Heat and Air ?

OKnewguy · Jun 9, 2006

I need to ask the collective mind of TBN for some insight on airconditioners. I have been trying to research on other forums and the net, and I quickly get information overload. First, I live in central Oklahoma, which runs from 100+ in the summer to 0 and below in the winters. The 21 year old central air conditioner is going out (the compressor is on its last legs) Our house was built 1964 and approximately 2000sf, we have been here for 3 years now, and I have totally remodeled the whole house myself, but I am lost when it comes to heat and air. The house was built very well for it's day. It has fiberglass insulation, with plastic for house wrap. The only thing I have not done yet is to replace the windows, the current ones are aluminum with aluminum storm windows. Unfortunately I didn't have the cash to replace the windows when I was remodeling.
This brings us to the air conditioner, it has worked well the past summers, but can not keep the house cool now, it can keep it half way cool if you never let it turn off during the day. We have always ran a programmable thermostat, that goes to 78 when everyone is at work and then goes to 75 at 4, but this summer it cannot keep 78 and gets up to 82 or 83 if we do not set it to run all day.
Anyway, we had out a respectable company out to check the system, and they say that the compressor is on it's last legs and could completley go any time. They suggest we get a complete (natural gas) heat and air system since they are both 21 years old. What is the best compromise of high SEER verses cost? I have read that the highest SEER ratings might not be worth the initial cost, when a slightly lower SEER can be dramatically less. Any recomendations for specific brands, and and the best value of SEER to initial cost? I am not opposed to spending the money to get a very efficient system but I do not want a 10 year break even point. We do plan on living here for a long time btw.
Thanks for the help, Dave /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

OKnewguy · Jun 9, 2006

I need to ask the collective mind of TBN for some insight on airconditioners. I have been trying to research on other forums and the net, and I quickly get information overload. First, I live in central Oklahoma, which runs from 100+ in the summer to 0 and below in the winters. The 21 year old central air conditioner is going out (the compressor is on its last legs) Our house was built 1964 and approximately 2000sf, we have been here for 3 years now, and I have totally remodeled the whole house myself, but I am lost when it comes to heat and air. The house was built very well for it's day. It has fiberglass insulation, with plastic for house wrap. The only thing I have not done yet is to replace the windows, the current ones are aluminum with aluminum storm windows. Unfortunately I didn't have the cash to replace the windows when I was remodeling.
This brings us to the air conditioner, it has worked well the past summers, but can not keep the house cool now, it can keep it half way cool if you never let it turn off during the day. We have always ran a programmable thermostat, that goes to 78 when everyone is at work and then goes to 75 at 4, but this summer it cannot keep 78 and gets up to 82 or 83 if we do not set it to run all day.
Anyway, we had out a respectable company out to check the system, and they say that the compressor is on it's last legs and could completley go any time. They suggest we get a complete (natural gas) heat and air system since they are both 21 years old. What is the best compromise of high SEER verses cost? I have read that the highest SEER ratings might not be worth the initial cost, when a slightly lower SEER can be dramatically less. Any recomendations for specific brands, and and the best value of SEER to initial cost? I am not opposed to spending the money to get a very efficient system but I do not want a 10 year break even point. We do plan on living here for a long time btw.
Thanks for the help, Dave /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Humbleto · Jun 9, 2006

Dave, there are some tax incentives this year for things like upgrading a/c, insulation etc. Smart money would add additional insulation to the attic, it may less than you think to do this. I believe the minimum a/c seer is 12 now. Talk to the a/c guy and see what he would suggest. I'm thinking around a 14 would be the most cost effective without having a lot of bells and whistles. Get the best you can afford. Some also suggest that the rotary compressors are better because of less moving parts. A/c manufactors are a little like refrigerator manufactors, there are only a handful, but make a lot of different names (brands). Hope this helps in some way.

Humbleto · Jun 9, 2006

Dave, there are some tax incentives this year for things like upgrading a/c, insulation etc. Smart money would add additional insulation to the attic, it may less than you think to do this. I believe the minimum a/c seer is 12 now. Talk to the a/c guy and see what he would suggest. I'm thinking around a 14 would be the most cost effective without having a lot of bells and whistles. Get the best you can afford. Some also suggest that the rotary compressors are better because of less moving parts. A/c manufactors are a little like refrigerator manufactors, there are only a handful, but make a lot of different names (brands). Hope this helps in some way.

OKnewguy · Jun 9, 2006

Thanks Humbleto, I have been planning to add additional insulation in the attic, I had to remove it in a few area's during the remodeling process, which just got finished. I had planned to do it in the fall when it is cooler. The funny thing is that there is an existing Attic Breeze rooftop power ventilator that was not even hooked up. I hooked it up, and when I made the connections the wiring had never even been used, still the factory wire was trimmed the 3/8s of an inch or so. In remodeling I have seen lot's of things that were done sub-par, it is a shame how people/contractors took advantage of the old widow that owned the house before us.
I am hoping that in this process I will see a fairly dramatic increase in efficiency over our current 21 year old system.
Thanks for the info, Dave

OKnewguy · Jun 9, 2006

Thanks Humbleto, I have been planning to add additional insulation in the attic, I had to remove it in a few area's during the remodeling process, which just got finished. I had planned to do it in the fall when it is cooler. The funny thing is that there is an existing Attic Breeze rooftop power ventilator that was not even hooked up. I hooked it up, and when I made the connections the wiring had never even been used, still the factory wire was trimmed the 3/8s of an inch or so. In remodeling I have seen lot's of things that were done sub-par, it is a shame how people/contractors took advantage of the old widow that owned the house before us.
I am hoping that in this process I will see a fairly dramatic increase in efficiency over our current 21 year old system.
Thanks for the info, Dave

Jagmandave · Jun 9, 2006

My house was built in 64, and had the original furnace, the A/C was replaced in about 84.

When I put in a new Lennox system last year, I did not go to the more efficient seer, and I'm still seeing substantial savings, even with the increase in electric and gas prices. I think it'll be well worth it for you to upgrade, even if you only go to the minimum seer rating that's now required...........

The year before I installed the A/C, I also added about 6" of attic insulation, that difference was felt immediately.......

Jagmandave · Jun 9, 2006

My house was built in 64, and had the original furnace, the A/C was replaced in about 84.

When I put in a new Lennox system last year, I did not go to the more efficient seer, and I'm still seeing substantial savings, even with the increase in electric and gas prices. I think it'll be well worth it for you to upgrade, even if you only go to the minimum seer rating that's now required...........

The year before I installed the A/C, I also added about 6" of attic insulation, that difference was felt immediately.......

Humbleto · Jun 9, 2006

Dave, I found a contracter that put it in cheaper than I could buy it from Home Depot. Don't kill yourself in the attic. I just had mine added about a month ago. I had r-38 blown in for about $0.69/ft. If you can swing it, the sooner (no pun) the better. A lot of money is spent on conditioning in the summer.

Humbleto · Jun 9, 2006

Dave, I found a contracter that put it in cheaper than I could buy it from Home Depot. Don't kill yourself in the attic. I just had mine added about a month ago. I had r-38 blown in for about $0.69/ft. If you can swing it, the sooner (no pun) the better. A lot of money is spent on conditioning in the summer.