Installing electrical conduit, which machine?

   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #1  

wmonroe

Elite Member
Joined
Nov 12, 2005
Messages
3,558
Location
Southwestern, PA
Tractor
1958 Ford 961 Powermaster
I am getting ready to install the underground electric to my soon to be built house. This project will involve about 450' from the last pole to the transformer and 250' from the transformer to where the house will be. Originally I was going to rent a 48" ride on ditch witch, but after calling around the biggest i can get is a 36" walk behind. The 48" is available but it is about a 90 minute drive, one way, to the rental yard. Now i'm thinking a mini excavator is the way to go, i have ran them before and after 20-30 minutes am moving pretty good (for someone who doesn't run one often). Does it seem unreasonable to expect to dig 600' of trench 36-40" deep in 8 hours or less? Seems very doable to me, but i also usually plan more than i can get done.
Thanks
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #2  
I need to run, short form. The 36 " walk behind may wear you out.

Craig Clayton
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #3  
Sounds doable to me. I think I could do it with my backhoe in 8 hours and a mini-x is faster than a backhoe for that type of work. The one wild card would be how much rock you have in your location.

MarkV
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine?
  • Thread Starter
#4  
The possibility of rock has me concerned also. Half of the distance is farm land that is plowed yearly the other half is field/pasture. If there is rock though, i would think the mini x would be the better choice?
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #5  
Completely unrelated to the speed at which you can dig.... You should consider moving the transformer closer to the house to reduce secondary loss. I realize you're probably paying the utility company by the foot (for cable/installation costs), but as long as you're already doing the primary underground you might as well get the transformer as close to the house as reasonably possible.

I generally try to locate them (trans.) within 100' of the main load if possible, if that happens to be the garage rather than the house, so be it. Or better yet if you can split the difference between the garage and house, and put the tub 1/2 way between them.

FWIW I work for a utility and actually spec this sort of stuff out. If you choose to stay 250' away with the transformer, make sure your electrician sizes the secondary cable up appropriately. Your secondary run is not unheard of or uncommon at all. But if you pull a lot of load (large power tools/welding) you may experience some voltage fluctuation and flickering you may not desire.
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #6  
ok...my 2 cents worth.

the transformer is way too far from the house. Im an electrical contractor, and we shy away from ever putting the transformer that far. You will have to size up the secondary wires to such a large size, that it will be cheaper to have them run their small primary wires further.

Second....im not sure what kind of soil you have, but a mini excavator will definitely outperform a ditch witch if there is any rock at all. I can place 200-250 feet of trench an hour using the one i rent for work.

If you ever plan on adding shops, wells, etc. I generally bring in 400 amp service to a point 1/2 way between the intended buildings and then place a 400 amp meter main, that contains two (2) 200 amp breakers and a small 30 space electrical panel. The small panel works great for landscape, wells,etc. The 200 amp services work great for house and shops.

just a note here - using Southwire's voltage drop calculator

if you require a 3% voltage drop (the smallest recommended ) and want 400 amps, 250 feet away. The minimum aluminum feeder size would calc out at parallel runs of 500 MCM wire, which equates to aprox 4 runs of 500 mcm @ $ 1.48/foot plus 2 runs of 350 MCM wire @ $1.15 per foot plus 2 ground wire runs for a cost of $9.22 per foot of secondary plus conduit plus labor (this is for 400 amps). for 200 amps it would be 1/2 of this.

if you would be willing to accept a 5% voltage drop, you could get away with even a cheaper cost, but risk dimming lights, and other nasies in the future.

if you placed the transformer say 50 feet from the buildings, and placed a 400 amp meter section say 10 feet from the transformer, you could get by with feeding the 400 amp section with single 350 MSM wires and each of the 200 amp services with 4/0 alum (aprox $0.50 / foot x 3 wires ). This usually works out the cheapest route in the long run.
 

Attachments

  • _MG_1441.jpg
    _MG_1441.jpg
    1.1 MB · Views: 459
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine?
  • Thread Starter
#7  
I have the transformer at its current location because of the layout where the house is and eventually want to build a garage but not sure of the exact spot. I didn't want the transformer interferring with where the garage might go. Sounds like it might be better to get the transformer a lot closer as I dont' want issues with lights dimming. There will be some high electric loads with heat pump with resistance back up, welder in garage, electric hot water, etc.
 
   / Installing electrical conduit, which machine? #8  
I have the transformer at its current location because of the layout where the house is and eventually want to build a garage but not sure of the exact spot. I didn't want the transformer interferring with where the garage might go. Sounds like it might be better to get the transformer a lot closer as I dont' want issues with lights dimming. There will be some high electric loads with heat pump with resistance back up, welder in garage, electric hot water, etc.

here in idaho, the electric utilities require the transformers to be within 50 feet of the residence IF heat pumps are installed....for what its worth. the start up load on a 4 ton heat pump can be as high as 150 amps for a second. this causes lights to dim for a sec...so does the computer, electronic appliances, etc.
 
 
Top