Is the ROPS really needed?

   / Is the ROPS really needed? #91  
I also noticed that you didn't have the low side stabilizer down. You likely realize this now, but that should have been the first thing to go down so it levelled up the TLB, then the off side then the FEL bucket last when working on a slope. ON level ground it doesn't much matter, but I usually put down the FEL first because it will level front to rear easily.

I was getting ready to back up while peeling an edge off the bank to level it out which I had done many times over the years so wouldn't have had feet down. Doing it over today I'd lower BH boom/arm all the way down and out and swing it around to uphill side and could even lower the down hill side leg down near the ground for extra safety.
Even better would have been to use the BH to peel off edge while sitting perfectly level on the concrete but again, getting away with something a hundred times gets one to thinking doing it that way is OK.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #92  
The ROPS is the most dangerous thing on my tractor by far. It's sitting in my shed now.

Just curious as to what would prompt that statement? To me a ROPS may be inconvenient but I can't see it being dangerous.
I used to keep mine folded unless I was doing backhoe or loader work. One consistent theme regarding rollover is that if it happens, it will be fast and probably unexpected. Mine stays up all the time and seat belt is on.

Doug in SW IA
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #93  
When my 2660 went over on its right side I was reaching for the key to turn it off and was fortunate to be able to simply step off as it went over, avoiding the loader joystick, levers and pedals. Ole! It was a pretty athletic and very lucky sequence. The ROP landed against the Sequoia and held the tractor up off the ground preventing damage to the tractor. The ROP wasn't damaged either. It is inconvenient having the ROP at times, but given that I am occasionally given to being a complete nitwit, I guess I'll leave it in place.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #94  
From:
Rollover Protection for Farm Tractor Operators

"Tractor rollovers are the single deadliest type of injury incident on farms in the United States. The latest figures from the National Institute of Occupational Safety and Health (NIOSH) suggest there are approximately 130 tractor rollover fatalities per year."
...
" The tractor is the leading cause of death on the farm.

Tractors in the Northeast states have the highest rate of overturn deaths and the lowest percentage of tractors with ROPS.

The use of ROPS and a seat belt is estimated to be 99% effective in preventing death or serious injury in the event of a tractor rollover."




Bruce
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #95  
Hmmm. Not sure about that. If you weren't wearing the seat belt, and the tractor rolled, you could simply step away as it went over.

I'm pretty sure the ROPS is a .gov overkill deal.

When I was in college, I spent a summer working at a company that manufactured concrete steps. Normally, I worked on the actual production of the steps but they decided to spend a Saturday cleaning up the yard (they had broken sets of steps all over the place) and asked me if I'd come in to help. Three of us ran a TLB and two forklifts for the effort. I ran one forklift and the other guy running the forklift was cruising up and down the gravel lot at top speed. We told him to slow down more than once.

Shortly after one of us had told him to take it easy again he cruised by me, fish-tailed a bit, and then the forklift slid sideways, dug-in and fell over. He wasn't wearing his seatbelt (I wasn't either. Who wears a seatbelt when they're driving a forklift in a perfectly flat parking lot?) and instead of going along for the ride he panicked and tried to jump out of the forklift. He got most of the way out of it but the side of the cage came down on his ankle, shattering both bones. As he panicked more and struggled to free himself, his ankle elongated and twisted in a circle like a Stretch Armstrong doll. I had to kneel on his chest while I was talking to him and trying to calm him down so that he didn't cut any tendons or important plumbing with the sharp bone shards.

So I wouldn't count on being able to step away in a rollover. That cage could just have easily ended up on his chest or head.

Also, because of the way he and the forklift were positioned, I had to pick the forklift up off of him using just the tips of my forks. I curled back as much as I could while I very slowly lifted because I was terrified the forklift would end up on him a second time if the forks bent down enough to drop it.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #96  
Yep, I dont think anyone on here is going to come right out and say...go ahead and do it. Too much liability :D

But as Teg said....its YOUR tractor, and you know the risks.

I will say that I dont have ROPS on my L3400. I have never operated a tractor with ROPS until I got it 6 years ago. First time back in the woods and catching every tree branch that I ducked under....only to have the ROPS snag and smack me in the back of the head with:confused2:, I decided right then that the ROPS were comming off.

Sure, some said I sould have got folding ROPS, BUT....why spend that extra money just to leave them on and folded down. Because I know I would never put them up:laughing:

Your tractor....Your decision. Some are comfortable enough to remove the ROPS, others arent
When I first got my Ferris ZTR mower, I put up the ROPS but soon found that nowhere on my property are the hills steep enough to cause a rollover so I folded it down. I don't know how many limbs I have skinned the bark off of with that folded down ROPS. A couple weeks ago, It hung onto one of my 3" diameter pear tree limbs that sprouted off the main trunk about a foot from the bottom and broke it off which now makes the tree look lopsided. The next day, I took the ROPS off and put it in storage. I can now mow my yard without scraping limbs, breaking limbs or knocking off have my fruit crop.
If I were mowing with a BX and used it only for mowing with no FEL or backhoe on it AND the land was fairly level, I would remove it also. You land should be the decisive factor to determine if you have a possibility of a rollover, if not, take it off if you want to.
I wouldn't think about removing it from one of my tractors with FEL.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #97  
I would say ask my dad because he knew a lot about mowers and researched which ones were safest before he bought his lovely green BobCat zero radius. But you can't ask him because he ended up dead underneath that mower in the shallow end of our pond at age 62 after sliding down a slight slope and the mower rolled over on top of him. His mower did not come with a ROPs. Well everyone around this town gets a ROPS now. I bet if my dad could come back he'd suggest adding a ROPS because it might have been better to have had the mower roll on its side where he could unbuckle his seatbelt which he had on during the accident, by the way, and walk away from the mower than to be struggling under the mower, buckled into his seat and drowning under the weight of it. Yep he would be a big advocate for the good old ROPs device if he were still alive to tell.

Sorry to hear the story about your dad.
That was a horrible accident. Sorry you had to live through that. I'm also sorry no one could comment or acknowledge your heart felt 1st post here on TBN.
I hope you looked into legal action to see why it was not sold with a Rops.

There are strict US Federal Regulations in place about Rops and their required safety certification. Maybe the Rops was not required on the certain size of your fathers machine. I don't know. But if other manufacturers of similar size machines have them, and the company that made yours didn't have them, I would check into it if I were you. If one of my loved ones was hurt or killed because of someones willful neglect on not installing, or modifying a required safety device, you bet your bottom I would sue. That's a good reason to sue someone. Not a bad or unjustified reason.

There is one well known guy here on TBN that just cut a fellows Rops up and destroyed the factory safety certification that every Rops has. He had a customer that was too lazy to put it up and down. Too bad your father didn't have that option. He took it upon himself to cut it down and re work it. His thinking was at least now he will use it in the upright position. The tractor now has no safety certification for the Rops and he thinks he is some sort of hero now for doing it.

Not only that, he made a video to show others how to do it, others that may not have his skills in welding. Thus putting many more tractors sold down the road with unsafe untested Rops. Someday that tractor will be sold to some unsuspecting person. That person may never know if the Rops will hold up in a mishap. He will be riding around thinking he is protected. But the modified rops was never approved or tested.

Funny he wouldn't even drill a 1/4 inch hole in his rops to run a wire through it.
In the past he posted a number of times on a number of different sites that he never messes with his Rops and others shouldn't either. But hey cutting it down makes for a good video I guess.
Engineers design and test Rops for each tractor, the size, the height, how it bends, where it bends is all figured in for operators safety in case of a roll over, and it must be certified that it will hold up in an accident before the tractors are sold.
To destroy the certification of a Rops system or mislead someone into thinking that it's still certified down the road when the tractor is sold again, should be criminal.

If it was a U.S. Shop that modified Rops and Osha found out about it they would fine the daylights out of him.
Sorry for the loss of your dad but the point you made in your post and how you posted it was well taken. Hopefully your example will deter others from messing with the safety devices on their machines big or small. Thank you for sharing your story.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #98  
Sorry to hear the story about your dad.
That was a horrible accident. Sorry you had to live through that. I'm also sorry no one could comment or acknowledge your heart felt 1st post here on TBN.
I hope you looked into legal action to see why it was not sold with a Rops.

"snip"

Truly a sad story indeed. And not to make light of the situation, but guessing some operator error was in play? Mowing when too wet? or mowing on too steep of a grade right next to a pond?

It doesnt matter how many safety features are put on a machine, or how idiot proof it is, there will always be someone get hurt or killed.

Not sure about the laws of ROPS on zeroturns, but I am pretty sure a company like Bob-cat is in compliance with the law. That, with all the other safety features and several pages in the manual about safety, I think a lawsuit chances are nil.

I have been around equipment most of my life, and been around TBN for quite awhile now. When regarding safety features and such, it seems about everyone can be lumped into 2 groups.

Group 1: Those that feel that there are far too many safety devices already on machines, BUT, understand their purposes, and if they impede our operation of the machines, have the knowledge to modify them the way we see fit (if needed at all), and understand any and all consequences of our actions.

Group 2: Those who feel nothing should ever be done to any safety devices, feel there arent enough safety features, and feel the need to blame everyone else if something goes wrong, cause they feel no matter what they do or where they go with their machine, it shouldnt be capable of hurting them, because they dont have the common sense to know any better. Therefore we enlist the govt to try to idiot-proof everything in life.

One of my favorite sayings is "If we would remove all the safety devices and warning labels off everything, stupidity would cure itself".

OSHA is there to protect employees from being forced to do unsafe things by their employer, or to operate unsafe equipment. When it comes to private individuals like myself, OSHA has no jurisdiction. I can do what I want including removing the safety features which manufactures are forced to install, cause they dont know weather a I, or an employer is going to buy the machine. Same goes for a "shop" modifying the rops for a private individuals tractor. Even if that "shop" were in the USA, OSHA has no jurisdiction.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #99  
I think this event is representative of where we are today...

General Chuck Yeager was neighbor to my friend and mentor in Grass Valley CA... he was a space pioneer and broke the sound barrier. At one time the country had a can do attitude that sadly seems to be all but gone.

We have become a people concentrating on why we can't instead of why we can.

A rational person weighs the facts and then decides... it's not for me to second guess on matters that do not affect me... let alone in another country.

Tractor and Vehicles sold in North America are often North America specific because of liability fears...

Paul is very well qualified and his work speaks for itself... enough said.
 
   / Is the ROPS really needed? #100  
I guess I'm a bad boy. I put up the foldable ROPS 50% the time. I never wear the seat belt. I've bypassed the seat load switch ( had to for chipper ). I cut all my firewood without chaps. I can say, my first tractor had no ROPS, and I can say my present one has caused more scary moments than it has cured, by snagging branches and tree in the woods.
 

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