How to dig the narrowest 3' deep trench or minimize sand fill for a wide trench?

[BackRoad]

Rented trencher, over 1000 feet in clay soil. Took less than 2 hours.

Digging 2 trenches would be a day's rental. You may have mention depth required. This got down 3'...

 

[future_vision]

Would it be possible to simply use a 6" ditch witch trencher? It should be a lot faster than an excavator. SAND? What a pain, but you should be able to handle it. Perhaps you could make a tool to lay the sand into the ditch.

If it was me, I'd do two separate narrow trenches with the ditch digger and keep your power and telecom completely separate.

I mentioned this as a consideration in my OP. It'll be $309/day plus finding a way to transport it. Then there is New England ground filled with granite. Just when you think you are in the clear you hit a big rock(s). If the trenching was the only thing I was doing then maybe I give this a go and use the backhoe on my tractor when rocks are encountered but sometimes they are really big and 60hp tractor even struggles. Now, before anyone says anything, I've considered doing the trenching with my tractor. I thing I would be fine with it 3/4 of the way but I just can't maneuver it in the woods and on the hill to effectively, or safely, dig a trench. The CAT 36 is a bit wider than the tractor and will also struggle a bit to fit the path but with the reach it has and the blade I can probably get where I need to go. I'll find out tomorrow when it is delivered. Should be interesting. I don't have a good track record with excavators+trees.

 

[future_vision]

Rented trencher, over 1000 feet in clay soil. Took less than 2 hours.

Digging 2 trenches would be a day's rental. You may have mention depth required. This got down 3'...View attachment 4316533View attachment 4316534

That would be perfect other than what I described in the original post and the one before this. I am coming up a hill from the pole and then shooting over diagonally and up a the rest of a hill in a wooded area. I think I would probably be ok considering the tracks but I would be looking at additional dollars and if I hit those big rocks, which is almost inevitable, I'm in there with the excavator. Who knows. Maybe I will find a local place that has one that will be cheaper to rent and closer than Home Depot and try and come up with the extra $$ to get it.

 

[dodge man]

I feel like I’m missing something. I just roughly figured you would need a couple tandem loads of sand. I’m a hack on a mini ex and I think I could dig 300 feet of trench in half a day. I don’t see where this is that expensive.

 

[paulsharvey]

I feel like I’m missing something. I just roughly figured you would need a couple tandem loads of sand. I’m a hack on a mini ex and I think I could dig 300 feet of trench in half a day. I don’t see where this is that expensive.

The way I see it, the sand is a light bedding, not the back fill; so a 24" trench, with 6" of clean fill; thats about 12 CY, or 2/3rds of a truck if you can't just dig the sand from a hole in the woods. Maybe 24 CY if you truly lay 6" of sand on the entire bottom, play the pipe and lay another 6" on top.

Does the power company's want to see the conduit prior to pulling wire? Telecom very likely doesn't care at all

 

[Happy in NC]

The fiber company put in my fiber at about 6" free as part of the install. Why not drop the electric in then let them trench fiber parallel or just above the electric line? Just a thought

 

[Rctex]

Ok. I am deferring to the power of group think here. Here is my situation. I need to trench 300' for electrical and telecommunication conduit. Electrical is 3" wide conduit and telecommunication will be 2" conduit. The minimum depth for electrical is 30". I am trenching from a pole that is pretty much in the drainage ditch next to the road and up a hill. I am guessing I'll start somewhere around 36" at the pole and be around 3-5' deep when I start ascending the hill. Over a certain number of feet I'll eventually get back up to the 30" (36" to be safe). I think I got that all worked out. Here is my issue. The electrical service is asking for a bed of sand(or stone dust) below the conduit and 12" above. I can't get any answer out of the fiber internet company so I was going to do the same for their conduit. No problem but here is the issue. The telecommunication conduit needs to be 12" away from the electrical. If I dig a wide trench to accommodate both conduits and the spacing, I am looking at a minimum 17" wide trench. Realistically it'll probably be closer to 20". Ok. So what is the problem? The problem is the 12" of sand on top of the conduit. How do I get 12" on top of both conduit and not have to buy a ton of extra fill for the 12" gap in between? I had considered renting a trencher but that might be a little treacherous on the slope and I would need to put a much large gap in the rock wall to navigate through. Plus, being in New England, I'll likely hit some large rocks. Then what? It's not like you can just bend 3" around them or dig multiple new trenches hoping to find a clear path. There is also the fact the electric company only allow a certain amount of bend in the run and I already need to do a 45 degree turn at one point.

A trencher, that can go that deep, is about $310/day from Home Depot. I'd have to do some serious looking to find one somewhat local for cheaper. The easy route is just do the wide trench with the CAT 306 but the cost of filling that 12x12x300 area, in between conduits, is prohibitive.

Dig the ditch…..install electrical……once it’s passed out the 2” in right on top of sand covering the other conduit
I mean once it’s passed who’ll know what’s under it

 

[vallefarm]

Hmm. Two problems with that. One is that having the telecommunication line on top of the electric means that i need to navigate that line if I need to get to the electrical below. I'm not sure I really want to do that. Second, the sand is intended to protect the conduit from rocks when/if compaction occurs. Do I really want to protect the electric and not the telecommunication conduit? I really wish that the fiber company can give me install instructions. They just don't have them available. I kept getting bounced around on two different occasions. Eventually, they submitted a ticket to one of their divisions. I am not keeping my hopes up I'll get any guidance. I'm considering calling a competitor that runs co-ax. Probably Xfinity. See what they say

What do you mean by navigate that line? If you mean you are concerned with digging that close just get as close as you want then use a power washer and drill till you see them. Now you know where they are exactly and did no harm to them.

 

[LittleBittyBigJohn]

Hmm. Two problems with that. One is that having the telecommunication line on top of the electric means that i need to navigate that line if I need to get to the electrical below. I'm not sure I really want to do that. Second, the sand is intended to protect the conduit from rocks when/if compaction occurs. Do I really want to protect the electric and not the telecommunication conduit? I really wish that the fiber company can give me install instructions. They just don't have them available. I kept getting bounced around on two different occasions. Eventually, they submitted a ticket to one of their divisions. I am not keeping my hopes up I'll get any guidance. I'm considering calling a competitor that runs co-ax. Probably Xfinity. See what they say

It's not as serious as it sounds. Power always wants to be on bottom. My power company specifically told me vertically is 100% ok so long as they are on bottom, they actually brought it up first. Out here in the rocky parts the power and data people go straight in the ground with no sand, rocks and all. You can still put sand around both even if they are stacked instead of side by side.

 

[mike8149]

This is probably not workable but can you go overhead for both or overhead for electric and wireless for cable/voice/data.