IS IT REALLY WORTH IT?

[gordon]

Don't think it's the right direction it in Camden Delaware and the name of the dealer is Burke Equipment. Sorry its not closer. There have to be some good dealers down your way hope this will get a better response for you than I could give. Closer to home that is!
Gordon

 

[jgh]

dealers and some global comments, etc

8/16

[Wen, I hope you'll stick with me on the oil/dead shuttle thread a bit later].

My caution stands for all those who search out the best deal:

After 12 trouble free years with a tractor like Wen describes (a Ford 1720), I opt'd for a more complex (and more capable) machine, and bad as the luck can be, it needs weird service early on. I know absolutely nothing about Kubotas other than they come in a rather tangerine-like shade of orange, but few advances in technology are flawless. You can always know the pioneers by the arrows in their backs. If that had scared me, I could have gone for the simpler JD Ten series, or even a 2120 New Holland. Or, evidently, a Kubota.

It did not, I did not and am still happy with the particular features I have on New Blue. But I sure wish my dealer was closer to me and wiser about the particular machine he sold me...especially under the circumstances. Well, duh.

And though Mark's lament about dealers of little knowledge* hit a nerve because of some non-tractor experiences that back him up, I believe good, knowledgeable folks are out there.

Recognizing them is at least as hard as getting a good deal.

/w3tcompact/icons/crazy.gif

FWIW
Jim

*and his comment about being more knowledgeable reminds me of my father's comment about my trying to be an "expert on everything". /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif /w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif

ps--Late word of the day in convs with dealer: looks like my trouble may well be a simple switch, stay tuned.

ps2--I was taken aback when one of our number went ballistic about his brakes problem b4 he had even tried to get help from the dealer. To me that seemed at least a little unfair.

 

[JerryG]

Re: dealers and some global comments, etc

jgh,
I agree with you on most if not all of your comments. But I would like to also add--the ones of use that have worked on or around tractors for all or for the most of our life can lead the inexperienced to believe the wrong things. There are a lot of members and non-members alike that glean information from here (my self included). I believe that it is our responsibleable to try not to be totally colorblind and to also be honest in the information we present. Every manufacture has had a bad apple or two. It is the good companies and most importantly the good dealer that makes a purchase of a tractor into the purchase of a GOOD tractor.
JerryG

 

[Anonymous Poster]

Re: dealers and some global comments, etc

Going ballistic?

I don't need to ask a DEALER if my brakes are OK. If I hit them and they are crap, THEY ARE CRAP. I don't care if it's a design problem or a moronic idiot assembling them. If SOMEBODY let the tractor out of the factory with poor brakes that in itself is the problem. Maybe they can be improved, it doesn't matter, the damn thing was unsafe/is unsafe from day one. And I'm a very careful fellow. Pity the poor slob who would have rented this if that had been it's destiny.

Don't understand my emotions? Try this...

Take your brand new 30+K tractor and carefully back down a spot you have done many times before with your old out of date inferior farm tractor (Ford 1710) that never was really designed for the added weight of a loader and backhoe. Back it down so you are about 15 feet away from an 8 foot drop off. (to pickup some bulky but fairly light brush to help your wife with her trail building).

(Not steep either)

You realize that the parking brake will not hold the tractor. Then you realize as hard as you push on the brake pedal the tractor is still moving slowing down hill, the rear tires are turning. And realize if for some reason the engine dies your tractor is JUNK as there is no park lock or anything else in this wonderful (sic) invention...GST.

Well I would as I have done on my Ford for extra safety jam the loader bucket teeth in the ground. Would be nice to do except my DEALER told me my tractor was complete, SHIPPED IT, when I received it, no TOOTH BAR (as paid for), said would bring it and put it on, brought wrong one, OK errors happen. Took four months for them to get it after tractor was initially declared "complete" and has taken another 30 days to get them to ship it after constant phone calls, faxes, no one knows where it is, guys on vacation, etc etc.

Yeah I thought a lot about that f'n tooth bar on that slope.

Ballistic, you bet.

I still feel these GST tractors should be labeled on the brochure as unsafe on a slope, unless YOU KNOW not to shift them going up or down, and YOU KNOW that for some reason the brakes are either "just not as good" going downhill backwards or just plain worthless going downhill backwards, as these are, (IMHO)

And your comment about DEALER KNOWLEDGE? There ARE a lot of sharp guys working at dealers and some dealer managers that make sure there guys are on the ball.

For a few years I was working about 36 hours a day, my Ford Bronco was in for something fairly minor that I hadn't had time to deal with. (When I work on one of my OWN cars, it always takes a LONG time to get done=family disharmony!)

They convinced me the manifold gasket was leaking, yes it was seeping a little bit of antifreeze. I agreed to let them change the manifold gasket on the chance it was or could start leaking internally. (Antifreeze+oil not good) BIG MISTAKE. A short amount of miles later the engine lost oil pressure. Actually wife said Bronco had "growling" sound immediately, I didn't hear it. WIFE=1 ME=0 Result, (found much later) crud in oil pickup tube screen, bearings gouged out etc. Dealer first tried to say it was my fault, didn't change oil enough! HA HA lets pull the pan bozo's. Pan was a clean as a baby's..., well I don't make all those trips to the oil recycler for the fun of it!

Anyway I got to eat the whole deal unless I wanted to take them to court. Court's not my thing, (DON'T GET MAD, GET EVEN) I gave them a reasonable presentation, Ford said BITE US, dealer said BITE ME, it was only later that an engine rebuilder showed me the crud in the pickup tube and what it was. Engine had 53K on it 3K out of warranty.

DEALER TWO. Ok dear, the Tahoe needs it's 20K service done and I'm busy again, we can take it to the dealer so you can have it the next day... Dealer said the service was some outlandish price, I looked at list of things they were going to do. At least HALF didn't apply to my vehicle!

Price dropped down 2/3. Said OK, let's do the remainder. The guy started to put it up on the hoist. Whenever I use my own hoist I go SLOW, check the lift pads and where it's engaging about 3 times, lift it up a bit, check again, as I don't use it that much.

This guy was bam bam bam UP SHE GOES.

This 5300 pound truck got about 8 feet off the ground and his stupid haste managed to let the rear right side drop off the rear right leg of the hoist! The front looked to be up off it's as well as the vehicle was at 45 or more degree angle with one corner almost hitting the overhead bar while the right rear bumper end was almost on the ground. And the most unbelieveable part...NOT ONE OF THE OTHER MECHANICS EVEN LOOKED UP OR CAME OVER! Must be a regular happening.

While he was getting it down I went and informed the service manager, calmly, that I had witnessed him putting the truck up without even double checking the lift arms and it had fallen, that I was going to take it to another dealer to have it's undersides inspected for damage. (A few things were).

Oh, one time I let the wife take her RX7 in to the dealer for an oil change, next time I did it I was overjoyed to find the oil drain plug had been visegripped, had a hell of a time getting it out and found the Mazda dealer didn't stock the plug!

So no, I don't need to ask the dealer if my brakes are bad before I get dorked off. An old used tractor bought from a pasture, I can see...a 30+K "Industrial Use" tractor that can't hold itself on a hill. Not acceptable.

I had felt the brakes on this were much less than what my Ford 1710 had from the day I got it, hey, things are different on different machines. But not holding me on a minor hill no matter HOW HARD I pushed on the brakes?

I have worked in auto parts stores and had a shop, I know how people can go off half cocked. No brakes on a new machine...Yeah that's reason to go ballistic all right.

del

[email]oldcarparts@mygarage.com [/email]

 

[trb]

Tenn Mike,
It is interesting that you posted this guestion,as I am dealing with this situation right now.I live in NE Illinois were the majority of ag tractors are the big 3(green,red,blue).I need a 80 h.p.tractor for my hay operation and have priced at my local JD and NH dealership.I would love to buy from the JD dealer but I can't afford the tractor they offer in what I need.
A friend directed me to Kubota,and am now wanting to buy aM8200 series tractor.Here is my problem,I have went to the 3 nearest kubota dealers taken from their website,and neither of them have been able to answer any questions,they don't stock M series tractors,and I feel like if I did let them price me a tractor,they wouldn't be much help to me in service.
On the other hand,found a Kubota dealer off the internet,Modern Equipment,called them,they have 6 8200's in stock,they have a 4wd with a loader I can test drive,and the dealer said I could have delivery in about a week if I decided to buy.
In my mind,this guy in Tenn. has done more for me,than the local dealers.
If this dealer was local,his tractor would be in my barn already,and I didn't shop his price because I feel he was giving me a good value for my dollar.
I think most guys would pay more to shop local,if they felt their dealer was going to take care of them.I know I would.Tom

 

[MATTinMO]

A fella once told me his opinion was worth excactly what I paid for it ( which was nothin ) and I give you all the same price! I dont hold any claim to knowing a whole lot about too many things and all I really have is my own experience. If you have a honest reliable local dealer that wants your buisness he wont care if you shop him and if you find a lower price and he cant beat it he will just tell you
" I cant match that price but this is the best I can do" and he wont go into badmouthin anyone.
as far as service goes ..... I hate to admit this openly but its true....I do everthing I can to not have to take anything car / truck / tractor to a dealer for service.
I just feel that no one will take the care that I will on servicing my equipment ( no to mention the hassle of being without car/truck/tractor while they have it) Yes I even admit I power wash the engine compartments / underside of my vehicles with regularity. But to answer the meat of the post I would always prefer local when possible but if I feel Im about to be rolled over I go on down the road.
Bottom line is keep your eyes open and be a "smart consumer"

 

[tralderman]

We always make a point to invite our potential customers into our parts & service departments so they can see the investment we are making at our dealership to provide the highest levels of customer support. We keep Kubota parts in stock, we invest in the prescribed Kubota service tools, we enroll all of our tech's in Kubota technical schools, and we keep an entire fleet of late model trucks and trailers.
If the customer is a price-shopper ONLY, we may get beat on deals now and then. But for those who are looking for a commitment from their dealership, we feel we offer a better value for the money.

Tim Alderman - Alderman's Inc.
Lennon, Michigan
www.aldermans.com

 

[Hawgee]

Very well said Tim.
Ditto..
Ditto...
Ditto....

Darn, I'm on the west coast. Hope someone is listening. /w3tcompact/icons/laugh.gif

"What is a weed? A plant whose virtues have not yet been discovered."
Ralph Waldo Emerson (1803-1882)

 

[Thomas]

Mike,
As you have found out there more than just picking out a brand name tractor,{Kubota/w3tcompact/icons/wink.gif}yep there a dealership you also must consider.
As the saying goes the product only as good as the dealer.
Try not to look at it a job but fun,and you shall learn more not only about your purchase but yourself as well.

Stay safe and/w3tcompact/icons/cool.gif

Thomas..NH

 

[gordon]

Re: dealers and some global comments, etc

If a tech ever did that with a truck in our shop he would be run out so quick it wouldn't even be funny and thats by the other tech's. I would never work in the same shop with a knucklehead like that. Anyone dumb enough not to shake check the lift does not think a much of himself--that is to live to see tomorrow in one piece.

In our shop we have lifts that can lift a pickup or van and go up in size to a bus. The lift in the bay next to mine is a two pole and can lift a bus. So I don't have time in the day to worry if he has picked up a unit that could easily squish me to a pancake. Let alone himself!!!

For a dealer not to step up to the plate with the engine rebuild is a joke. In my eyes both the dealer and Ford were in the wrong as far as the customer goes. As long as you could show the oil change log and or shop tickets they didn't have a leg to stand on. It pays in this day and age to keep good records for future use if needed. But the dealer alot of times has to ride the maker of the auto to get the warranty claim approved.

So it stems back to a good dealer is worth his weight in gold when it comes problem time. Cheapest price isn't always the best way to go at times. But at times when your pinched for time it seems like things always get worse not better.

Over selling at alot of auto dealers is common place because the techs are paid flat rate and its gravy money for them. But its plain old ripping off the unknowing customer who takes the dealers word for it. There are alot of franchise shops out there that tell the techs to sell the customers items reguardless if they need them or not. So sad. There is a ton of honest money to be made but these ripoff artists ruin the whole industry in the eyes of the public.

I work in an R/V shop and the techs get paid by the hour we to alot of warranty work for Chevy, Workhorse, Ford, Spartan, plus about thirty other companies. We stand behind our work and don't need to rip any customer off there is plenty of honest work out there. We are dropping a large line of moterhomes because the quality just isn't there and they don't want to improve it. I won't name the line for fear of someone owning one.

Del as for the brakes on the tractor yes your right or should I say that I agree with you that they should have worked better than that from the dealer. But give the dealer a chance to right the problem and also tell him your problem and what could have happened from it.
Gordon