I'm a Little Confused

[EastTexFrank]

I just carried out the 200 hour service on my L4740 HSTC. Everything went well until it came to replacing the transmission filter. After reading the manual very carefully, it said to replace the transmission filter at 200 hours and replace the transmission fluid and filter at 400 hours.

The first step in replacing the filter was to remove 3 drain plugs in the transmission case and rear axles. I did that and drained about 11 gallons of fluid. Replaced the plugs.

The next step was to remove the filter (that was a bugger) and replace with the new filter. I did that.

The third step was to top the fluid back up to the mark on the dipstick and that is where I got confused. Top it back up with what???? If I use new Super UDT, I have essentially changed out the transmission fluid 200 hours early but they surely can't mean to top it back up with the used fluid that I just drained out of it, can they? There's something just not kosher about filling it back up with fluid that has half of its useful life already gone.

I've emailed Kubota asking for a explanation and I'll see my dealer come Monday to get more Super UDT but what do you guys think???

It's all a little strange to me and I'm a little bit confused about what I should do. My inclination is to bite the bullet and replace the transmission fluid and filter every 200 hours and **** the expense but I'd like to know what they really mean.

 

[gwdixon]

You are supposed to be able to whip off the transmission filter and then magically spin the new one on without losing much fluid. Right.

It is the same with engine oil on some models. The filter is changed at half the life of the oil.

I just change it all out when the filter goes.

 

[Stonehaller]

There's something just not kosher about filling it back up with fluid that has half of its useful life already gone.

I would get new fluid. Like gwdixon said, you do not have to drain it just to change the filter. But since you did drain it and there is the risk of contamination, I recommend that you buy new oil.

 

[MikeD74T]

The instruction assumes that you realize that you'll be putting the fluid back in the tractor therefore use clean buckets to catch it. MikeD74T

 

[radioman]

yup - same here with BX's. however lucky the hst filter is easy to replace without much loss of fluid.

 

[wushaw]

You are supposed to be able to whip off the transmission filter and then magically spin the new one on without losing much fluid. Right.

It is the same with engine oil on some models. The filter is changed at half the life of the oil.

I just change it all out when the filter goes.

Ain't that right...there is no way to spin that one off and spin a new filter on without loosing a gallon or so real easy.

 

[ccsial]

Just flip the tractor upside down first.

 

[Happyman]

You drained when you should have just changed the filter. DO NOT put what you drained back in. Top off with new, clean SUDT.
Sorry you did that. SUDT is good for 400 hours. Filter gets changed at 200 and 400 hrs.

 

[EastTexFrank]

You drained when you should have just changed the filter. DO NOT put what you drained back in. Top off with new, clean SUDT.
Sorry you did that. SUDT is good for 400 hours. Filter gets changed at 200 and 400 hrs.

Yea, that's what the manual says but it also says to drain the fluid (not change it) at 200 hours before you change the filter. The procedure given for changing just the filter at 200 hours and changing both the fluid and filter at 400 hours is exactly the same. Strange.

I'm off to the dealer tomorrow to get 12 gallons of Super UDT, and maybe an answer, but changing it 200 hours early could be a $200 mistake on my part.

There has to be a way of changing just the filter without having to drain 11 gallons of fluid first. Even if you just change the filter without draining and screw the new one on immediately, you are still going to lose a gallon or so and make a heck of a mess.

Something like this might make you think twice about changing the filter at 200 hours and just change the filter and fluid at 400 hours. I know, I know, that's bad but it did cross my mind.

 

[Happyman]

I did not lose much fluid at all when I changed my filter at 50 hrs and 200 hrs. I drove the front and rear tires up onto a couple of cinder blocks (only on the side with the filter) so it leaned away from the filter and did the quick change. Probably lost less then half a gallon.
Try that method next time. Also, it really doesn't just pour out when you remove the filter. There is a small amount of vacuum in the system that holds it back. Kind of like when you change your oil. Once you open the oil fill cap or remove the filter the oil drains quickly. In this case, be sure the fill plug is tight and do not remove any drain plugs....just twist off the filter and quickly spin the new one on.

 

[ccsial]

Something like this might make you think twice about changing the filter at 200 hours and just change the filter and fluid at 400 hours. I know, I know, that's bad but it did cross my mind.

Crossed mine too. My L3400 is at 247 hours so I have the same problem at this point. I already bought the fluid before I realized I didn't read the manual closely and the fluid is good for 400 hours.

I was thinking maybe I'd do the whole thing at 350 and split the difference. It almost seems as though the tractor does not go as fast as it used to. That may be in my head or could it be a slightly restricted filter, I wonder.

I may just attempt the filters and see how fast I can do it. There are two fitlers. One hydraulic and one HST. I would not save the fluid though, I'd add new. I'll have to decide pretty soon since winter is coming and I want it done before that.

 

[gwdixon]

As I mentioned before, it is not a mistake to change the oil at 200 hours. It may be expensive but it is not at all bad for the equipment. The filter is not perfect but if it needs to go at 200 hours then so does the oil in my opinion.

I think that Kubota is recommending fluid changes for a worst-case-scenero and develops their service scheduling from there.

If price is a big concern then do an experiment. Leave the filter in for 400 hours and then have a UOA done and see if the oil is contaminated to any degree. I would guess that the filter will do its job for 400 hours unless it is used extremely hard and in filthy conditions.

Another price option is buying TSC Premium hydraulic oil at $40 for 5 gallons and change both the oil and filter at 200 hours. That would be cheaper than SUDT at 400 hours anyway.

The above are not recommendations but alternatives.

 

[Baby Grand]

I replaced my filter on my L3240GST at 50 hrs, just to make sure any manufacturing chips, swarf, etc weren't plugging the element. There was a lot of "mung" on the magnetic ring. Before doing the change, I read the service manual over and over because I was confused if i could just reuse the hyd fluid. I concluded that I could (your opinion may vary), so I washed the underside of the engine to get any loose dust off of it and drained the hyd fluid into a spankin' clean white plastic tub. This gave me a good oportunity to inspect the fluid carefully with a lamp. It was clear and almost colorless. A magnet on a string came out of the tub clean. It passed the "sniff" test, too. I ran it through a clean "cheesecloth" in the funnel when I poured it back into the GBX.

While I respect the idea behind always changing the fluid (I almost never reuse o-rings) I do resist pitching something that is still serviceable and has considerable $ value.

-Jim

 

[Big Bri]

Randall (dex3361) told me his secret that worked well for me, Use your shop vac and pull a vac at the fill point. I used this when i adj. my hydro. presure, and lost very little fluid.
good luck

 

[EastTexFrank]

Well, I just got back from the dealer and I'm $140 poorer. I got 12 gallons of a generic Super UDT and not the Kubota stuff. I though that since I'm probably going to be replacing it again at the proper interval in another 200 hours it shouldn't be a problem.

I did talk to one of the mechanics at the dealership and when I explained what the manual said and what I'd done, he burst out laughing. According to him, when people first change the transmission filter on their new tractor, they follow the instructions in the manual to drain the transmission case and they all come to a point when the ask themselves, "Now, why did I just do that?".

He said that in the shop they never drain the fluid just to change the filter. They just screw the old filter off and screw the new filter on, catching the escaping fluid in a bucket. He said that if you're real quick, you don't even lose a couple of quarts. They pour the caught fluid back in the tractor, wipe everything down and the job is done in under 5 minutes.

That's what I'm going to do next time. It's just a pity that that little piece of knowledge cost me $140. I'm a lot smarter now.

Thanks guys, there were some useful suggestions posted.

 

[sailorman]

EastTxFrank, I went to my service dealer today to check up on procedures for my 50 hr. service. He told me something similar about people who had done that. Fortunately I started reading this thread in anticipation of 50 hr service and have avoided the mistake thanks to the great forum members ! fwiw he also told me I don 't need to use SUDT unless I plan on moving someplace real cold. I live in deep south. Said if were him at 50 hrs. he 'd change the fluids also and not just the filters even though the manual says filters only. And that with practice filters can be changed quickly without much fluid lost.

 

[ccsial]

I decided to follow the manual and do the HST and Hydraulic filters and not change the fluid.

Removing the HST filter and putting the new one on lost about 2 quarts of fluid. The hydraulic filter lost only what was in the filter. I discarded the old fluid and added two fresh quarts of Super UDT.

This was a very simple job. The only thing that went wrong is that I dropped the filter in the pan and splashed myself.

 

[keyman1808]

Seems to me that $140.00 in SUDT is cheap compared to a new Bota of any series. I say if in doubt change it. Better to run clean fluids in it than dirty and run the risk of a problem. Just my 2 cents.

 

[ccsial]

I'm not in doubt. The manual clearly states the fluids change every 400 hours and the filter every 200.

 

[bp fick]

Some level of confusion is understandable, as the printed manuals are, at times, super ceded by Kubota itself. There is somewhat confusing and conflicting information about the service intervals.

Note this chart for example. http://www.orangetractortalks.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/03-intervals-b-l.pdf

There needs to be a more effective way of disseminating solid information. I have a wee bit of sympathy for the members here on TBN that report differing intervals for service based on their printed manuals, their dealers charts, email exchanges with Kubota USA and Kubota's online publications. Just sayin'