JD 3720 vs NH TC33DA

[Homeboy]

So for a few months now I have been settled on the JD 3720 with a FEL and backhoe (300cx/448), and just went to buy it from a dealer ... who also handles NH ... and had a TC33DA with FEL on the lot ...

I had only considered the Kubota Grand L's as a competitor but liked the JD better ... so thanks in advance for for recomending Kubota and the Chinese brands, but I already ruled them out for various reasons /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif

but now that I saw the NH I'm not sure - ignore the fact that JD has a cheaper, more comparable "3320" within their product line, because within the JD line I already decided I'd pay more for the extra power of the 3720 over the 3320 - basically, my reasons for prefering each are

JD

- prefer slightly the ergo (nice, but not huge difference)
- 3720 has 33% more horsepower for 12% more money (based upon my actual dealer quotes) - never know when the HP might be handy, even if I think I probably don't need it
- many dealers in my area
- 15 versus 25 miles to nearest dealer (not a big consideration)
- certain items (FEL bucket) seemed stronger construction

NH

- SuperSteer option (not included in current quoted price)
- includes certain items (3-point telescoping, telescoping steering wheel) not included (or available) in JD price
- 2400 versus 2900 lbs. (maybe NOT an advantage if I never end up using it for lawn work, which I currently don't plan to use it for but want to allow for down the line - I could always buy a zero turn if I add that application)
- certain items (FEL, engine access, swivel seat) seemed better designed

I know NH has more powerful models TC40..), but they are larger then the TC33DA, which is as large a size as I want - this is a key reason I didn't like the Kubota - I want a more compact package - that means I'm left comparing the JD 3720 to the NH TC33DA

(... you notice price is not a key part of my criteria, though of course the NH is cheaper).

The dealer (who seems to favor NH and stocks many fewer JD models) is clearly pushing me to the NH, arguing I'm paying for extra power I won't need, and favors my adding the SuperSteer option.

so the biggest issue seems to come down to the greater JD horsepower I'm not sure I'll need (but would gladly pay for within the JD line) versus the SuperSteer I'm not sure I'll benefit from, but certainly seems a nice feature since I have many trees ...

... and then, of course, there are all the other reasons I mentioned to consider ...

<font color="red"> </font> would you but the SuperSteer if you were buying the NH, because if I'm not I'll probably still favor JD ...

I know, the generalised "which is better, JD or NH" question /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif but with a fairly specific set of decision points /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif

THANKS! /forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[pdub]

3720 has 33% more horsepower for 12% more money

Make sure you compare PTO horsepower, not gross engine horsepower. PTO horsepower is the useable power at the PTO or drawbar. The PTO hp of the 3720 is 35, while the PTO hp of the TC33DA is 27. So while the gross engine horsepower is way off (44 vs 33), the PTO hp difference isn't as large. Some manufacturers don't even advertise PTO hp because of poor driveline efficiency.

prefer slightly the ergo (nice, but not huge difference)

Remember with the NH you have a swivel seat, tilt AND telescoping steering, seat on an incline plane, and much better visibility. Ergo is subjective, so this is up to you.

certain items (FEL bucket) seemed stronger construction

The 300X does lift slightly more (it is a larger frame size), but the components are actually built heavier on the 14LA. The 14LA (15LA if you get supersteer) does have better reach though. As far as loader construction, look at the torque tube widths. The NH torque tube is much wider. 10 bolts hold on the NH mid mount brackets, while 4 bolts hold on the JD mid mount brackets. Not to mention an adjustable loader joystick and simulatneous raise and curl valve on the NH.

would you but the SuperSteer if you were buying the NH, because if I'm not I'll probably still favor JD ...

Supersteer cuts the turning radius by 40%. If you will be doing some mowing and there are some obstacles, you will definitely be happier with supersteer. Its the same idea as a zero turn mower, its going to decrease the amount of time it takes to get the job done if you can zip around obstacles or in and out of tight spaces easily. Also with Supersteer you will get a longer wheelbase 72" NH vs 68" JD (to give room for the front axle oscillating). Finally, you also get Sensitrak when you get Supersteer. Sensitrak automatically engages and disengages FWD. The benefit of this is that is protects turf (especially nice if the wife might be mowing), reduces front tire wear, and increases driveline component life (so in the end it will pay for itself!!!).

includes certain items (3-point telescoping, telescoping steering wheel) not included (or available) in JD price

Don't forget Mid-PTO. Did the 3720 have this installed? You will need this if you ever want a mid mount mower or front snowblower. You also get flex link ends standard. And a bucket level indicator on the 14LA (opt on the 300X).

certain items (FEL, engine access, swivel seat) seemed better designed

As far as engine access, both have flip up hoods but the NH has a gas strut assist instead of a prop rod. A steel subframe keeps the hood from flexing on the NH... the JD hood flexes quite a bit when in the vertical position. Also, look at the flow-through radiator on the NH, four headlights versus two, etc etc....

In the end both tractors will get the job done... but for less money and all of the features that I mentioned, I think you would be better off with the TC33DA.

 

[Homeboy]

pdub,

that was really helpful, thanks - I'm going to ask the dealer to add SuperSteer and Sensitrak to the quote and see how that turns out ...

Your PTO point is well taken, but 35 vs. 27 is still a 30% power difference - the main reason I care is I may buy my brother in laws PTO driven chipper, which I've been told is a huge PTO HP hog

I'm torn on whether to buy a separate mower if I ever start mowing, or to add a mower to the tractor (in which case SuperSteer would be great).

on the FEL construction, I was confused when I wrote my note - it was the backhoe bucket on the Kubota which was sticking in my mind and which was much heavier then the NH backhoe bucket - the FEL bucket on the JD and NH were about the same ...

I really appreciate your comments on the torque tube and FEL construction, something I wouldn't have known to consider ...

ciao

 

[timb]

There's a lot of differences between those two tractors. There's nothing at all wrong with the TC33DA - I was very tempted by the TC33 early on when I first started looking at compacts. But IMO you're comparing tractors that are nearly in two different size and power classes.

Compare not just the rated PTO hp but the engines peak torque numbers, the torque rise %, and the speed at which that occurs. This will help give you some insight into how much 'grunt' each has. I couldn't come up with the numbers quickly. The 3720 has a turbocharged diesel (that tends to helps grunt), the TC33DA is normally aspirated

The 3720 has a 13.5 gallon fuel tank, the TC33DA a 7.3 gallon tank.

The 3720 has a 3-point hitch rating of 2200lbs @ 24" back, the TC33DA just 1635 lbs.

The 3720 has 13.9gpm combined hydraulic output, The TC33DA a 12.7 gpm.

The 3720 has a max. vertical drawbar load of 882 lbs, the TC33DA ?

The 3720 has front/rear axle ratings of 3197lb/5292lb (?) the TC33DA ? (I'm not convinced of those numbers for the Deere, might be a typo (sounds high on the rear axle)).

This could go on for awhile, - the point is you need to dig deep sometimes to find all the real differences. Check the brake/hydro pedal layouts, rear drive types, etc.,.

 

[rockyridgefarm]

You have already got some great info. Both are great machines.

One thing. Supersteer isn't perfect. While it really helps with mowing, it is quirky for loader work. You really ought to try all three (TC33DA-SS, TC33DA, and 3720...) doing actual loader maneuvering. I am not saying you'd prefer one, just that you might be surprised. I know one owner that did some real interesting modifications on his home with a Supersteer machine, when it lurched one way when he was going the other...

Finally, there is also the Deere 3520, still turbocharges (sans intercooler) and a little between the other two machines. But you already said you aren't looking down...

Telescopic draft links and iMatch both are low cost options on Deere. They are really pushing iMatch which is why the telescopic links arfe an option.

The Steering wheel doesn't telescope, but the seat is fully adjustable instead of the inclined plane. You can raise the seat up in the far front position and down in the rear, or wherever you want. I love mine, it is a great seat, and yellow sure is cooler in the sun. I haven't tried the air suspension, but hear its awesome.

I wonder sometimes about two line dealerships. Why they end up pushing one over the other? Is it because it's better for them or you?

But both are great machines...

 

[grwoolf]

I bought the TC33Da hydro about a month back. I also looked at the JD 3320, but it was about $3k higher and I liked the features of the NH more. I didn't get supersteer. I really like the machine so far, but I have only used for loader and box blade work. The things I really liked on the NH:

telescoping arms
cruise control (for mowing)
skid-steer compatible quick release on loader
size and weight of machine (plan to mow some day)

 

[Keith_B]

Wouldn't the TC35DA be a closer comparison to the 3720?

 

[rockyridgefarm]

By Hp, yes, but the 3720 is a mid chassis machine. (ClassII in Boomerish)

 

[pdub]

Actually a TC45DA would be the best comparison if you are only looking at horsepower because it is 45 hp vs 44hp. It isn't really a fair comparison though because the NH is a higher spec'd tractor. Its irrelevant anyway, since Homeboy wrote that he was aware that the 3320 would be a more fair comparison to the TC33DA.

The 3020 series isn't really a "class II in Boomerish" tractor, it is somewhere in between NH's class II and class III, in terms of frame size, weight, and basic specs. It sure is hard to find an "apples to apples" comparison nowadays!!!

Anyway, since the basic question that started this discussion was whether or not Supersteer is worth the money, I would suggest that you (Homeboy) go the the NH forum and ask for advice from Supersteer owners, i.e whether they are happy with the performance, reliability etc. This would probably give you better feedback than listening to a bunch of us who don't own Supersteer (although I have used a SS TC33DA multiple times).

 

[rockyridgefarm]

Excellant point! Talk to owners but most importantly try one yourself. I am not an owner because I did, yet, others may LOVE it! Your mileage may vary!

 

[Homeboy]

You all are great - the little points that you learn in these discussions make the difference ...

I went and checked out the 3720 back to back with the TC33DA and the 3720 was definitely more comfortable for me (because I'm qute tall, I suspect). The NH was good, but the JD was better ...

I also concluded that the 3720 had some advantages for loader work (it helped that I met a guy who used to sell NH) - again, the NH could be excellent, but I preferred the JD. I did like the design of the NH arms (and their one piece construction) but concluded it wasn't a decision point issue.

The JD also mounted the backhoe to the frame instead of subframe, which seemed better - opinions? It certainly left more clearance and seemed stronger.

I was advised that on the NH you MIGHT be able to leave the 3-point hitch on with the backhoe, instead of removing it every time - a nice convenience if possible - anybody know?

I did like the SuperSteer a lot, but there were issues manuvering a FEL in tight spaces. I've decided that if I mow I'll buy a separate mower.

So, I think I've really decided on the 3720 mainly because of the power ... but I still have not bitten the bullet ...

The JD salesman has advised me against adding the telescoping links (I don't want IMatch because I'll rent most implements). He feels most implements are easily hand manuvered into place, and the arms get dirty etc. Any opinions on this?

 

[rockyridgefarm]

On the hoe mount, I knew NOTHING about Deere's setup when I got mine,. But it is nothing short of amazing. Removing the arms is a GOOD thing, it allows the hoe to get closer to the tractor, and only takes a couple of minutes. The whole swap for the loader or hoe is a very fast and easy deal.

I have never heard a single complaint about the telescopic draft links. That said, get the std. ones, and add them later, if you want them. There is no difference in price, and you end up with a spare set.

 

[pdub]

The JD also mounted the backhoe to the frame instead of subframe, which seemed better - opinions? It certainly left more clearance and seemed stronger.

I like the subframe on the NH because it ties into the loader subframe and takes all of the load off the tractor frame. This is done so there isn't a large amount of torsion on the tractor frame. Personally, I fell this is a more durable and reliable setup.

In my experience flex link ends are essential, especially if you aren't going with the iMatch. Unless you participate in one of those strong man competitions, you won't be able to lift some rear implements to hook them up. Even on my little TZ it would come in handy. Your Deere dealer was probably steering you clear of this because it is a $406 option (according to JD website).

 

[rockyridgefarm]

$210 = are you moixing up with the midpto?

 

[timb]

The extendable links are worth every penny. That 3720 will be able to handle some heavy implements, and those links wil make the job far easier. That ain't no garden tractor. I've had zero trouble with mine. NH includes them as standard and IMO Deere should do so as well.

But the advice about buying later is good (double check the prices both ways to be sure) - I paid the same for mine (added before delivery) as other folks did later off the shelf - and they still have their standard arms for backup if ever needed.

 

[HuskerInVA]

I concur on the extendable links. Get them. They are worth it and really should be standard. I got mine separate from the tractor and now I have the spare set just in case I break something.

 

[Dutch445]

Don't forget about the Pat's Easy Change system if you are unsure about the extendable links, or don't want the I-Match. They offer a nice compromise.
/forums/images/graemlins/cool.gif

 

[MessickFarmEqu]

For loader subframes I think Woods has been building more advanved mounts than any of the OEM companies. Most of their new 4pt frames are mid mount mower compatible and don't require removal of the 3pt arms. They make mounts for just about any tractor. Bradco makes simular kits.

 

[Homeboy]

Messick,

can you explain this a little further to me, as the alternative ways to put a tractor together are foreign to me? Are you saying you would buy a bare (NH/JD) tractor and a separate woods subframe and backhoe, then attach the subframe and backhoe?

I am assuming a direct frame attachment (JD method) is superior to using a subframe (NH method) as the main frame is more rugged. Is this not correct?

I also see you are a NH dealer Messick, so I'd be interested in your opinion of the JD 3720 versus the NH TC33 - as previously mentioned, I'm probably not interested in the bigger NH tractors because they jump up in physical size

- the JD dealer has dropped the price to match the NH, so I'm definitely planning on that one currently (I probably already was, because it was significantly more powerful, seemed more rugged construction, and was more comfortable to sit on).

thanks