JD 2130 Transmission

[squera1]

G'day all from Australia
this is my first time on any forum, so bear with me while I learn the ropes!
I'm posting on behalf of a farmer friend who has a John Deere 2130 which he bought 2nd hand.
it has an occasional transmission problem, particularly when loaded;
driving along on hand throttle, revs don't change one bit but the power steering gets heavy and the tractor gets slower and slower until it stops completely (with the motor still revving).
I think I could hear a pump cavitating when it happened to me, but I'm not sure... If you turn off engine and wait about 5 minutes, tractor runs normally again - maybe for 10 minutes, maybe for 2-3 days.
the bit that really confuses me is that it has a manual transmission and manual clutch which seem to work exactly as expected; there's no fluid transmission in the drive line that I'm aware of, but all the problems seem to be a lack of transmission fluid!
the hydraulic oil level checks OK, and it has had a new hydraulic oil filter.
can anyone offer a suggestion as to what problem I might be looking for and how to fix it?
sorry for being a bit "long-winded" but I'm trying to eliminate 100 questions about what,when & where the problem occurs!
Thanks in advance

 

[AKfish]

G'day all from Australia
this is my first time on any forum, so bear with me while I learn the ropes!
I'm posting on behalf of a farmer friend who has a John Deere 2130 which he bought 2nd hand.
it has an occasional transmission problem, particularly when loaded;
driving along on hand throttle, revs don't change one bit but the power steering gets heavy and the tractor gets slower and slower until it stops completely (with the motor still revving).
I think I could hear a pump cavitating when it happened to me, but I'm not sure... If you turn off engine and wait about 5 minutes, tractor runs normally again - maybe for 10 minutes, maybe for 2-3 days.
the bit that really confuses me is that it has a manual transmission and manual clutch which seem to work exactly as expected; there's no fluid transmission in the drive line that I'm aware of, but all the problems seem to be a lack of transmission fluid!
the hydraulic oil level checks OK, and it has had a new hydraulic oil filter.
can anyone offer a suggestion as to what problem I might be looking for and how to fix it?
sorry for being a bit "long-winded" but I'm trying to eliminate 100 questions about what,when & where the problem occurs!
Thanks in advance

Does the tractor have either the Hi/Lo option or the Reverser option for the transmission? Should be a lever on the console just to the left of the steering wheel. Has a "rabbit or turtle" symbol for the Hi/Lo and a Forward or Reverse (R) for the reverser.

AKfish

 

[squera1]

I don't have access to the tractor at the moment - it's on my friend's farm about 500 miles away, but I don't remember seeing a Hi/lo or forward/reverse control with rabbit/tortoise.
It has a 4 speed manual transmission with a separate stick to select high range (gears 5,6,7 & 8), Low range, reverse and a park position (which locks up the drive insted of a park brake)
low range and reverse work in whichever gear is selected between 1-4
I'll be finishing for the day very shortly, so it might be tomorrow (my time) before i can respond to anymore questions!
thanks
Steve

 

[Tx Jim]

I think your friends tractor must have the hyd hi-lo which when it stops moving isn't getting enough trans pump pressure. Correct psi should be in the 165# range. I would recommend correcting the problem before this clutch pack has to be repaired. IIRC there are ports to check psi on shift cover(2nd photo). Presuming the tractor is an open-station the hyd hi-lo control lever would be on LH side of dash & should look similar to 3rd photo.

 

[AKfish]

I think your friends tractor must have the hyd hi-lo which when it stops moving isn't getting enough trans pump pressure. Correct psi should be in the 165# range. I would recommend correcting the problem before this clutch pack has to be repaired. IIRC there are ports to check psi on shift cover(2nd photo). Presuming the tractor is an open-station the hyd hi-lo control lever would be on LH side of dash & should look similar to 3rd photo.

That's where I was goin' with my questions.. Although, given the symptoms (OK, for 2-3 hours or several days) I'm thinking that he might have brake lining, etc. on the hyd. pickup for the Hi/Lo pump. Stuff falls off enough to allow sufficient fluid pick-up and then it closes off again.

AKfish

 

[Tx Jim]

That's where I was goin' with my questions.. Although, given the symptoms (OK, for 2-3 hours or several days) I'm thinking that he might have brake lining, etc. on the hyd. pickup for the Hi/Lo pump. Stuff falls off enough to allow sufficient fluid pick-up and then it closes off again.

AKfish

My experience on tractors with a plugged hyd screen was once screen coated over with debris it stayed coated. It is possible that the hyd filter by-pass valve may be the culprit. Irregardless the problem needs to be repared before the hi-lo clutches are toast.

 

[squera1]

thanks guys
the fact that I now know there's a hydraulic coupling in the drive line has given me some insight in to what I'm looking for.
it'll be a couple of months before I get back up to the farm and can confirm my suspicions, but I think the suction screen for the hydraulic pump pick-up might be blocked .
what is the Hi/Lo shift lever meant to do for tractor operation, because it does have the lever to the left of steering column, but from memory, it doesn't seem to do anything!
what should I be looking for to determine if Hi/Lo is working?

 

[jd110]

When shifting the hi/lo, there should be a very noticeable shift in speed. pulling lever towards you shifts into high and pushing forward shifts to low. If working properly, it is a very crisp, abrubt shift.

 

[Zebrafive]

Shifting the HI-LO from Hi to LO is like downshifting one gear.
I agree most likely cause is a dirty suction screen.
Low hydraulic oil level will cause slipping, but I have not seen it to cause a complete stop. My 2030 will slip on an incline if the fluid is low.

 

[Tx Jim]

When shifting the hi/lo, there should be a very noticeable shift in speed. pulling lever towards you shifts into high and pushing forward shifts to low. If working properly, it is a very crisp, abrubt shift.

JD110
Sorry but you stated backwards operation. Forward is high speed,rearward is low speed.

 

[Tx Jim]

squera1
The hyd hi-lo is capable of being shifted on the go up or down. As stated there should be a noticeable speed change between the 2 speeds.

 

[Zebrafive]

JD110
Sorry but you stated backwards operation. Forward is high speed,rearward is low speed.

Actually I think you have it backwards. Lever forward = LO = Turtle. Lever backward = HI = Rabbit

 

[Tx Jim]

Sorry for my mistake and thanks for correcting me. It's been a long time since I've seen a JD utility with the hyd hi-lo.

 

[Zebrafive]

The 39 year old 2030 in my avatar has HI-LO, that's how I know

 

[buickanddeere]

Front pump has nothing to do with transmission high/low , reverser or hydraulic engaged independent pto if optioned with such.
Odds are that the transmission screen has been in there for 37 years is covered with floating goo.
Trans oil should be drained, flushed and filled with Hy-Gard.
Wet sleeve engine should have the coolant corrosion inhibitor checked with a chemical test strip from a diesel shop. The sleeves/liners tend to cavitate and leak if not protected.
Is there a loader or other hydraulic attachment on the tractor?

 

[squera1]

Yes, has a loader with opening "clam" bucket, but it wasn't in use when the problem occurred!

 

[buickanddeere]

Loader does not have to be in use to cause problems. Where is the loader supplied from? What kind of control valve?

 

[squera1]

I don't actually know where it's supplied from, but loader is available whenever motor is running...(not the PTO hydraulics)
From memory, control valves are on a 4 way stick to the right of the dashboard, with a solenoid button to select clam operation.
I don't know if it's "open spool" or "closed spool" Hydraulic control valving;

 

[buickanddeere]

There is a pto pump on the tractor as well as the factory pumps ?
The transmission pump is a low 165lb pressure pump with approx 4-5gpm. It applies the hydraulic pto clutch and brake if optioned with such. The trans pump also supplies either reverser clutch packs or high low clutch packs if equipped with either of those options. Then the trans pump supplies filtered oil to h transmission bearings. Any remaining oil is pumped up front to the high pressure pump and the cooler/reservoir . If the front pump demand is minimal and the cooler/reservoir is full. Cooled oil flows back to the transmission sump.
If the loader joystick internals are open Center or if an o'ring has failed in a closed Center valve. It will make the front pump operate at max capacity.
The control valve for the "grapple" must be closed Center or it will cause problems.
Loader oil should be supplied from a "T" in the high pressure line that supplies the rocks haft and scv valves.
Oil must must must be returned to a ported hydraulic filter cover. Dumping oil direct the transmission sump will starve and capitate the 12gpm or 18gpm front high pressure pump.
Odds are as others have suggested . That the transmission oil screen and/or the filter is full of ick and goo.
If that ick and goo is fine grey metal due to worn out brake linings. It may cost more to repair the tractor than what it's worth.
Using the wrong oil that is not wet clutch compatible. Or if the oil is contaminated with dirt or water. That will make the friction material peel off the clutches and brakes. Very bad news.

 

[squera1]

Thanks for the info; it will be Easter before I get another chance to visit the farm where the tractor lives; Im planning a transmission oil change, filter change and suction screen clean as a starting point, then I'll try to do some more diagnosis if these don't show anything obvious!
How is the oil suction screen held in? (It's not obvious from the parts exploded drawings). Once the plug is removed, does the screen just pull out, or is it mounted somehow else? I'm presuming it slips over (or into) a fitting at the opposite end to the plug, but I'd rather be fore-warned if there are any tricks to removing it!
I'll also have a close look at the loader hydraulic oil return, since I'm told the loader was added when the tractor was already a few years old.
thanks for all your help!