Gc2610 glow plug problem

[liberty2701]

My Gc2610 was very hard to start the other the day in the cold. Today I decided to check power to the glow plugs. I disconnected the wire from the bus bar and attached my red meter lead to the wire and the black one to the battery and turned on the key. i am measuring milivolts. Should I be getting battery voltage to the glow plugs? I have the service manual and its info is limited on the glow plugs, . Is there a fuse for this? What am I missing?

 

[MFRED]

Did you turn the key to the "glow" position or just the run position? There is a detent position inbetween run & start that activates the glow plugs. Just want to be sure you're hitting that before we daignose any further.

 

[murphy1244]

My Gc2610 was very hard to start the other the day in the cold. Today I decided to check power to the glow plugs. I disconnected the wire from the bus bar and attached my red meter lead to the wire and the black one to the battery and turned on the key. i am measuring milivolts. Should I be getting battery voltage to the glow plugs? I have the service manual and its info is limited on the glow plugs, . Is there a fuse for this? What am I missing?

Battery hot or ground on that black lead?

 

[liberty2701]

Did you turn the key to the "glow" position or just the run position? There is a detent position inbetween run & start that activates the glow plugs. Just want to be sure you're hitting that before we daignose any further.

I am a complete idiot. I have 200 hrs on my tractor and never used the glow plugs. I thought by turning the key one position right activated the glow plugs. I never realized until now that you actually have to hold the key in the glow plug position. I normally turn the key walk away then come back and start it. I started it all last winter with no glow plugs.

 

[ray66v]

I started it all last winter with no glow plugs.

It is amazing that you were able to do that.

Some people can't get them started with the glow plugs. :laughing:


For those who are new to winter starting, and operating:

Remember, as it gets cold, your glow plug time gets longer. Really cold conditions require 30 seconds or more.

You also have thicker air in the winter, so you get more air in the intake. That requires more fuel to get the right mixture to start easily. A good starting point for a really cold weather starting is open the throttle 15-20%.

You need to experiment with your tractor to find the right combination of glow time, and throttle position that works for you.

If it does not start by the count of 5, don't crank it until the battery dies. Go back to the glow plugs, and run them longer, and or change the throttle position.

With experience, you can get fast, easy starts.

Diesel engines do not create much heat at idle speeds. Open the throttle to around 1,000 rpm or so, (or, any fast idle speed it runs smoothly at), during the warm up.

Don't forget about the extended warm up times, as per your manual, for the 5 gallons of oil in your transmission.

 

[liberty2701]

It is amazing how easy it starts with glow plugs. I just thought all along it was a finnicky starter. I was starting it last winter when temps were 15 degrees. I started with a WOT and slowly lowered it until it started. Glow plugs are a great invention that i just discovered.!!!LOL

It is amazing that you were able to do that.

Some people can't get them started with the glow plugs. :laughing:


For those who are new to winter starting, and operating:

Remember, as it gets cold, your glow plug time gets longer. Really cold conditions require 30 seconds or more.

You also have thicker air in the winter, so you get more air in the intake. That requires more fuel to get the right mixture to start easily. A good starting point for a really cold weather starting is open the throttle 15-20%.

You need to experiment with your tractor to find the right combination of glow time, and throttle position that works for you.

If it does not start by the count of 5, don't crank it until the battery dies. Go back to the glow plugs, and run them longer, and or change the throttle position.

With experience, you can get fast, easy starts.

Diesel engines do not create much heat at idle speeds. Open the throttle to around 1,000 rpm or so, (or, any fast idle speed it runs smoothly at), during the warm up.

Don't forget about the extended warm up times, as per your manual, for the 5 gallons of oil in your transmission.

 

[not2old]

My GC2610 has a dealer installed block heater. If I have it plugged in, I can start it without the glow plugs and it seems to already be at operating temperature. If it's not plugged in, I need at least 10 seconds on the plugs when the temperature is below freezing. Even at 50 degrees F, I need to use the plugs or it's a no start.

 

[ray66v]

My GC2610 has a dealer installed block heater. If I have it plugged in, I can start it without the glow plugs and it seems to already be at operating temperature. If it's not plugged in, I need at least 10 seconds on the plugs when the temperature is below freezing. Even at 50 degrees F, I need to use the plugs or it's a no start.

Yes, it starts easy with the $120 block heater.

But, if it's cold outside, you can't go anywhere until the transmission warms up anyway. So, you have plenty of time for the engine to warm up.

 

[liberty2701]

I use Amsoil in the hydraulics. How much less warm up time do you think is needed than Permatran?[/I]

Yes, it starts easy with the $120 block heater.

But, if it's cold outside, you can't go anywhere until the transmission warms up anyway. So, you have plenty of time for the engine to warm up.

 

[ray66v]

I use Amsoil in the hydraulics. How much less warm up time do you think is needed than Permatran?[/I]

Your guess is as good as mine.

It's probably best if you don't reduce it by a lot. But, for the times when you have too, it's nice have the best possible option in there.

Another way to protect your hydraulic pump from cold weather: This silicone pad heater, (orange colored device below), is glued to the bottom of the rear axle housing. It uses 140 watts of 110 volt ac power. I plug it in when the forecast is for impending snow.

In 24 hours, it warms the oil considerably. In 48 hours, the entire housing is no longer cold anywhere. I have left it plugged in for as long as a week at a time, when we have had periods of continuous snow.

With this you really can shorten you warm up times, because your oil is not cold to begin with.

E-bay seems to have the best selection of these.



As an experiment, I am also running a 25 watt pad heater on the engine oil pan this year.

It rarely gets much below 32F in my shop, which is certainly helpful too.

 

[MFRED]

It's not just the oil that needs to warm up. The rest of the system, parts & housings needs to get some heat in them. A proper warm up would consist of moving all hydraulic functions in harmony to allow all parts to come up to temperature equally. Moving the loader, backhoe & 3pt controls to put some heat in them. Nothing good about getting the transmission hot & sending the hot oil to freezing cylinders.

 

[ray66v]

Nothing good about getting the transmission hot & sending the hot oil to freezing cylinders.

Yes, ideally you could warm the cylinders you plan to be using, as you warm the tractor.

My fluid is never hot before I start plowing, I don't have that kind of patience.

No gain in warming the backhoe cylinders, if your just using it as ballast.

The only perfect solution, keep the machine from getting freezing cold to start with.

 

[irvingj]

"This silicone pad heater, (orange colored device below)"

Have yet to "need" it, but thanks to Ray's advice, I have one now, too. Don't neglect that warm-up for the hydraulic fluid!

(Looks like I might have a good opportunity to use it tomorrow morning; we have 5" of very dense snow on the ground now, not expected to finish til tomorrow AM sometime.)

 

[ray66v]

I ran my heaters for close to 2 days, ahead of the last storm.

Both the engine oil pan, and transmission housing were comfortably warm to the touch.

I guess I should attempt to do some oil temperature readings, with, and without the heaters.

Maybe I can determine modified warm up times, roughly based on the published temperature charts?

 

[not2old]

OK, now I'm still learning how ignorant I am. My tractor, with few exceptions is parked inside where the temperature in winter is between 50 and 60 degrees F. As soon as it starts, I set it at about 1500 RPM, put it in low range and proceed at a light forward speed for about 3 to 4 minutes until the temperature gauge has moved. I then move it up to 2000 to 2500 RPM and use high range for plowing with the standard bucket. I've noticed the bucket is a little slow at first, but expected that at such a low RPM(1500). Am I not warming it up enough? I don't remember reading anything about this in the manual. This is how I've treated my truck since new and it now has 410,000 KM on the original motor.

 

[jeepcj7]

OK, now I'm still learning how ignorant I am. My tractor, with few exceptions is parked inside where the temperature in winter is between 50 and 60 degrees F. As soon as it starts, I set it at about 1500 RPM, put it in low range and proceed at a light forward speed for about 3 to 4 minutes until the temperature gauge has moved. I then move it up to 2000 to 2500 RPM and use high range for plowing with the standard bucket. I've noticed the bucket is a little slow at first, but expected that at such a low RPM(1500). Am I not warming it up enough? I don't remember reading anything about this in the manual. This is how I've treated my truck since new and it now has 410,000 KM on the original motor.

Your doing fine. When its cold let the engine warm up for a couple minutes and then go do what you need to do with the tractor. If it gets really cold use a engine block heater. Transmission heaters & hyd oil heaters are neat gadgets but not required unless you live way, way, way up north.

 

[ray66v]

OK, now I'm still learning how ignorant I am. My tractor, with few exceptions is parked inside where the temperature in winter is between 50 and 60 degrees F. As soon as it starts, I set it at about 1500 RPM, put it in low range and proceed at a light forward speed for about 3 to 4 minutes until the temperature gauge has moved. I then move it up to 2000 to 2500 RPM and use high range for plowing with the standard bucket. I've noticed the bucket is a little slow at first, but expected that at such a low RPM(1500). Am I not warming it up enough? I don't remember reading anything about this in the manual. This is how I've treated my truck since new and it now has 410,000 KM on the original motor.

The difference is, your 2610 has 5 gallons of oil in the transmission, that needs time to warm up in cold weather, to protect the pump.

I haven't seen the 2610 operating manual. The 2310 manual says for 32*F and up, the warm up time is 5-10 minutes.

At 50-60*F, my guess is your procedure is probably not being too tough on it. But, I would still give it a couple minutes to warm up first.

Also use caution not to bog, (lug), the engine when plowing at those low rpms. That is really hard on it.

 

[ray66v]

Transmission heaters & hyd oil heaters are neat gadgets but not required unless you live way, way, way up north.

Nothing is required, you can always wait the full "30 minutes or more", when it's below zero.

But, at $35 in my opinion, it's cheap insurance.

 

[buckwheat]

I may be lucky and/or stupid, but I have never warmed up my Massey once I manage to get it started. I've run Amsoil in the hydro unit and synthetic (Mobil) oil in the engine. I don't load it up much for 5 minutes or so. When I read the warm-up times in the owner's manual, I nearly choked on my coffee. I've not seen any damage yet, but I'm sure that the pump will be the first thing to go when something does eventually fail.

 

[ray66v]

I may be lucky and/or stupid, but I have never warmed up my Massey once I manage to get it started. I've run Amsoil in the hydro unit and synthetic (Mobil) oil in the engine. I don't load it up much for 5 minutes or so. When I read the warm-up times in the owner's manual, I nearly choked on my coffee. I've not seen any damage yet, but I'm sure that the pump will be the first thing to go when something does eventually fail.

I am sure some will never change the oil in the transmission as long as they own it. And, I am sure a majority are not changing the antifreeze annually either. :thumbsup:

Everyone has to decide for themselves, how far they want to go.

There have been some pump problems with the early models, due to a factory defect. And it amounts to a $3,000 repair.

I have one of those early models, and I am not taking any big chances with it.