Help with propane gas logs

[thatguy]

Our propane gas logs have a wall mounted switch to turn them ON/OFF - I believe it is low voltage power.

In the past 4 yrs when I first lit the pilot light in the fall, I would have to manually turn the logs ON (switch mounted on the logs) and then after they burned for 15 seconds I would turn them back OFF - then the wall switch would work from there on.

This year I did that and the logs turned once by the switch but now wont turn on via the switch. The pilot light is burning and they will light if I use the switch on the logs..

I dont even know what the name of the wall switch components is to google a fix..

any suggestions?

Brian

 

[coffeeman]

You might try vacuum on whole unit. clean everywhere including down the tube that the flames burn. maybe there is a battery somewhere needs replaced? However, pilot lites, so should be ok.

coffeeman

 

[tommu56]

So it has a standing pilot (on all the time)?
Or does it have an spark generator that lights the pilot then when flame proves it open the main gas valve. (that is the way mine works)

manufacture and model # might help too

tom

 

[grsthegreat]

Most of those use a simple plain wall switch no different than a regular wall switch. All you need to do is complete the circuit and the fireplace fires up. Its all milivolt range.

If you can unscrew the switch from the wall and cross the wires ... see if it fires off the fireplace.

Next id make a jumper wire accross the screws on the control where the wires to the wall switch generate and see if that foires off the fireplace.

if the fireplace will work with a jumper on the control box but NOT from jumping the switch the trouble might be in the wiring.
If the fireplace works by jumping the switch wires, just replace the switch.

I have seen some fireplace whit a 3 position switch on the firebox. OFF - MAUNAL - REMOTE. . You can turn the fireplace on manually at the fireplace by switching it to manual, but to use the wall switch you had to have it on remote.

ALSO, i have installed a few that had a wireless wall mounted switch that had an onboard battery. It looked like a regular switch, but when i pulled it off the wall.... no wires.

 

[JB4310]

I've been shopping for a gas log recently. The ones with the remotes have a small battery pack in the fireplace. If the switch is remote controlled there should be that battery pack in the the fireplace, somewhere on the floor to the side or behind the log. You would have check batteries there as well as behind the switch cover.

JB

 

[kenmac]

These work off millivolts. 250 + or - or 750 + or - millivolts.. Dust is a major problem on gas logs & the small heaters. You must have a good flame & good connections ( tight & corrosion free) also, as the gas burns through the pilot assy. air is being brought into the air shudder. As air comes into the air shudder . so does dust. This air shudder could be very small holes on the pilot body or, just a small metal tab on the pilot body. as the dust begins to stop up these air shudder holes, it restricts air flow to the pilot gas & the pilot flame will lift off the generator or thermocouple just a little. When this happens you loose MV'S. To clean the pilot assy,,, You will need to blow this area out with air. I've never been able to clean the pilot air shudder with a vacuum cleaner

 

[thatguy]

I vacuumed it good before I lit the pilot light - or as best as i could reach..

The pilot light stays lit all the time.

Where does the 'power' from the light switch come from? Since it is mili-volts, I am assuming its not wired into the house 120AC.

I need to try and find the owners manual, its upstairs someplace..

Kenmac - Ill look for the air shudder and blow that out..

thanks

brian

 

[tommu56]

These work off millivolts. 250 + or - or 750 + or - millivolts.. Dust is a major problem on gas logs & the small heaters. You must have a good flame & good connections ( tight & corrosion free) also, as the gas burns through the pilot assy. air is being brought into the air shudder. As air comes into the air shudder . so does dust. This air shudder could be very small holes on the pilot body or, just a small metal tab on the pilot body. as the dust begins to stop up these air shudder holes, it restricts air flow to the pilot gas & the pilot flame will lift off the generator or thermocouple just a little. When this happens you loose MV'S. To clean the pilot assy,,, You will need to blow this area out with air. I've never been able to clean the pilot air shudder with a vacuum cleaner

There not necessarily all milivolt systems some use 110AC (lmine is powered) and a flame rod for milivolt systems you have to have a standing pilot to generate the voltage to go to the thermostat to the gas valve.

Is there a stainless steel rod in the pilot when lit?
If so take turn system off and clean the rod with some crocus cloth so it is bright again the corrosion can effect the operation of the flame rod.
MAKE SURE POWER IS OFF because it can have 500- 800 volts on it to ground when itis operating.

tom

 

[JB4310]

I vacuumed it good before I lit the pilot light - or as best as i could reach..

The pilot light stays lit all the time.

Where does the 'power' from the light switch come from? Since it is mili-volts, I am assuming its not wired into the house 120AC.

I need to try and find the owners manual, its upstairs someplace..

Kenmac - Ill look for the air shudder and blow that out..

thanks

brian

I don't know much about these things, since I'm just now learning about them for my own future purchase.

But based on your statement and my own observations, every one I saw had no ac power requirement, So that would make me believe that switch is remote controlled, therefore would have a battery in it as well as the log should have a receiver with a battery. Unless those millivolts produced could power the receiver??

Take the cover off the switch and look, if you see a conventional switch with wires under the screw terminals then it's probably AC powered, but you may see a battery.

Be careful

JB

 

[grsthegreat]

I don't know much about these things, since I'm just now learning about them for my own future purchase.

But based on your statement and my own observations, every one I saw had no ac power requirement, So that would make me believe that switch is remote controlled, therefore would have a battery in it as well as the log should have a receiver with a battery. Unless those millivolts produced could power the receiver??

Take the cover off the switch and look, if you see a conventional switch with wires under the screw terminals then it's probably AC powered, but you may see a battery.

Be careful




JB

If yo have a hand held remote than it definately uses a battery. Some wall mounted switches i have seen also use battery and some are milivolt run. In 30 years of hooking up these things in different houses, i swear it seems like no 2 are alike,. It really drives one nuts.

 

[coffeeman]

If yo have a hand held remote than it definately uses a battery. Some wall mounted switches i have seen also use battery and some are milivolt run. In 30 years of hooking up these things in different houses, i swear it seems like no 2 are alike,. It really drives one nuts.

In addition the hand held could also have a thermostat, which could cause other problems like the heat setting too low.

cheers...Coffeeman

 

[thatguy]

thanks for all the help..

we do not have the handheld remote and the logs are not on a thermostat either..

I will pull the switch plate to see whats there..

brian

 

[kenmac]

like ths

small round tip. This is also a generator as it produces MV's but it's known as just thermocouple... about 30 MV'S

 

[kenmac]

Couldn't get 2 pics to post... Does it look like this...

. Large round end generator 250 mv's or 750 mv's depending on it's size

 

[thatguy]

Kenmac - thanks.. I assumed that the thermocoupler and wall switch starter would be separate items..

I did pull the switch cover and it has 120v wiring (not small low voltage wires).. Im going to dig into this deeper this weekend..

 

[grsthegreat]

Kenmac - thanks.. I assumed that the thermocoupler and wall switch starter would be separate items..

I did pull the switch cover and it has 120v wiring (not small low voltage wires).. Im going to dig into this deeper this weekend..

did you test to see if there is 120 volts there? alot of electricians wire 14/2 or 12/2 romex from the wall switch to the low voltage side of the fireplace. Just cause its heavy gauge wire doesn't necessarily mean its 120 volts.
At the time of rough wiring of the house, the sparky probably didn't even know what brand of fireplace was being installed. wired it for worst case scenario.

Also, is there one set or 2 sets of wire there?

 

[thatguy]

update..

OK thanks to folks on here, I used a 'jumper wire' across the milli-volt wall switch and the fireplace started up - so the wall switch is bad..

do you know if anyone makes a wall switch that is remote controlled? Instead of rewiring everything to add a remote AT the logs, I would like to put the remote sensor where the wall switch is now..

I tried to google it, but not sure what terms to use..

thanks

b

 

[thatguy]

another update..

The switch appears to be working now.. It wasnt, then it was..

I checked the wire connections on the switch and they were tight..

Not sure what to think..

Brian

 

[tommu56]

At 750 MV a little dust will stop it from conducting.
Flipping it a couple of times might have dialoged it.