L2800 Position Control (Jerky?)

[mwb]

TEG asked that I copy a post here...

Hey, read your comment about my signature in the Backyard ruts thread... Have you read any of post from this thread???

TractorByNet.com

Do you mind if I link your comment (or you can make the same comment over there???
__________________
One piece of advice for anyone thinking about buying a tractor, make darn sure the 3 point hitch is NOT jerky - like the ones suspected to be on the newer (2008) L2800/L3400 so-called "economy" tractors. Have the sales person mount something on the 3ph and make tiny adjustments up and down, just to see how you like it.

Here is my info with some added info:

My dad bought a new L3400 last November - he had the jerky hitch problem, identical to the video of the sprayer. It has been 'kind of fixed'... Took two warranty trips to two dealers, over two weeks without the tractor and it still isn't right. He (and I) wouldn't buy a Kubota again.

I researched the problem here (last Dec/Jan) and I provided the original dealer with an exact diagnostic of the problem - even the part number of the replacement valve so he could confirm that stock was available. He did not appreciate the info - "bad info on the internet". They asked for the tractor back, confirmed that the 3pt jerks, then ordered the part from Japan.
The mechanic assured us that the valve was perfect - that he had disassembled the new valve and recalibrated it . The hitch appeared to work better but they did not put a load on it.

One month later it was back to another dealer - they spent a few days "un-re-calibrating" the valve. The hitch works better than it did originally but it is still a POS compared to my old Ford and to my new Montana.

The big problem I see with the L3400 hitch (after the new valve) is that it is TO FAST. Possilbly if they slowed / restricted flow to the hitch it would be a lot smoother.

The L3400 is a very nice tractor, my opinion is that they are very well made (engine, loader, etc). It is unfortunate to blow an otherwise perfect experience on a poorly designed hitch. The original dealer was also a major let down. My advice (and this is a common suggestion on the forums here) is don't just buy a tractor - buy from a good dealer.

Maybe this is just more bad info

Cheers,
Mike

P.S. The L3400 now needs a new battery, 1year, two weeks old and 120hrs. I could probably talk him into dumping the 'bota and 'upgrading' to a Montana

 

[jeconn]

TEG asked that I copy a post here...



The hitch works better than it did originally but it is still a POS compared to my old Ford and to my new Montana.

The big problem I see with the L3400 hitch (after the new valve) is that it is TO FAST. Possilbly if they slowed / restricted flow to the hitch it would be a lot smoother.
My advice (and this is a common suggestion on the forums here) is don't just buy a tractor - buy from a good dealer.

MBW, thanks for the post. Tell your dad he is not alone, there are alot of people on here that are not happy with their tractor or more importantly their dealer. I am one of those people.

 

[canoetrpr]

You know, I have thought about the slowing down the hitch thing as well. Almost seems like it is too sudden.

The knob under the seat slows down how fast the hitch falls but does not seem to affect how fast it rises.

My purchasing dealer sucked as well. Problem is - how do you figure out what your dealer is like before you buy. Word of mouth is the only thing I can think of but I don't know *anybody* who has bought from any of the dealers in my area. Unless you are in an area with other TBNers close by that can advise, you have to go with your gut. Often the dealer that seems good on a sale does not turn out to be so on service.

 

[jeff79m]

I just bought a L2800 (2008 Model) and the beginning of December and seem to have the same problem. So far I have on put on a PHD but when I raise it it bounces so hard I am glad I'm wearing my seat belt. Does anybody now what the part number is on the valve that doesn't have problems. Also this is my first tractor, I haven't even used a different one, what is normal operation on the hitch? Should raising be as smooth as lowering on a tractor with position control? Also mechanically what is going on? How does the fluid travel through the valve to lift the hitch? Can a bad valve be modified?

 

[Reg]

I would like to see this problem in action.
Anyone within reasonable diving distance of Worcester Mass care to show me ?
Both the too fast raise and the jerky.

We might differ on what is a "reasonable diving distance", but I travel quite a bit anyway so could probably take a detour.

 

[jeconn]

Watch Toy Camry's videos in post 56. The JD is how the L2800 and L3400 are supposed to work. His video of the Kubota is what we are complaining about. Jeff79m I'm sure your 2800 is like the one in the video. No matter what your dealer will tell you this is NOT normal. Reg your welcome to see my 3ph in action, I'm just down the road from you. Probably only 1000 miles or so.

 

[Reg]

Watch Toy Camry's videos in post 56. The JD is how the L2800 and L3400 are supposed to work. His video of the Kubota is what we are complaining about. Jeff79m I'm sure your 2800 is like the one in the video. No matter what your dealer will tell you this is NOT normal. Reg your welcome to see my 3ph in action, I'm just down the road from you. Probably only 1000 miles or so.

Linden, NC is a distinct possibility "before the holidays", how close is that ?
(-:

 

[jeconn]

It's about 200 miles. I'm in Hudson.

I finally did get a Kubota rep to admit that my 3ph is not working right. It is not the rep for my area so I don't know if he will be able to do anything about it or not. He is supposed to get back with me Monday. I hope he can help but I'm not getting my hopes up.

 

[jeconn]

Good thing I didn't get my hopes up. At first he admitted I had a problem, then he spoke with another rep and they got their stories straight and now my problem is not really a problem. It's just an economy tractor and that is how it is supposed to work. BS.

 

[Harvest Moon]

Just herd from a credible source that the newest L3400 and L2800 tractors have been "upgraded" to control valve YR90800102.

Several pervious posters that have had their hitches upgraded to reasonable level of performance and satisfaction have had control valve 31351-39604 installed.... the same valve that was integrated into production about the same time we stopped seeing complaints about new machines.

Looks like Kubota may have taken a step backwards with their new valve. Seems to explain this thread.

I'd say, new L3400 and L2800 owners having problems or concerned buyers should consider valve 31351-39604 for their tractors if they want the best performance so far reported. Definitely hesitate to have a new tractor upgraded to valve YR90800102, that's probably the problem, not the solution.

 

[teg]

Good job, Harvest Moon... A+

 

[canoetrpr]

Thats some 'upgrade' eh?

 

[jeconn]

How much for this new (old) valve? I would hate to put it on my tractor and it not be any better. Is it a diy job to replace it?

 

[Harvest Moon]

$372.63 at Tractorsmart.com. 31351-39604 ASSY VALVE,CONTROL

Looks like more than an average DIY job but not impossible. You'd need a Work Shop Manual. No one's ever reported doing it themselves here that I've read.

As far as weather or not it will help... please note that I've only shared my research and I've not seen or read any reports of anyone going backwards to valve 31351-39604. It's pure speculation untill someone tries it.

You would need to confirm that your tractor does have this new valve YR90800102 and take your chances. Best of luck to anyone who tries! Let us know.

BTW, I'm still considering that the lowering speed valve may be part of the overall performance package but without some testimony from L2900, L3000 and or L3010 users about their position controls performance with the same valve, 31351-39604 it hard to even guess.

 

[jeconn]

I spoke with Kubota rep Joe Cunningham and he asked the service tech about slowing down the speed of raising the 3ph and the tech told him that the only way was to slow the engine rpm's. I asked about the knob under the seat and the tech told him it only affected the lowering. Makes me wonder about the people who say that knob had some effect on raising. He also said he did'nt know of anything that would fit and work better. Is there a part # on my valve somewhere so I can tell which valve I have? I would hate to replace it with the same thing I already have.

 

[Harvest Moon]

jeconn

Two things and a few others:

1) My 3 point jerks just fine at lower RRMs.. you could say it's better but it's still the same jerky function. I once read that the L3010 valve is larger than earlier L3400/L2800 valves and allows a slower flow but I don't know if it's true.

2) And, I dare try to stop short of calling anyone a lier but I can site two other examples where Kubota has intentionally stepped in the way of achieving maximum versatility for my L3400... I don't trust ANYTHING they say:

A) Kubota refused my dealer on selling me a QA from a LA513 for an LA463. I got one anyway after confirming IDENTICAL part numbers to the QA available with the LA463-1. The loader frame is identical too.. no extra stops once referred to by a Kubota loyal dealer poster.

B) Kubota INSISTED that the LA463 grill guard is not suitable for suitcase weights and that I'd have to buy a special weight bracket. But they specify the same LA463 guard (L2233A) for 4 weights on on other tractor models.
See here for an explanation: http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/.../125439-l3400-la463-grill-guard-suitcase.html

Several people have commented about the lowering speed valve.. atleast one on a dealer recommendation. The knob is a simplified version of the one shared by the L2900, L3000 and L3010 and these tractors share same position control valve of many L3400 and L2800. Although, most people who've been upgraded to the L3010 valve have not been compelled to seek further improvement.

I'm not saying the lowering speed valve is going to turn out to be important but I am saying if it can be swapped out with one from a L3010, like the position control, Kubota likely would not want us to know. They have already taken to defending their new 3 point valve and discrediting the older version.

I have to wonder why the lowering valve has been simplified from the model in the "Grand" tractors. Kubota may say for economy, I'm only asking at what cost.

Where you have to trust Kubota is with the valve number. There must be a S/N change and if the newest parts books don't reflect it you'll need Mr. Kubota to tell you which valve is in your tractor.

If you want more info., ask your contact a) which valve is in your tractor and b) which valve is in the draft control version of the newest tractors and c) why the draft control version had always had valve 31351-39604 in it.

Draft control won't work with the sloppy jerky valve and Kubota has know it since day one. I'd be really really surprised if their newest valve made it into the draft controlled tractors.

 

[ccsial]

Thats some 'upgrade' eh?

Like Microsoft Vista and many other things, here is another example of the latest not being the greatest.

Another dumb move.

 

[teg]

At home, I was cleaning up the computer and found that before I had my valves replaced, I have video of playing with the knob (open and closing it) at high rpms (and I also think at Low rpms). I was planning to post them but ran out of time. I'm sorry I didn't find the time... I'm in Chattanooga until next Sunday. I'll be running by the farm for a day or two and plan to take more video of the new valve in the same setup as the before shoots (with boompole attached). Hopefully, early next week, I'll have more posted on youtube.

<--- Triple nickle post... 555 (with about 498 of them about a jerky valve )

 

[jeconn]

Harvest Moon, I definitely was not calling anyone a liar. I hope I didn't offend anyone. I also do NOT trust Kubota or their reps. My valve also jerks quite well at any rpm, so that is no solution. I am interested in seeing Teg's videos, he didn't say what effect his adjustment knob had. Just curious Teg, are you happy with the results of your replacement valve? Is draft control available for the 2800 and 3400? If so could that be a solution?

 

[emmy71]

These are from the L2800 manual. Hope it helps.

Terry