John Deere SAE0W-40 Plus 50 II Synthetic oil

[AKfish]

Thanks for the replies, I am interested in the improved fuel economy also.

VP

That's a valid consideration. However, the economics of that are typically based upon high hours of use or a large frame machine that has a high gallon/Hr consumption rate.

If you're only using your tractor ~100 hrs a year and your tractor only burns 0.5gal/hr - you're only burning 50 gallons of diesel fuel a year!

The $$ saving's per year are likely to be quite small... given the higher price of synthetic oil vs conventional oil - the difference might only be pocket change.

AKfish

 

[Victory Pete]

Please explain the more wear statement.:confused2:
Thanks

That is what I want to know.

VP

 

[Victory Pete]

Is this your first 50 hours? Or do you change every 50 hours? My owners manual says DO NOT switch to Plus 50 or API CG4 or higher, ACEA E3 or higher for the first 100 hours, since the engine is not considered broken in yet.

Yes it is, What tractor is your manual for? Are you supposed to change oil at 50 hours? My manual says I am supposed to.

VP

 

[eagle107]

That is what I want to know.

VP

Below is my last email discourse with my oil guy. I will ask him to clarify his statement. I am thinking he might have mistyped something, because when you read the specs on the JD 0w-40 synthetic oil it states that the JD oil is 100% PAO (Poly Alpha Olefin) synthetic oil. This is supposed to reduce engine wear and extend engine life. However, if you read the "features and benefits" on JD Plus 50 II 0W40 oil, it states that 0w40 is equal in wear reduction and antioxidation tests to Plus 50 15w40; so it seems Plus 50 or Plus 50 II 15w40 reduces engine wear also. If you use either one, you should be fine. Just as AKfish stated, you might not see a major fuel savings if you are only using 50 gallons or less of diesel fuel a year. I am pretty sure I fit in this category too.

Me:

I was wondering if you had an opportunity to review the specs and have any recommendations. I have been reading up on the oils a little. It looks like John Deere recommends that Plus 50 II Synthetic Engine Oil (0w40) and I think Esso Imperial makes it for JD. Below is the URL that gives more stats for the John Deere Plus 50 II Synthetic Engine Oil (0w40). Do not think this oil would be too light to run in the summer months due to the heat? Also, do you think Mobile 1 0w40 is comparable to the JD Plus 50 II Synthetic oil?

https://jdparts.deere.com/partsmkt/...65_fb_Plus5015W40_0W40.htm#_Plus_50_Synthetic

In addition, I went to the dealer this weekend. They want $9.00 a quart for the full 0w40 synthetic oil and $4.17 quart for the standard 15w40 oil. JD recommends to change the oil every 500 hours or once a year with a synthetic oil and 200 hours a year with regular oil. I only put on 50 to 100 hours a year on the tractor, so I would be changing the oil every year anyways. I am not sure how much benefit I would get out of the synthetic oil at that price. It looks like most people still use the JD Plus 50 II 15w40 oil. The factory specs/manual says I can use 15w40, 10w40, 10w30 or 5w40 with an API service classification CH or higher and ACEA specification E3 or higher. What do you think?

Oil Guy:

If John Deere specifies 0W-40 I would use it. The oil weight is a 40 so don't be fooled by the 0W. The 0W is how the oil flows at low temperature. New engines have very tight tolerances so don't be worried about the 0. As for the Mobil 1 0W-40 that is rated for auto /euro for SM/SN and is not rated for CJ Heavy Duty. Also the Mobil 1 is a synthetic but not a PAO like the John Deere.

If the factory spec is 0W-40 I would stay with that. As for a comparable product the John Deere is a PAO Full Synthetic so I could probably find something but what is the JD cost and oil change rate. The JD oil is calling for an extended change interval.

Oil changes are based on usage and not by time but people are told to believe that. Oil oxidation and TAN are the big basis point for oil changes so you oil could be kept in for longer than a year if tested. As for PAO versus conventional you will be getting engine wear, but better fuel mileage.

 

[Victory Pete]

Below is my last email discourse with my oil guy. I will ask him to clarify his statement. I am thinking he might have mistyped something, because when you read the specs on the JD 0w-40 synthetic oil it states that the JD oil is 100% PAO (Poly Alpha Olefin) synthetic oil. This is supposed to reduce engine wear and extend engine life. However, if you read the "features and benefits" on JD Plus 50 II 0W40 oil, it states that 0w40 is equal in wear reduction and antioxidation tests to Plus 50 15w40; so it seems Plus 50 or Plus 50 II 15w40 reduces engine wear also. If you use either one, you should be fine. Just as AKfish stated, you might not see a major fuel savings if you are only using 50 gallons or less of diesel fuel a year. I am pretty sure I fit in this category too.

Me:

I was wondering if you had an opportunity to review the specs and have any recommendations. I have been reading up on the oils a little. It looks like John Deere recommends that Plus 50 II Synthetic Engine Oil (0w40) and I think Esso Imperial makes it for JD. Below is the URL that gives more stats for the John Deere Plus 50 II Synthetic Engine Oil (0w40). Do not think this oil would be too light to run in the summer months due to the heat? Also, do you think Mobile 1 0w40 is comparable to the JD Plus 50 II Synthetic oil?

https://jdparts.deere.com/partsmkt/...65_fb_Plus5015W40_0W40.htm#_Plus_50_Synthetic

In addition, I went to the dealer this weekend. They want $9.00 a quart for the full 0w40 synthetic oil and $4.17 quart for the standard 15w40 oil. JD recommends to change the oil every 500 hours or once a year with a synthetic oil and 200 hours a year with regular oil. I only put on 50 to 100 hours a year on the tractor, so I would be changing the oil every year anyways. I am not sure how much benefit I would get out of the synthetic oil at that price. It looks like most people still use the JD Plus 50 II 15w40 oil. The factory specs/manual says I can use 15w40, 10w40, 10w30 or 5w40 with an API service classification CH or higher and ACEA specification E3 or higher. What do you think?

Oil Guy:

If John Deere specifies 0W-40 I would use it. The oil weight is a 40 so don't be fooled by the 0W. The 0W is how the oil flows at low temperature. New engines have very tight tolerances so don't be worried about the 0. As for the Mobil 1 0W-40 that is rated for auto /euro for SM/SN and is not rated for CJ Heavy Duty. Also the Mobil 1 is a synthetic but not a PAO like the John Deere.

If the factory spec is 0W-40 I would stay with that. As for a comparable product the John Deere is a PAO Full Synthetic so I could probably find something but what is the JD cost and oil change rate. The JD oil is calling for an extended change interval.

Oil changes are based on usage and not by time but people are told to believe that. Oil oxidation and TAN are the big basis point for oil changes so you oil could be kept in for longer than a year if tested. As for PAO versus conventional you will be getting engine wear, but better fuel mileage.

I wonder about the "More Wear" comment. I also wonder about the yearly change. I was under the impression because Synthetic is not biodegradeable it doesnt have to be changed with time like conventional oil. I have got some thinking to do before I change my order.

VP

 

[eagle107]

I wonder about the "More Wear" comment. I also wonder about the yearly change. I was under the impression because Synthetic is not biodegradeable it doesnt have to be changed with time like conventional oil. I have got some thinking to do before I change my order.

VP

Just an FYI. Based on the URL link I provided on my previous post (https://jdparts.deere.com/partsmkt/d...s_50_Synthetic) JD states that for all Plus II oils, which includes the 0w40 synthetic oil, that the oil change intervals below should be followed.

Service Intervals

Oil and filter service intervals in John Deere diesel engines are based on a combination of factors, including:

1. The type of engine oil and filter in the application

2. The Sulfur content of the diesel fuel

3. The volume of oil in the system

4. Power output of the engine



We recommend changing the oil and oil filter at least once every 12 months, even if the hours of operation are fewer than the otherwise recommended service interval.

Again this is a recommendation by the manufacturer and you do not always have to follow them, however, I tend to. I am by no means an expert in this stuff as other members are, but I think over time as you use your diesel engine, it creates ash (from additives (low ash oils produce less, but it is still there)) and sludge (Sludge is the organic (carbon based) byproducts of combustion: resins, soot, unburned fuel and moisture) which ends up going into your oil and, if enough, could start causing premature engine wear; I guess it does not matter if the ash and/or sludge is in synthetic or regular oil, it is still ash and/or sludge. If you want to keep your synthetic oil in your tractor for more than a year, you might need to have an oil analysis done to see how your oil fairs over a year's use.

In addition, I just received confirmation from my oil guy that 0w40 does not cause wear. His remark is below:


Me:

I am not sure if your last email had a typo or not, but it seems you stated that the JD 0w40 100% PAO synthetic oil would make my tractor’s engine wear more, but give me better fuel mileage. Is this correct, because JD states that the 0w40 should provide better wear reduction and extend engine life?

Oil Guy:

No I did not say the 0W-40 would cause more wear but as JD stated it will give better protection and the oil life will last longer and extend engine life.

 

[Zebrafive]

Yes it is, What tractor is your manual for? Are you supposed to change oil at 50 hours? My manual says I am supposed to.

VP

Full size Tractor 6415. Break in oil first 100 hours. Then every 250 hours unless using JD PLUS-50, then every 500 hours.

Did not realize JD had such a short change interval, for your machine, 50 hours. I thought you might be changing too soon. Some poeple like to do a first oil change real early, but still run break in oil until they have 100 hours.

 

[Victory Pete]

Thanks all for the help, I have changed my order to the 0W-40 Plus 50 II Synthetic. Now I have to get back to work grading my "Clay Riddled" driveway, hours are just about to turn over to 50! It is almost 70 degrees here in RI already, Spring is here! Bring on the Deeres!

VP

 

[Victory Pete]

If it helps you choose, your tractor does not have an IT4 engine. Until MY2012, that applied to 175-750hp engines. This year they added 75-149hp engines. Our CUTs are still Tier 3 for a couple more years, until MY2014 I think. But these oils are backward compatible. There's no problem with using an oil that's rated better than you actually need (except for those flat tappet cam guys).

//greg//

What is the difference between IT3 and IT4 engines?

VP

 

[greg_g]

Typographical error. IT3 should have been T3 (EPA Tier 3). IT4 is Interim Tier 4. Eventually IT4 will migrate to T4 (Tier 4). These are increasingly stringent limitations that the EPA has put on diesel emissions. Can't give many specifics, but generically the difference will likely be in the engine tuning, the addition of a DPF (diesel particulate filter), and possibly a catalyst. All new diesels between 50 and 750 hp are now IT4, under 50hp moves to IT4 in MY2014. T4 is the final and most stringent standard, but that's down the road a piece yet.

//greg//