Is the Kubota L2501 the largest 25 hp, non regen tractor?

[jyoutz]

I noticed that people who favor a brand tend to be incredulous when faced with the fact that other brands are superior in some ways for less money.

Together as one

bransontractors.com

I don’t see anyone saying a brand is superior or inferior. There has been a lot of discussion pointing out that those loader lift capacities listed for Brandon and Kioti aren’t practical numbers. I have owned a light 2500# tractor and wouldn’t lift 1800# on the loader even it it were capable. The hydraulics may be capable of doing that, but a light short wheelbase and width tractor wouldn’t be very stable lifting that much weight, so it’s a meaningless “superiority.” That’s the point that lots of people are making.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

My only experience with modern tractors is with my Branson. Now it's not a 10 or 15 series, like what is being discussed, but a 25 series. A "mid sized CUT"?

My bare tractor weight is listed at 4200 lbs (cabbed unit), and that's without the loader. I think the loader and std bucket weighs 1500? I don't remember. What I do know, because I actually weighed mine on a certified CAT scale, is with Rimguard filled rear tires, the loader, and a light duty 6' box blade on, it weighs 7100 lbs.

I have never deliberately tried to "lift a ton to full height". I have lifted and carried large round bales:

I did not try to lift it to full height. Never needed to. I did lift it up and over the side of the feeder, which was 4 feet? I would have preferred more ballast on the 3 pt, but at the time I needed to feed the barrel, that is what was on it. Now I'm only guessing that the bale weighed between 1400-1600 lbs. I had no way to weigh them, nor did I really care. The center of the weight was certainly farther forward than "the pins".

I also lift this pallet of sand bags in and out of the bed of my pickup truck every winter:

I usually have between 22 and 24 bags of sand on that pallet, the bags weigh 60 pounds each, plus whatever the wooden pallet weighs. Again, I don't try to lift it to full height, but up to the level of my truck bed. Also, obviously I'm lifting well in front of "the pins".

This planter is the most weight I've ever tried to lift with my loader. When it was full of dirt, and I mean level with the top, it would not lift it. After refiguring the weight from the original math error (I was trying to set up a planter that I could pick up and carry). I came up with a "guesstimate" of 3000 pounds. Again, it would not lift it:

I then hand shovelled out a good amount (maybe half?), and it would lift it this far. Again, I'm not certain of the weight, I have no way to weigh it. As you can see, the center of the weight is much farther ahead of "the pins".

Looking at these lifts, bear in mind that I think (I honestly don't remember) my loader spec is 2200 pounds "at the pins". And that is to full height.

I have never tried to lift any serious weight by hanging it off the pins to check the spec. From my own seat of the pants "figuring", I think it would do it. Would I want to? Not if I had a choice. That much weight, that high in the air takes some serious attention. With enough weight on the 3 pt, and flat, level ground, like a concrete pad I think it would be fine. But moving it around? Dangling from a sling or chain? Yikes.

With as much weight as I have lifted from a normal "in front of the pins" setup, I believe it would do it (lift a ton from the pins).

So what I'm saying is, I believe the Branson spec on the smaller frame tractors too. Yes they will lift a ton at the pins. Whether that becomes a problem or not entirely depends on the operator, and what setup and precautions they've put in place. At least Branson, and I think the other Korean brands, they don't "Nanny" you. Yes the lift is there. Whether you know how to set up the equipment to make that lift safe or not, is up to you.

 

[jyoutz]

My only experience with modern tractors is with my Branson. Now it's not a 10 or 15 series, like what is being discussed, but a 25 series. A "mid sized CUT"?

My bare tractor weight is listed at 4200 lbs (cabbed unit), and that's without the loader. I think the loader and std bucket weighs 1500? I don't remember. What I do know, because I actually weighed mine on a certified CAT scale, is with Rimguard filled rear tires, the loader, and a light duty 6' box blade on, it weighs 7100 lbs.

I have never deliberately tried to "lift a ton to full height". I have lifted and carried large round bales:

View attachment 772859

I did not try to lift it to full height. Never needed to. I did lift it up and over the side of the feeder, which was 4 feet? I would have preferred more ballast on the 3 pt, but at the time I needed to feed the barrel, that is what was on it. Now I'm only guessing that the bale weighed between 1400-1600 lbs. I had no way to weigh them, nor did I really care. The center of the weight was certainly farther forward than "the pins".

I also lift this pallet of sand bags in and out of the bed of my pickup truck every winter:

View attachment 772860

I usually have between 22 and 24 bags of sand on that pallet, the bags weigh 60 pounds each, plus whatever the wooden pallet weighs. Again, I don't try to lift it to full height, but up to the level of my truck bed. Also, obviously I'm lifting well in front of "the pins".

This planter is the most weight I've ever tried to lift with my loader. When it was full of dirt, and I mean level with the top, it would not lift it. After refiguring the weight from the original math error (I was trying to set up a planter that I could pick up and carry). I came up with a "guesstimate" of 3000 pounds. Again, it would not lift it:

View attachment 772861


I then hand shovelled out a good amount (maybe half?), and it would lift it this far. Again, I'm not certain of the weight, I have no way to weigh it. As you can see, the center of the weight is much farther ahead of "the pins".

Looking at these lifts, bear in mind that I think (I honestly don't remember) my loader spec is 2200 pounds "at the pins". And that is to full height.

I have never tried to lift any serious weight by hanging it off the pins to check the spec. From my own seat of the pants "figuring", I think it would do it. Would I want to? Not if I had a choice. That much weight, that high in the air takes some serious attention. With enough weight on the 3 pt, and flat, level ground, like a concrete pad I think it would be fine. But moving it around? Dangling from a sling or chain? Yikes.

With as much weight as I have lifted from a normal "in front of the pins" setup, I believe it would do it (lift a ton from the pins).

So what I'm saying is, I believe the Branson spec on the smaller frame tractors too. Yes they will lift a ton at the pins. Whether that becomes a problem or not entirely depends on the operator, and what setup and precautions they've put in place. At least Branson, and I think the other Korean brands, they don't "Nanny" you. Yes the lift is there. Whether you know how to set up the equipment to make that lift safe or not, is up to you.

My tractor is of similar size and loader capacity as yours. Yours weighs a bit more because mine is open station and weighs about 6500# with loader and loaded tires. I have lifted a palletized ton of feed off a pickup bed and flatbed trailer. Would I want to lift that to full height? Nope. Too much butt pucker. I cannot imagine lifting nearly that much weight with a 2500-3000# less stable tractor. A very risky operation that could easily result in rollover. So comparisons of lift capacity among small CUTs isn’t a very useful distinction. They will all lift as much as they are safely capable of.

 

[LS Tractor Owner]

A 7.3 on a good day in the best case scenario might get 20 mpg. Running it hard 10-12 mpg would be more likely. A 6.7 isn’t getting 5 mpg doing the same work. 4 times the fuel burn is total bullcrap. Assuming the story is true a smaller fuel tank in the newer truck would be a more likely explanation. Emissions equipment will lower mpg and the ultra low sulfur fuel won’t give the same mileage the old fuel did either but a 4x increase in fuel burn isn’t happening.

That surprising.... I had a '99 F250 crew cab, 7.3 powerstroke, long bed with a utility cap on it. 6 speed manual. It got a consistent 28 mpg on the highway --- checked manually every time I fueled it up.

 

[LD1]

My only experience with modern tractors is with my Branson. Now it's not a 10 or 15 series, like what is being discussed, but a 25 series. A "mid sized CUT"?

My bare tractor weight is listed at 4200 lbs (cabbed unit), and that's without the loader. I think the loader and std bucket weighs 1500? I don't remember. What I do know, because I actually weighed mine on a certified CAT scale, is with Rimguard filled rear tires, the loader, and a light duty 6' box blade on, it weighs 7100 lbs.

I have never deliberately tried to "lift a ton to full height". I have lifted and carried large round bales:

View attachment 772859

I did not try to lift it to full height. Never needed to. I did lift it up and over the side of the feeder, which was 4 feet? I would have preferred more ballast on the 3 pt, but at the time I needed to feed the barrel, that is what was on it. Now I'm only guessing that the bale weighed between 1400-1600 lbs. I had no way to weigh them, nor did I really care. The center of the weight was certainly farther forward than "the pins".

I also lift this pallet of sand bags in and out of the bed of my pickup truck every winter:

View attachment 772860

I usually have between 22 and 24 bags of sand on that pallet, the bags weigh 60 pounds each, plus whatever the wooden pallet weighs. Again, I don't try to lift it to full height, but up to the level of my truck bed. Also, obviously I'm lifting well in front of "the pins".

This planter is the most weight I've ever tried to lift with my loader. When it was full of dirt, and I mean level with the top, it would not lift it. After refiguring the weight from the original math error (I was trying to set up a planter that I could pick up and carry). I came up with a "guesstimate" of 3000 pounds. Again, it would not lift it:

View attachment 772861


I then hand shovelled out a good amount (maybe half?), and it would lift it this far. Again, I'm not certain of the weight, I have no way to weigh it. As you can see, the center of the weight is much farther ahead of "the pins".

Looking at these lifts, bear in mind that I think (I honestly don't remember) my loader spec is 2200 pounds "at the pins". And that is to full height.

I have never tried to lift any serious weight by hanging it off the pins to check the spec. From my own seat of the pants "figuring", I think it would do it. Would I want to? Not if I had a choice. That much weight, that high in the air takes some serious attention. With enough weight on the 3 pt, and flat, level ground, like a concrete pad I think it would be fine. But moving it around? Dangling from a sling or chain? Yikes.

With as much weight as I have lifted from a normal "in front of the pins" setup, I believe it would do it (lift a ton from the pins).

So what I'm saying is, I believe the Branson spec on the smaller frame tractors too. Yes they will lift a ton at the pins. Whether that becomes a problem or not entirely depends on the operator, and what setup and precautions they've put in place. At least Branson, and I think the other Korean brands, they don't "Nanny" you. Yes the lift is there. Whether you know how to set up the equipment to make that lift safe or not, is up to you.

Great real world feedback.

Sounds like you have a good feel for your machine and loader capacity

Your bare tractor is a 4200# machine.

The 2515...being discussed as "superior" because of it's loader lift capacity.......it's 2900#

And believe it or not lift to full height and breakout force are HIGHER than on your machine.

So as a Branson owner.....tell me if you think that capacity can actually be used on such a smaller machine?

 

[4570Man]

Great real world feedback.

Sounds like you have a good feel for your machine and loader capacity

Your bare tractor is a 4200# machine.

The 2515...being discussed as "superior" because of it's loader lift capacity.......it's 2900#

And believe it or not lift to full height and breakout force are HIGHER than on your machine.

So as a Branson owner.....tell me if you think that capacity can actually be used on such a smaller machine?

My L3800 was having a hard time with this load. The back end was teetering off the ground. The hydraulics didn’t have any more to give either. And that’s with liquid filled tires and the second bushhog for ballast. I started out trying to lift it with the pallet forks under the bushhog and I had to take them off and hook the tractor on the mower because it couldn’t lift them both together.

 

[Torvy]

I think something that gets lost in discussions about specs is that I think many (most?) of us realize they are bits of data. Measuring at the pins gives a consistent point for comparison, but obviously does not mean you lift that much weight in practice. Using the pins just makes it easier to avoid another level of deception as some will otherwise use 16" in front or 24", or whatever. Realistically, whether that means you can effectively use 80% or 50% of that capacity depends on what you are doing. In one application for me, I will be in my shop lifting a pallet for storage. Much different than traversing my property with an unbalanced load of timber or brush.

Regardless of the adjustments needed for real-world application, the tractor that can lift 2200 at the pins will more capably and safely lift 1000 in daily use than one that can only lift 1600 at the pins. The specific numbers are less important than the relative ones. It serves no useful purpose to poo poo the data of the more capable machine because the max possible is outside of the range people typically work, the advantage is more about having a larger window of safe operating than the less capable machine. There are plenty of valid reasons to prefer Kubota over Branson, that does not mean there are not equally valid reasons to prefer Branson over Kubota. YMMV.

 

[ptsg]

 

[K5lwq]

I do not know what my 4815C bare weight actually is. In the manual it states bare weight is 1165kg/2568lbs with front weight. On the Branson website it says 1653kg/3644lbs without front weights. However, it has lifted everything I have needed it to lift so all is good.

 

[Slowpoke Slim]

Great real world feedback.

Sounds like you have a good feel for your machine and loader capacity

Your bare tractor is a 4200# machine.

The 2515...being discussed as "superior" because of it's loader lift capacity.......it's 2900#

And believe it or not lift to full height and breakout force are HIGHER than on your machine.

So as a Branson owner.....tell me if you think that capacity can actually be used on such a smaller machine?

In short, Yes.

However, the lift action must be set up correctly from the start. I cannot emphasize that enough. It is up to the operator to know what to configure, and to also have those equipment pieces on hand. Like a heavy rear ballast, for example.

Now before you go out and invent all these crazy scenarios that are unsafe to lift, no one should ever CARRY a weight around at or even near the "full height" position. I don't care what tractor brand or model you have, or how much percentage of your max lift capacity you are carrying. Carrying a weight that high in the air is suicidal. It would get you kicked off of any job site I've ever been on. But, there are plenty of times you can lift a weight to full height without carrying it around.

Fork Lift class 101: You carry the weight as low to the ground as you can, and once you get to your destination, you then lift it and put it away. Example, pallet racking. You carry the load low to the ground and travel over to the location where you want to place the pallet (high in the racking in this example). Once you get over to the rack position you want, you then STOP the machine, and then lift the load straight up until it meets the height of the rack shelf you want, then you SLOWLY drive forward to place the pallet on the rack shelf.

THAT would be a "safe lift", provided you already planned the correct rear ballast weight needed for that operation. Again, planning.

No where in that scenario is someone driving around a farmer's field with 2000+ pounds lifted to full height.