require replacing the rod and nut for about $225.

Mental note to self.......be careful when using the loader curled down........

Stu

 

[wushaw]

Yes one must be careful when you have the cylinders extended like that.

At least your not paying for labor also.

 

[Adam23]

How fast were you going? How much pressure do you think was placed on the bucket? I ask because I use my bucket similar to how you explained and would not like to experience the same thing. Thanks!

 

[Westendorf-RR]

Back dragging with the front blade and a dumped bucket is very hard on your cylinders. In this position the Rams of the cylinders are completly extended; when you put down pressure on the cylinders you are risking damage. If you do frequent dirt work, this is an option we offer for our buckets and as an aftermarket add-on. The Back Drag Blade will allow you to keep the rams inside the cylinder (fully rolled back) for protection while back dragging. It will not bend or stress the rams of your bucket cylinders. For less than what it will cost you to repair or replace a cylinder, you can modify your current bucket to work better for this application. The Blade is available with or without scarifying teeth.

 

[Adam23]

Back dragging with the front blade and a dumped bucket is very hard on your cylinders. In this position the Rams of the cylinders are completly extended; when you put down pressure on the cylinders you are risking damage. If you do frequent dirt work, this is an option we offer for our buckets and as an aftermarket add-on. The Back Drag Blade will allow you to keep the rams inside the cylinder (fully rolled back) for protection while back dragging. It will not bend or stress the rams of your bucket cylinders. For less than what it will cost you to repair or replace a cylinder, you can modify your current bucket to work better for this application. The Blade is available with or without scarifying teeth.

What does something like this cost? Where can I look more into this product?

 

[Westendorf-RR]

For a 72" bucket You are looking at roughly $250 and up depending on length (bucket width) and whether you want the scarifying teeth.
Front-End Loaders by Westendorf: loader for tractor, shade canopy, wagons, manure & landscaping equipment.

 

[PSDStu]

How fast were you going? How much pressure do you think was placed on the bucket? I ask because I use my bucket similar to how you explained and would not like to experience the same thing. Thanks!

Adam,

I wasn't going that fast, just doing a little clean up with the bucket curled all the way down, using the toothbar to gather up some loose branches..... the problem was that the right side toothbar hit a large tree root that I didn't see and then I heard a loud pop.....and then I discovered what I had done.

I have done this same thing lots of times.......but ya just have to be real careful....

I think what happened was that my bucket rolled back towards the tractor.......this fully extended the rod and the nut bottomed out on the large cylinder nut and broke the rod nut right off.

It wasn't a "Back-Dragging" situation.....just the opposite.

Stu

 

[Northland]

Thanks for the good warning post. I do the same thing with my B7800 at times so I will now be more careful.

This past weekend I managed to extend my bucket grapple and it's cylinder too far and it locked up. I had to purge on the out take quick disconnect hose of it's hydra fluid in order to retract the cylinder and grapple. It took me awhile to figure it out and it was a stupid thing for me to do.

 

[Adam23]

Yeah - I am also going to have to be a little more careful!

 

[Texas Dodge]

Yeah - I am also going to have to be a little more careful!

Me too. But is this problem happening on Kubota loaders only? I don't have a Kubota loader, I have an Ansung.

 

[wushaw]

Me too. But is this problem happening on Kubota loaders only? I don't have a Kubota loader, I have an Ansung.

I wouldn't think so, he and many of us have and will do it again. This is something that you have to be very careful with since it puts the cylinder rods in a very vulnerable position.

I would think the toothbar helped since it grabbed the root.

 

[N80]

Stu, I'm assuming you were going forward when this happened?

I always assumed that it was much worse on the cyclinders/hydraulics to go forward with the bucket in the dump position than back dragging. But Westendorf-RR is saying that back dragging is the problem. Typically if you are back dragging and hit an object the bucket tends to ride up and over it while if you do this going forward the bucket edge, and particularly bucket teeth are going to snag and generate much more force.

In any case, I back drag all the time with the bucker in the dump position (not fully though) but I almost never use the blade like a dozer.

However, that back drag edge looks like a great idea. I think it would be perfect for a tractor that had a toothbar since the toothbar makes smoothing with the blade impossible.

 

[N80]

For a 72" bucket You are looking at roughly $250 and up depending on length (bucket width) and whether you want the scarifying teeth.
Front-End Loaders by Westendorf: loader for tractor, shade canopy, wagons, manure & landscaping equipment.

Is this a bolt on thing or does it require welding?

 

[PSDStu]

Stu, I'm assuming you were going forward when this happened?

I always assumed that it was much worse on the cyclinders/hydraulics to go forward with the bucket in the dump position than back dragging. But Westendorf-RR is saying that back dragging is the problem. Typically if you are back dragging and hit an object the bucket tends to ride up and over it while if you do this going forward the bucket edge, and particularly bucket teeth are going to snag and generate much more force.

In any case, I back drag all the time with the bucker in the dump position (not fully though) but I almost never use the blade like a dozer.

However, that back drag edge looks like a great idea. I think it would be perfect for a tractor that had a toothbar since the toothbar makes smoothing with the blade impossible.

George,

You are correct..... I was going forward.....bucket curled all the way down..... and one of the teeth on the toothbar snagged a big oak root.......and the rest is history.

Never had a problem backdragging.......and the way I see it.....the forces applied on the cylinder rod in these 2 situations are different.

I will continue to use my loader as I was when I broke the rod.......but just much more mindful of whats at stake!

Stu

 

[Texas Dodge]

So the conclusion is we can back drag and it is ok?

 

[N80]

So the conclusion is we can back drag and it is ok?

I'm not going to tell anyone else that back dragging is okay. But in my experience when the down tilted blade hits an obstacle going backwards there is enough play in the loader arms that it just bumps up and over. It also helps if the tractor is light. But going forward if the blade catches it cannot ride over the obstacle and will dig in.

Anyway, that's my theory based on limited experience. But it is not to suggest that you or me or anyone else can't break something while back dragging. I'm sure it can be done.

 

[Westendorf-RR]

If you're going forward or backward with the bucket in the rolled under (rams exposed) position you can damage the rams and or cylinders. If you go slow and are careful you minimize the chances, but it is still there. What N80 says is true, just make sure you have the loader in float. With the cylinders are fully entended they are still vunerable to damage. Consider for example, you have a 2-1/2" cylinder but the ram inside may only be a 1 3/8". The structure, stability and strength of the cylinder is reduced by half when the bucket is tipped under and rams exposed. By having a blade on the the back of the bucket or just using the back bottom edge of the bucket to drag, you are keeping the rams inside the cylinders, protected while retaining the integrity and strength of the cylinders.

In reply to the question - bolt-on or weld-on, the blade is a weld-on item. It does not interfere with normal bucket use. Anytime you drill holes to bolt something on - it weakens the steel; plus it could cause the bucket to leak.