I'm looking for COLD weather hydraulic fluid recommendatoins

[IXLR8]

My DK40SEH is starting to drive me nuts with this cold weather. I've been using it to move snow banks and clear the driveway to my shop. The FEL is painfully slow to dump. After picking up a load of snow, when I go to dump it, if I move the FEL control fully to the right... it takes over 20 seconds for the bucket to fully 'dump'. If I just move it to the first position to curl the bucket down... I stopped timing it when it got over 35 seconds. After an hour or two of running, the 'dump' times are cut in half. The other issue, when I go into a pile I am trying to pick up, that is large enough to cause the tractor to stop, and I take my foot off the forward pedal, the tractor keeps driving for 3-8 seconds, time seems fluid temp dependent. If I am in Medium range... it stalls, if I am in Low range.. the wheels just keep spinning. If I press on the reverse pedal, it won't move until the tractor stops driving forward. I have the same issue going from reverse to forward. Again after a few hours of use the times are reduced but still an issue. So right now I have to take my foot off the forward pedal 2-3 feet before I get to the pile and then creep into the pile. Due to this, the DK stalls all the time on me, I never stalled the CK30 that I had. This is getting very frustrating. Especially when I am out in 3 degree weather with 30 mph winds trying to open up our road when the plow trucks cant move the snow. Because the issues are reduced after an hour or two when the fluids get warmed up some. I am assuming if I put in a thinner synthetic fluid I that these problems will be reduced from the start. Presently I have just over 50 hrs on the tractor so it still has the original fluid in it and I am looking for recommendations on what fluid to put in when I do the 50 hr service so hopefully I won't have these problems next winter.
The other issue I am having, not sure if it is related, the FEL seems to be way down on lifting power. Last summer when I tried to lift something too heavy, the rear tires came off the ground. Now, with the same ballast on the back, when I try to lift something 'too heavy', nothing happens. FEL does not lift, rear tires don't lift.. nothing moves.
The other issue I have... I am now getting the DK40 reverse whine! The more I use this tractor, the more I wish I had my CK back.

 

[oosik]

Your tractor is still under warrantee. It really sounds like the problem is more than hydraulic fluid viscosity. I would call the dealer and allow them to work on this situation. And I would bet that both situations are related. You should have full function, speed, lifting capacity after the tractor has operated 10-15 minuets or sooner.

 

[IXLR8]

Your tractor is still under warrantee. It really sounds like the problem is more than hydraulic fluid viscosity. I would call the dealer and allow them to work on this situation. And I would bet that both situations are related. You should have full function, speed, lifting capacity after the tractor has operated 10-15 minuets or sooner.

Dealer has been contacted, so far... very unresponsive.

 

[tcartwri]

Are you hearing the system go into bypass? Or is it just non-responsive.

 

[IXLR8]

Are you hearing the system go into bypass? Or is it just non-responsive.

To be honest, I don't remember. Normally I run the tractor at about 1400 rpm and it would be fairly obvious. I was running it about 2000 rpm to try and get things done in a semi reasonable time frame and I don't think I could hear if it was in bypass or not. I won't be home again to verify until Friday.

 

[TJP89]

To be honest, I don't remember. Normally I run the tractor at about 1400 rpm and it would be fairly obvious. I was running it about 2000 rpm to try and get things done in a semi reasonable time frame and I don't think I could hear if it was in bypass or not. I won't be home again to verify until Friday.

I run my CK at about 2200 rpms, and it has great response times after the first 20 or so minutes in the current negative temps. I have to check what my hydro fluid is when I get home, no problems with it.

 

[tcartwri]

Well, unfortunately 1400 is not enough... That's what I idle the machine at when it's cold. It sure will bog the motor down if you try and do anything at that motor speed. Still, it doesn't sound like it's happy. Do you get a whining sound from the hydraulics when it's first started?

 

[Phil48]

During extreme cold wheather, in your Kioti reference book they do recommend at least 20 minutes for warm up time (hydro). When it's arctic cold, even for idle, I leave it at 1800rpm minimum otherwise the engine dont warm up (pumping too much cold air). And during normal running time 2200 or 2400 rpm. It does help a lot to have a block heater (cut in half warm up).

 

[liberty2701]

I have a dk50seh I just purchased in 2014 and have the same climate as you (lakes region NH). You are running way to low rpm. I run mine at least 2k rpm up to 2500 rpm to get the right performance. I also use Amsoil ATH which is a 5w30. I have no trans whine and it is smooth in the cold. Is it possible you have your rear remote lever on?

 

[George2615]

I use synthetic diesel oil in the engine and all season universal hydraulic fluid (supposedly designed for cold weather use) from Advance Auto. I also run tractor around 2000 RPM for snow removal. 1400 would be too low (tractor idles at 1000). Just yesterday I moved back some snow banks to make room for more snow and noticed my loader relief valve maxed out. Several times I'd go into a bank and try to lift and nothing happened. Apparently the hard and heavy snow banks weighed more than what my loader can lift. Taken smaller bites got the job done. Hydraulics do work slow for the first 20 minutes until it warms up. I've been meaning to plug a gauge into the hyd. to check what the relief is set for. I think I'll do that this coming weekend to make sure it's set where it should be. I thinking it should be set correctly from the factory and this is the first time I've ever had it not lift. Even when cold mine does not take 35 or even 20 seconds to dump so you may want your dealer to check that for you. No HST whine fwd. or rev.
As mentioned, check your rear remotes to make sure the levers are in the right position.

Shield Multi-Trac Tractor Hydraulic Fluid STHP25/42909: Advance Auto Parts

 

[k0ua]

This behavior is NOT normal at all. My DK35se is not like this at all even when very cold. I ran in on Monday, in the low teens. Sure that is not 3 deg, but still by 15 to 20 minutes it is all warmed up and working smooth, Even just started in the low teens the bucket might be a little sluggish, maybe adding 1 second to the cycle times , but nothing like you are experiencing. Now I will say, I never went thru a winter with the stock fluid, I bought my tractor in the spring, and the fluid was all changed out before cold weather. But I know of others on here that have never changed their fluid through several winters, and they don't report anything like this. I am using Mobilfluid 424. But perhaps you could try the Kubota SUDT2 which has a well known reputation for working well in low temps.

The squeal in reverse thing puzzles me. Most manifestations of this are at high fluid temperatures not low temps. Mine would only do it mildly at around 90-100 degrees ambient, after using the tractor for about 2 hours. It is easy to fix with the little kit. My dealer provided mine at not cost.

I would get this checked out ASAP

 

[Retired guy]

Mine is a CK30HST,I run Rotella T6 5W-40 year round in the engine and put TSC Premium Universal in the hydraulics when I changed the oil at 400 hours. I now have over 110 hours on that fluid which is 10W-30 according to the specs. So far I am very happy. On a cold morning, -5 here in western ME, the RPM's drop about 200 when I let out the clutch after starting but there is no whine. After about a minute or two, I set the tach at 1200 and go do some hand shoveling. When I return she is turning around 1400 and off I go. The first or second move with the FEL is slow but gets quicker by the third or fourth movement. I usually raise the bucket and cycle it through its range of motion a couple times. As for working it at 1400, I think that is a little low. I work mine at 1800 -2000 depending on the task and about 2300 with the 3 pt snowblower on the back. I suggest you try a little more RPM.

 

[RockyNY]

I've been reading a bunch on here and it seems the Amsoil 5w30 has a pretty good reputation as a good low temp hydraulic oil.

 

[IXLR8]

Lets see if I can update everybody who has had some suggestions. Finally have had some meaningful communications with dealer, he says this is not normal behavior, he is stumped and is calling Kioti. The remote hydraulic controls are off, not dead headed. I have T-N-T for my rear blade and neither cylinder is at it's limit. I can hear the pump when I do run a cylinder to it's limit and dead head the pump. The 3pt hitch moves up and down fine, no issues there. When trying to lift a load with the FEL and it won't lift, sometimes I hear the relief valve go into bypass and sometimes I don't, which I find odd. I had the CK30 for 5 years and ran it at 1400-1500 rpm for everything unless I was in a hurry moving the machine to a different location. I have been running the DK40 at the same rpm's and I assumed it would perform the same or better... not worse. Dealer wanted me to check the quick connectors for the FEL to ensure they were properly seated. I have never had them apart, I will check them when I am home again on Thursday.. if it gets above 10dF. Presently it looks like I am going to have to live with it the way it is until the snow stops, 3-4 weeks hopefully, then dealer is going to come get it.

 

[IXLR8]

Update- Just got off the phone with the dealer, his lead mechanic has been working with Kioti on this issue. He said Kioti has agreed to replace the entire HST unit rather than hoping the fix the mechanic was proposing was going to work. The HST unit is due at the dealer next Thursday, they are picking tractor up next Friday. Hopefully this will be the end of the drive issues. While they have it, they are also going to try and sort out the lack of lifting power on the loader and I can have a properly functioning DK40 when it gets returned.

 

[MinnesotaEric]

To be honest, I don't remember. Normally I run the tractor at about 1400 rpm and it would be fairly obvious. I was running it about 2000 rpm to try and get things done in a semi reasonable time frame and I don't think I could hear if it was in bypass or not. I won't be home again to verify until Friday.

Pop off and reconnect all loader connections. If one is not seated all the way you can have the symptom you're talking about. Moreover, the owner's manual has a trouble flow chart to work through slow problems. for example: your cable actuated joysticks may be coming loose on the valve itself.

Oh and call the owner of the dealer and ask him or her why the people you spoke to have been unresponsive?

 

[IXLR8]

Pop off and reconnect all loader connections. If one is not seated all the way you can have the symptom you're talking about. Moreover, the owner's manual has a trouble flow chart to work through slow problems. for example: your cable actuated joysticks may be coming loose on the valve itself.

Oh and call the owner of the dealer and ask him or her why the people you spoke to have been unresponsive?

Loader connections have been removed/replaced several times.. no change. The person I have been dealing with at the dealership has been the owner. He started off unresponsive and has since become very responsive and has gone to bat for me with Kioti and has pushed for the entire HST to be replaced rather than just cleaning the HST control body. I don't have a heated/enclosed area to work on the tractor and since dealer is going to have the tractor for the HST issues I figured he could fix the FEL issues, that is what the warranty is for. Rather than me crawling around in the mud in 35dF temps to fix it myself. I suspect that initial setup was not done correctly as the mechanic that did the initial setup was fired for not doing his job properly on my tractor and several others.