Ground wire?

[Whittslittlebitfarm]

Hello everyone, I'm a diesel tractor and farming noobie. One of the new generation who has said "Goodbye city life" and moved to the country, trust me, I've heard every "Green Acres" reference possible. As a result, I'm great with computers and theory, but on a huge learning curve with any practical applicaton of that theory. I'm hoping one of you guys can help me out here. About a month ago I purchased a 1983 MF 210 to do some things around our new small farm and it worked great for three weeks but now, all of the sudden, it won't start. It turns over, but won't start. I start looking around and find a wire hanging below the alternator (generator?) and below that a place on the engine block where it looks like the wire should be attached. I'm thinking it's a ground wire that came loose but I'm not sure. I don't remember seeing it hanging loose like it is now but I don't remember seeing it attached either. I've included pictures. Can anyone help? I don't want to attach it, if it's going to cause a problem...

 

[Stick895]

Well you can't start it now. I would attach the wire and see if it starts. It appears to be a ground because it's A) Black and B) seems to go to a ground location (engine block?) If it's the ground and it starts then there's no harm, no foul. If it doesn't then again no harm, no foul. Wires with connectors like that don't hang around unused.

 

[Jerry/MT]

Hello everyone, I'm a diesel tractor and farming noobie. One of the new generation who has said "Goodbye city life" and moved to the country, trust me, I've heard every "Green Acres" reference possible. As a result, I'm great with computers and theory, but on a huge learning curve with any practical applicaton of that theory. I'm hoping one of you guys can help me out here. About a month ago I purchased a 1983 MF 210 to do some things around our new small farm and it worked great for three weeks but now, all of the sudden, it won't start. It turns over, but won't start. I start looking around and find a wire hanging below the alternator (generator?) and below that a place on the engine block where it looks like the wire should be attached. I'm thinking it's a ground wire that came loose but I'm not sure. I don't remember seeing it hanging loose like it is now but I don't remember seeing it attached either. I've included pictures. Can anyone help? I don't want to attach it, if it's going to cause a problem...

I'm not familiar with your model of tractor. Is it gas or diesel? That wire doesn't look like a ground wire to me and I wouldn't attach it until I figured out where it really went. You might let the smoke out of something! If you have a volt meter, check the voltage between the terminal and a good ground (engine block) with the key ON. If there's voltage there then you'll need to find out where it goes. Even if there isn't voltage, you don't want to hook it up until you know what it's for.(This is where wiring diagrams from a shop manual are helpful. they have the color codes for the OEM wires listed in them.) trace it back to see what the other end is attached to.

I'd strongly advise you to get an owners manual for your tractor and if you are going to do your own maintennce, consider a factor shop manual and parts manual. they are the best investment you can make when you own a tractor. In my opinion, the IT manuals are worthless for newbies so don't waste your money. The factory manuals will have system descriptions to tell you how the various tractor systems are supposed to work so you can trouble shoot problems and when you find them, decide whether fixing them is within your capabilities or whether you'll need to send the job to a shop for repairs. The first time you repair something, you'll pay for the manuals.

You'll need to provide more info than "...my tractor won't start and I have a wire hanging loose, and I don't know where it goes..." Most of us aren't mind readers but we're more than willing to help you find and solve your tractor's problem. The best way to get quick help is to start by saying something like " I have a Belchfire 260 diesel tractor with a hydrostatic transmission ...." and then describe the problem. the better the description the easier it will be to provide potential trouble shooting directions and potential fixes.

Knowing whether your tractor has a spark ignition engine ("gas engine") or a compression ignition engine ("diesel engine") will help us to help you. They have different trouble shooting methods. Gas engines usually have problems with the primary ignition system and fuel delivery. Diesels usually have a problem with fuel delivery( clogged filters and tank strainers, non functioning solenoid fuel valves, etc ) and air inlet restrictions (clogged air filter).

Welcome to these forums. Know that there are a bazillion hours of collective experience at your disposal to help you with your tractor problems. make a strong effort to always come back and tell us what the root cause of your problem was and how you fixed it. I'm a firm believer in life long learning. While we can help you get your tractor going, we can all learn something ourselves.

Once again, WELCOME!

 

[Whittslittlebitfarm]

Thanks Guys. It is a diesel tractor. It's actually in the first sentence of my post. I ordered the manuals but they haven't arrived. According to UPS, the owner's manual should be here tomorrow. I can't wait since it should answer a number of questions about fluids and fluid levels and some general operating questions that have come up.

I'm not looking for someone to diagnose the root cause of the problem, I don't know if that could even be done in a discussion forum. I was just hoping that someone else has a MF210 and could tell me, based on the pictures, if the cable that's hanging is supposed to be attached to where it looks like it should be attached.

Thanks for the welcome.

 

[Jerry/MT]

It appears from the info on tractordata.com, that you have a tractor powered by a 2 cyl Hinomoto diesel and it was made durring the late '70's and early '80's. The typical tractor diesel fuel system consists of a tank, a exit strainer and tank shut off valve an outlet line to the fuel filter(s), the fuel filter(s) and the filter outlet line to the injector pump and either the fuel cut off solenoid or the injector pump with its mechanical cutoff. I'm guessing that it has a manual fuel cut off on the injector pump to shut the engine down but I might be wrong.

First make sure that that shut off is working, i.e. when you push the shut off in, it move the cutoff lever to the open position and when you pull it back, it moves the cutoff lever on the injector pump to the cut off position. (Cutting off the fuel is the only way to stop a diesel.) If it is, then you should have fuel delviery to the injector pump. If you have a electrical fuel solenoid shut off, when you turn the key to the RUN position, The fuel solenoid should open the fuel valve and allow delivery to the injector pump. You can usaully hear a click if the solenoid opens. it doen't open , you've found your problem.

If whatever cutoff you have appears to be working, open the line at the exit of the fuel filter, the one that runs to the injector pump. Make sure that tank valve is open. Hold a container under it to catch the fuel. You shold have a gush of fuel CONTINUOUSLY flowing from the line. If it dribbles or is intermittent, something is restricing the fuel delivery. It could be the filter, a clogged or damaged fuel line, clogged strainer on the bottom of the tank, or a clogged tank vent. You'll have to check those out.

Remember that if you disassemble the fuel delivery system, you'll have to bleed it before attempting a start. (Here's where the owner's manual comes into play. It has the specific instructions for how to bleed the fuel delivery system o your tractor.)

Here are some general instructions for bleeding the fuel delivery system. Make sure the battery is fully charged. There will be a bleeder screw on the filter. Loosen it and then open the tank valve and let the filter fill with fuel until bubble free fuel comes out of te bleeder screw. When youreach that point, close the bleeder. Open the cutoff lever and if there is a bleeder on the injector pump, bleed that until you have bubble free fuel and then close it. There will be a nut on the fuel lines to the injectors at the injectors. loosen these so that the can leak but DO NOT REMOVE THEM! Crank the engine til you see bubble free fuel at these nuts and then tigten them back down. I do them one at at time, other people do them all at once. Your choice. After you tighten them down, the engine should then be able to start.

 

[Jerry/MT]

Thanks Guys. It is a diesel tractor. It's actually in the first sentence of my post. I ordered the manuals but they haven't arrived. According to UPS, the owner's manual should be here tomorrow. I can't wait since it should answer a number of questions about fluids and fluid levels and some general operating questions that have come up.

I'm not looking for someone to diagnose the root cause of the problem, I don't know if that could even be done in a discussion forum. I was just hoping that someone else has a MF210 and could tell me, based on the pictures, if the cable that's hanging is supposed to be attached to where it looks like it should be attached.

Thanks for the welcome.

Sorry I missed the"diesel". You'd be surprised what the folks on these forums can diagnose based on a few facts.

I'm doubtfull that that wire is your non-start problem unless you have a solenoid fuel valve and that's where it belongs.

 

[k0ua]

I know nothing of that Massey, however, that sort of looks like a sender unit of some kind in the block, and that wire looks like it snaps on to that..That does not seem like a ground to me. perhaps someone disengaged the wire before you got the tractor and you just now notice?.. As for the cranks but no start condition. Lets start at the basics.. You did not run it out of fuel did you? And then put fuel in and tried to start it again? Unlike gas engines diesels will not start if ran out of fuel without bleeding out the air first.. Does the tractor have an automatic shut off solenoid that is activated by the key or was/is there a fuel shut off lever to pull or push to shut down the engine. As you know diesels are not shut off by removing ignition as there is none, but later models will shut off by the key by activation of a fuel shut off solenoid. Another photo of that wire and possible destination would be good... The fuel shut off solenoid is normally attached to the injection plump. Things to remember: If the diesel can suck in air, and has timed fuel being injected into the cylinders. (mechanical injector pump) and has compression, and you can crank it over reasonably fast, it MUST start, it has no choice. Lets have another photo or 2 to kinda look around a bit, and tell us about the fuel situation..

James K0UA

 

[k0ua]

the more I look at that wire, and where it might go on the block.. maybe oil pressure sender? Could there have been a brass screw that went thru the screw terminal under that rubber cap (is that what I saw?) and screw into the brass threaded? portion of an oil pressure sending unit? I just cannot be sure from the photo's

James K0UA

 

[Dieseltech]

Your tractor is made by Toyosha in Japan, have smaller model 205 with 2 bottom plow I use for garden tractor plow days. Check just under alt, oil pressure lite switch should have a wire on it as mine does, could have gotten knocked off. How long are you holding glow plug switch on, will need at least 30 to 60 seconds preheat to start engine depending on temperature. Also make sure shut off rod is in run position if it has one, some tractors shut off with throttle lever instead.

 

[mjw357]

the more I look at that wire, and where it might go on the block.. maybe oil pressure sender?

That's what it looks like to me. Now, if the tractor thinks it doesn't have oil pressure, would that make it shut down or not start?