Ford 1710 Injector Pump oil Problems

[asylum]

I figured I would start a new thread since it is a different topic. JC sent me a picture of where to change the oil in the injector pump. Mine is not the same. I have the fill plug, but the drain plug and fill level plug, or screws, do not exist. There is an area in the housing that looks like screws go there, but they were never tapped and put in. Is there another way to drain the oil other than having to drill and tap? If I have to drill and tap, what size tap and screw do I use?

Thanks
Bob

 

[JC-jetro]

I figured I would start a new thread since it is a different topic. JC sent me a picture of where to change the oil in the injector pump. Mine is not the same. I have the fill plug, but the drain plug and fill level plug, or screws, do not exist. There is an area in the housing that looks like screws go there, but they were never tapped and put in. Is there another way to drain the oil other than having to drill and tap? If I have to drill and tap, what size tap and screw do I use?

Thanks
Bob

Bob,

One of the guys had a same question about a Ford 1300. I sent him the same info but his injector pump configuration was quite different from what I have and what is published in IT FO-44 shop manual. I went ahead and checked the NH site and they had his design in there. It appears in his case the pump is lubricated by the engine oil. I have noticed soundguy to mention on several threads that some of the older model the injector get it forced lubrication from engine oil pump. I have a pic that I was sent so below. IF yours is different get a picture of it and post. If I were you I'd go to NH site to double check as well.

JC,

I was a bit curious and checked the NH website. what they had only one type of pump , exact same as I what I have on my 1700 with the exception of 3rd fuel discharge port. I'm curious in what you're looking at.

 

[asylum]

I don't think this is my pump, but I will have to look after work. I will try to take a picture and see if I can figure out how to post it.

Bob

 

[asylum]

JC,

I have the FO-44 and I'm reading through it. ON page 50, fig 129, shows an injection pump. This is what mine looks like. In the pic you can see there are not fill-level plug. I don't see anywhere where it mentions changing the pump oil. Did they not originally design them this way?

Again, I will get pics of mine and post for verification, but I'm just reading up on this before getting home this evening.

Thanks
Bob

 

[JC-jetro]

I don't think this is my pump, but I will have to look after work. I will try to take a picture and see if I can figure out how to post it.

Bob

Bob,

What you see on fig 129 page 50 is exactly what I pictured above (post #2), pump parts breakdown. Your pump is no different than what is on 1700 with the only exception of 3 ports. The FO-44 does not talk about oil draining and replacement.

The Pic you see below is from page 24 of the "Owner's Manual" and that's where they talk about it.

The procedure can not be simpler. Look at my post below.

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/nh-buying-pricing/84052-injector-pump-oil.html

JC,

 

[randy41]

my 1710 manual says to fill up the injector pump with fresh oil when you change the engine oil/filter. says nothing about draining the old out of the injector pump.

 

[JC-jetro]

my 1710 manual says to fill up the injector pump with fresh oil when you change the engine oil/filter. says nothing about draining the old out of the injector pump.

Hmmm, how many times can you overfill it before draining the old oil. Where does the old oil go?

 

[asylum]

JC,

Yes, it is a very simple process, but how do I drain without the drain plug? I am also low on transmission fluid (which I believe runs the hydralics too). What do I use to top off the tranny?

Thanks for you help.

 

[asylum]

Also, if filling the injector pump with each oil change, how do you know how much to put in?

Oh I just love a new toy!!!!

 

[JC-jetro]

JC,

Yes, it is a very simple process, but how do I drain without the drain plug? I am also low on transmission fluid (which I believe runs the hydralics too). What do I use to top off the tranny?

Thanks for you help.

Bob, please refer to my post #5, and read the instructions carefully. It is all explained. you may have a cap (almost same as bottle cap) on filler plug. Get a vis-grip and twist it off and you see the filler cap exposed. There is a bottom hole fro drain, and a middle hole for level. Open filler cap to allow air in, open lower screw (drain plug) to drain. When done draining, put the drain screw (plug in, open the level screw and fill thru the filler cap, when you start seeing oil spewing from the level hole you're done, that is the right level. put the filler plug in and you are good to go. All I said is also is explained in details in the attached link and copy of owner's manual I provided with my post #5. If you need instruction on how to see earlier posts let us know.

On the right side below your gear shifter there is a plug, that is where you add hyd fluid. Use the search engine of the forum, use my name in the search window and you'll find gobs of information.

JC,

 

[asylum]

JC,
Thanks for all your help, but am I missing something? I don't have the oil-level screw or drain screw. I see the fill plug on top. I keep reading the instructions and they are very simple, but I don't have the drain and oil-level screw on the side of my pump.

I also appreciate the links. I have read through them as well.


Bob

 

[JC-jetro]

JC,
Thanks for all your help, but am I missing something? I don't have the oil-level screw or drain screw. I see the fill plug on top. I keep reading the instructions and they are very simple, but I don't have the drain and oil-level screw on the side of my pump.

I also appreciate the links. I have read through them as well.


Bob

Bob,

Post a close up pic of the pump and we'll go from there. I see that fig 129 from IT FO-44 does not show the entire pump for 1710. The lower part of the pump that should have drain and level screw is not shown. May be there is something to it.

JC,

 

[asylum]

JC,

I'll take a pic after work today and will post tonight.

Thanks!!!!

Bob

 

[RobJ]

you can also check to see if they updated the injection pump lube. Look for a small metal line coming up from the block somewhere (oil galley) and attaching to the injection pump. Oil would come in here. Then they removed the seal on the front shaft and the oil would flow back into the crankcase through the front bearing. Typical Bosch style inline pump lube when the injection has the governor build in.

Maybe...

Rob

 

[JC-jetro]

JC,

I'll take a pic after work today and will post tonight.

Thanks!!!!

Bob

BOb,

See what I found in FO-44. As they say devil is in the details. If you read it closely it does say the darn thing on 1710,1919 and 2110 is lubricated by the crankcase lube. I reckon when you drain the engine oil it somehow drains the injector but oil new oil fill does not fill the pump. it is a bit confusing though. it says how much oil to put in it also (5 oz). I still like to see the pic. No wonder why Randy's manual says just fill it.

JC,

 

[asylum]

Guess that answers it. I will try to get some good pictures and put them up, but at least it sounds like the oil is coming from the crankcase.

As for hydraulic oil for the tranny, I found F-134 is what I should use. I'm a little low on the dipstick (bottom of stick). I am going to get a gallon and add it to the tranny. Hoping one gallon will do it. The previous owners had the tractor for 4-5 years and never changed the hydraulic fluid. It still looks clean so I am going to add oil to it rather than changing out 5 gallons. Might just change the filter.

Bob

 

[JC-jetro]

Guess that answers it. I will try to get some good pictures and put them up, but at least it sounds like the oil is coming from the crankcase.

As for hydraulic oil for the tranny, I found F-134 is what I should use. I'm a little low on the dipstick (bottom of stick). I am going to get a gallon and add it to the tranny. Hoping one gallon will do it. The previous owners had the tractor for 4-5 years and never changed the hydraulic fluid. It still looks clean so I am going to add oil to it rather than changing out 5 gallons. Might just change the filter.

Bob

Bob,

You can buy 2 gallon jugs of Mystick Hyd oil compatible with Ford 134 hyd fluid pretty inexpensively. I think about $20 per 2 gallon jug. It is a good oil. My oil looked great by the dip stick inspection but looked horrible in the differential housing. Transmission housing is not where the contaminant collect, it is in the low velocity areas in the differential housing where it happens. There is a large suction strainer to clean the oil prior to hyd pump suction . You may be mixing good oil with the bad. if I were you, I would replace the whole oil and clean the differential housing and suction strainer. Hydraulic pump cavitation can lead to permanent pump failure and you would not know it till it is late. Look at the thread below and see how my strainer looked.

JC,

http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/nh-owning-operating/88973-sos-i-have-my-first.html

 

[randy41]

i've had my 1710 for 18-19 years and have changed the oil a few times and just topped up the injector pump with oil and the thing still runs...either i am very lucky and should play the lottery more or what i'm doing works good.
as far as hydraulics go, when mine quits working I drain the fluid, change the filter and refill. then it starts working again. yes, when it quits working its annoying and delays what I need to do but I get over it. the last time i did this i bought pennzoil fluid. they think that what they got at the tractor dealer is something real special based on what they charge. its all the same stuff.

 

[asylum]

JC,

Hope this picture comes through.

As for the oil, where is a good place to purchase this oil? What about the oil at Walmart. I know they sell 5 gallons of hydraulic/tranny oil for tractors. If not recommended, who sells the Mystic oil you mention?

I also found where it is leaking. It is coming out of the housing that holds the hydraulic filter. Looks like it is leaking where it mounts to the transmission case. A simple gasket I'm assuming.

Hope this picture comes through.

 

[JC-jetro]

JC,

Hope this picture comes through.

As for the oil, where is a good place to purchase this oil? What about the oil at Walmart. I know they sell 5 gallons of hydraulic/tranny oil for tractors. If not recommended, who sells the Mystic oil you mention?

I also found where it is leaking. It is coming out of the housing that holds the hydraulic filter. Looks like it is leaking where it mounts to the transmission case. A simple gasket I'm assuming.

Hope this picture comes through.

Bob,

Picture came through just fine. Well.. well .. How about them apples? On the lower left corner of the pump you see two holes that are lined up vertically. I have one screw in each, top one was the level hole and bottom was the drain hole and oil fill on top as you know. The darn pump looks exactly like mine. My pump is only connected to the engine from the front where it is coupled to the timing gear housing. It is yet a mystery to me how the oil gets drained after you filled the injector pump. The normal engine oil level must be the same as normal oil in the injector for the physics to work (siphon principal), if the oil in the engine and pump are connected by a drain line they should seek same level. If the engine oil pressure lubes the pump then, injector pump can be higher and should be a drain to the crankcase that is continuously draining.. if that is the case, why fill the injector pump separately. This is giving me a bit of headache you know... by the way I meant to say it in my earlier post. I bought my oil from TSC (Tractor Supply). if you do not have the store I recalled soundguy mentioned some universal UTF sold in Walmart that meets and exceeds Ford 134.

JC,