FarmTrac Troubles

[SESS]

Dear EasyEd-

On this statement: "2) Interested parties become dealers borrowing money from Textron to buy inventory and having Textron finance tractors bought from those dealers."

The dealers did not borrow money from Textron. Textron is the floorplanning company. The dealers signed an agreement with Farmtrac to become a dealer (Dealers also signed agreements with Textron stating that when a tractor was sold that is currently on their floorplan account-the dealer would remit the invoice amount to Textron to "clear off" that total on the account); tractors were delivered to the dealer; Textron paid Farmtrac the invoice amount of that tractor; when the dealer sells the tractor-payment is mailed to Textron for the invoice amount that is currently on their floorplan account. There was NO borrowing of money. The agreements also state that dealers would sell the tractors on their property "during normal business conditions". When Farmtrac went out of business (thus there is no manufacturer to stand behind the product, no warranty from the manufacturer, no financing for the equipment because there is no manufacturer, dwindling parts supply again because there is no manufacturer, etc etc etc)-NORMAL business went out the window.

That is the very, very short version of dealers-Farmtrac-Textron relationship.

 

[Lgim]

Dear EasyEd

First off let me say that this is just my opinion based on what I have read here, other sources and my experience in general. I am a Canadian and have never seen a Farmtrac tractor or heard of them before I bought my Montana and started looking into the whole industry. I have great sympathy for the employees that lost their jobs, Any time a company closes their doors it is a bad thing for everyone. I also have to believe that everything that was required by law was done after all Farmtrac was an American company governed by American laws. As a friend of mine (law enforcement) says 努hen Justice and Legal are the same, it is a coincidence, they are not really related.

1. Farmtrac used to be a private company that bought parts from different suppliers (kits) and assembled the tractors at a factory in the US. A number of years ago they were on the edge of belly up when a India company who Farmtrac was buying kits from bought it, so that they could continue selling kits into the US market. The 擢armtrac equipment was manufactured off shore and assembled in the US similar to just about every other small tractor sold in North America.

2. Texton is in the business of lending money, and like a lot of other lending institutions they made it incredibly easy to borrow money. Farmtrac took advantage of that by sending inventory to dealers that wasn't ordered. Apparently the agreement that the dealers had with Farmtrac allowed the total value of the equipment to be financed thru Textron (similar to the local grocery store delivering stuff to your house while you are out of town and hitting your credit card for the cost). Also there seemed to be a less then 0% deal for the final customer we will inflate the price, you borrow more then you need from Textron and each month we (Farmtrac) will send you a check for 度 that you can use to make your payment to Textron.

3. I doubt if the company from India ever went 澱elly up? Some exec decided they weren't making enough cash with the Farmtrac company so he said no more. The result was that Farmtrac went into receivership. (might not be the correct term I am Canadian and the terminology may be different) but at any rate Farmtrac is no more.

4. Textron lends money and yes they expect it to be paid back according to the terms of the contract they have with the dealers and or customers. I don't see why they would ask for anything other then the terms of the contract, they make money by lending it out. The fact that the dealers don't/can't sell their inventory or the customers are not getting a check for 度 from Farmtrac is irrelevant to Textron, as it should be.

5. I don't know who the final customers should be angry with, there is a third party warranty provider, and parts can be purchased from any other company in the world that handles the kit that the original tractor was made from. Granted it is a pain in the rear and it may or may not be the local dealer they bought the tractor from but it can be done.

6. Dealers no longer have a Farmtrac dealership there is no Farmtrac, they have the option of signing on with a different manufacturer / distributor or get out of the business. Yes it is a pain in the rear but it is up to them what they want to do.

7. I don't know if it was an event worth noting on the the India parent company's books. Some exec decided that Farmtrac wasn't making enough money so they shut it down the cheapest way they could. They met all the requirements that were legally required. All of the assets of Farmtrac were sold, and whatever cash was raised was sent to the creditors. End of story.

As I said before I have no personal interest, other then learning from someone else's mistakes. I think this forum has become a crying session for a couple of dealers that don't want to get on with their life (or 1 person with a couple of aliases gota love the internet).

If you own a Farmtrac tractor I suspect your dealer is going to have to find a new supplier or you will have to find a different dealer to deal with. If you are a ex Farmtrac dealer I think you got screwed, but life goes on, if you want to continue being a tractor dealer find a new supplier that you are comfortable dealing with big company that manufactures and has an exec somewhere, or a smaller company that distributes with people you know. Your choice.

I don't think calling everyone from India crooks is fair, or insinuating that Textron is going broke and shouldn't be dealt with because they expect their money back is just plain petty. If I were to base my opinion of Americans based on this forum it would be pretty bad.

But please don't believe everything you read on the internet (this forum included), life is much better then that.

Gary

 

[tommybr]

Wisconsin Ag Connection - National/World News - Montana Re-Branding Farmtrac Tractors

Here's an article about Montana's purchase of Farmtrac

 

[taxpayer]

Dear EasyEd

First off let me say that this is just my opinion based on what I have read here, other sources and my experience in general. I am a Canadian and have never seen a Farmtrac tractor or heard of them before I bought my Montana and started looking into the whole industry. I have great sympathy for the employees that lost their jobs, Any time a company closes their doors it is a bad thing for everyone. I also have to believe that everything that was required by law was done after all Farmtrac was an American company governed by American laws. As a friend of mine (law enforcement) says 努hen Justice and Legal are the same, it is a coincidence, they are not really related.

1. Farmtrac used to be a private company that bought parts from different suppliers (kits) and assembled the tractors at a factory in the US. A number of years ago they were on the edge of belly up when a India company who Farmtrac was buying kits from bought it, so that they could continue selling kits into the US market. The 擢armtrac equipment was manufactured off shore and assembled in the US similar to just about every other small tractor sold in North America.

2. Texton is in the business of lending money, and like a lot of other lending institutions they made it incredibly easy to borrow money. Farmtrac took advantage of that by sending inventory to dealers that wasn't ordered. Apparently the agreement that the dealers had with Farmtrac allowed the total value of the equipment to be financed thru Textron (similar to the local grocery store delivering stuff to your house while you are out of town and hitting your credit card for the cost). Also there seemed to be a less then 0% deal for the final customer we will inflate the price, you borrow more then you need from Textron and each month we (Farmtrac) will send you a check for 度 that you can use to make your payment to Textron.

3. I doubt if the company from India ever went 澱elly up? Some exec decided they weren't making enough cash with the Farmtrac company so he said no more. The result was that Farmtrac went into receivership. (might not be the correct term I am Canadian and the terminology may be different) but at any rate Farmtrac is no more.

4. Textron lends money and yes they expect it to be paid back according to the terms of the contract they have with the dealers and or customers. I don't see why they would ask for anything other then the terms of the contract, they make money by lending it out. The fact that the dealers don't/can't sell their inventory or the customers are not getting a check for 度 from Farmtrac is irrelevant to Textron, as it should be.

5. I don't know who the final customers should be angry with, there is a third party warranty provider, and parts can be purchased from any other company in the world that handles the kit that the original tractor was made from. Granted it is a pain in the rear and it may or may not be the local dealer they bought the tractor from but it can be done.

6. Dealers no longer have a Farmtrac dealership there is no Farmtrac, they have the option of signing on with a different manufacturer / distributor or get out of the business. Yes it is a pain in the rear but it is up to them what they want to do.

7. I don't know if it was an event worth noting on the the India parent company's books. Some exec decided that Farmtrac wasn't making enough money so they shut it down the cheapest way they could. They met all the requirements that were legally required. All of the assets of Farmtrac were sold, and whatever cash was raised was sent to the creditors. End of story.

As I said before I have no personal interest, other then learning from someone else's mistakes. I think this forum has become a crying session for a couple of dealers that don't want to get on with their life (or 1 person with a couple of aliases gota love the internet).

If you own a Farmtrac tractor I suspect your dealer is going to have to find a new supplier or you will have to find a different dealer to deal with. If you are a ex Farmtrac dealer I think you got screwed, but life goes on, if you want to continue being a tractor dealer find a new supplier that you are comfortable dealing with big company that manufactures and has an exec somewhere, or a smaller company that distributes with people you know. Your choice.

I don't think calling everyone from India crooks is fair, or insinuating that Textron is going broke and shouldn't be dealt with because they expect their money back is just plain petty. If I were to base my opinion of Americans based on this forum it would be pretty bad.

But please don't believe everything you read on the internet (this forum included), life is much better then that.

Gary

it is very clear from your post that your reaserch (if any) was flawed ,stating it kindly,Farmtrac of North American was a Indian creation and a subsidiuary of Escorts LTD .Escorts bought controlling shares from parties owning a company named Longaribusiness ,they then sent in Indian management who mismanaged the company into failure with Textron's full knowledge and consent, all while keeping dealers in the dark.
Now I am sure your Laws differ considerable in canada.but each state in the US has Buy-Back laws to protect dealers against such abuse. thus far Textron
has refused all requests to abide by these laws.
I would suggest that if you wish to be so precise in your posts, you refine your research methods concerning the subject matter at hand and also US and state laws.
from your post I discern you are a Montana owner, if you are bothered by the posts on this forum by those who stand to lose everything they honestly worked for, then I suggest you read a Montana forum or even better stick to canadian affairs.

Taxpayer

 

[redneckford]

it is very clear from your post that your research (if any) was flawed ,stating it kindly,Farmtrac of North American was a Indian creation and a subsidiary of Escorts LTD .Escorts bought controlling shares from parties owning a company named Longaribusiness ,they then sent in Indian management who mismanaged the company into failure with Textron's full knowledge and consent, all while keeping dealers in the dark.
Now I am sure your Laws differ considerable in Canada.but each state in the US has Buy-Back laws to protect dealers against such abuse. thus far Textron
has refused all requests to abide by these laws.
I would suggest that if you wish to be so precise in your posts, you refine your research methods concerning the subject matter at hand and also US and state laws.
from your post I discern you are a Montana owner, if you are bothered by the posts on this forum by those who stand to lose everything they honestly worked for, then I suggest you read a Montana forum or even better stick to Canadian affairs.

Taxpayer

LSU admits one of the oldest students to Law School!!!!????
how old will you be in four years if you don't go to law school!!!!

 

[taxpayer]

LSU admits one of the oldest students to Law School!!!!????
how old will you be in four years if you don't go to law school!!!!

If I make it 4 more years Red I'll have all the lord promised man.But heck I was just trying to start a war with canada, I could surrender after a couple of hrs and bailout of this mess on foreign aid from canada.after all the american taxpayer has been rebuilding the economy of every country we ever went to war with for years ,oughta work for us too..just good ol louisiana logic EH?

 

[redneckford]

If I make it 4 more years Red I'll have all the lord promised man.But heck I was just trying to start a war with canada, I could surrender after a couple of hrs and bailout of this mess on foreign aid from canada.after all the american taxpayer has been rebuilding the economy of every country we ever went to war with for years ,oughta work for us too..just good ol louisiana logic EH?

Darn the Knowledge -----just give him a Law Degree---he aced the test!!!!

 

[SESS]

Dear EasyEd

First off let me say that this is just my opinion based on what I have read here, other sources and my experience in general. I am a Canadian and have never seen a Farmtrac tractor or heard of them before I bought my Montana and started looking into the whole industry. I have great sympathy for the employees that lost their jobs, Any time a company closes their doors it is a bad thing for everyone. I also have to believe that everything that was required by law was done after all Farmtrac was an American company governed by American laws. As a friend of mine (law enforcement) says 努hen Justice and Legal are the same, it is a coincidence, they are not really related.

1. Farmtrac used to be a private company that bought parts from different suppliers (kits) and assembled the tractors at a factory in the US. A number of years ago they were on the edge of belly up when a India company who Farmtrac was buying kits from bought it, so that they could continue selling kits into the US market. The 擢armtrac equipment was manufactured off shore and assembled in the US similar to just about every other small tractor sold in North America.

2. Texton is in the business of lending money, and like a lot of other lending institutions they made it incredibly easy to borrow money. Farmtrac took advantage of that by sending inventory to dealers that wasn't ordered. Apparently the agreement that the dealers had with Farmtrac allowed the total value of the equipment to be financed thru Textron (similar to the local grocery store delivering stuff to your house while you are out of town and hitting your credit card for the cost). Also there seemed to be a less then 0% deal for the final customer we will inflate the price, you borrow more then you need from Textron and each month we (Farmtrac) will send you a check for 度 that you can use to make your payment to Textron.

3. I doubt if the company from India ever went 澱elly up? Some exec decided they weren't making enough cash with the Farmtrac company so he said no more. The result was that Farmtrac went into receivership. (might not be the correct term I am Canadian and the terminology may be different) but at any rate Farmtrac is no more.

4. Textron lends money and yes they expect it to be paid back according to the terms of the contract they have with the dealers and or customers. I don't see why they would ask for anything other then the terms of the contract, they make money by lending it out. The fact that the dealers don't/can't sell their inventory or the customers are not getting a check for 度 from Farmtrac is irrelevant to Textron, as it should be.

5. I don't know who the final customers should be angry with, there is a third party warranty provider, and parts can be purchased from any other company in the world that handles the kit that the original tractor was made from. Granted it is a pain in the rear and it may or may not be the local dealer they bought the tractor from but it can be done.

6. Dealers no longer have a Farmtrac dealership there is no Farmtrac, they have the option of signing on with a different manufacturer / distributor or get out of the business. Yes it is a pain in the rear but it is up to them what they want to do.

7. I don't know if it was an event worth noting on the the India parent company's books. Some exec decided that Farmtrac wasn't making enough money so they shut it down the cheapest way they could. They met all the requirements that were legally required. All of the assets of Farmtrac were sold, and whatever cash was raised was sent to the creditors. End of story.

As I said before I have no personal interest, other then learning from someone else's mistakes. I think this forum has become a crying session for a couple of dealers that don't want to get on with their life (or 1 person with a couple of aliases gota love the internet).

If you own a Farmtrac tractor I suspect your dealer is going to have to find a new supplier or you will have to find a different dealer to deal with. If you are a ex Farmtrac dealer I think you got screwed, but life goes on, if you want to continue being a tractor dealer find a new supplier that you are comfortable dealing with big company that manufactures and has an exec somewhere, or a smaller company that distributes with people you know. Your choice.

I don't think calling everyone from India crooks is fair, or insinuating that Textron is going broke and shouldn't be dealt with because they expect their money back is just plain petty. If I were to base my opinion of Americans based on this forum it would be pretty bad.

But please don't believe everything you read on the internet (this forum included), life is much better then that.

Gary

Dear Gary-

On your #1-#7........ WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, WRONG, and WRONG.

God Bless America and all the fine cititizens that are being victimized by foreigners that have no concept of truth, honesty and right/wrong. I must close this post and not say what I really want to say before I have my posting privileges taken away!

Thank you. SESS

 

[EasyEd]

Hey All,

Hmmm where to start...

1) I was just trying to understand the basics of what happened to farmtrac - company, dealers and customers. My gut feel is I'm not far off the mark. I've no idea if the Indian company did anything actually illegal but I would suggest that what they did is unethical - leaving dealers and apparently customers in the lurch.

2) Floorplanning (what a wierd term) companies are loan companies - make no mistake about it - they loan money expecting repayment plus interest upon sale of what is sold. They do loan to dealers and in many cases customers too. The whole concept started with Willys (when I was a kid we actually had a willy's 4 door sedan) car dealers back in I think the 40s and has gone on since then. You may say it's not a loan but if it walks like a duck... I never said Textron did anything wrong but they sure are apparently not cutting those who owe them - dealers - any slack in paying interest on the "loan" given these circumstances - there may be reasons why meaning money issues or just a very conservative I gotta get my money attitude. I never said that was wrong.

3) To me tractors are a microcosm of the world we live in. If this stuff is going on with tractors what else is it going on with and how as American and consumers in other countries do we fix it so these companies absolutely cannot play fast and loose with consumers without losing their shirts (and I mean management people - no liability escapes through incorporation) or going to jail? Notice what's happened on Wall Street lately - who is in jail or writing repayment checks?

4) How do we as consumers protect ourselves? How? If warranties are meaningless and parts can disappear - what are we to do? Well one possibility I suggested in another thread (which nobody has responded to) is having access to the data that actually shows who uses what parts in building tractors so that we can get parts from another tractor brand by knowing this info. Who has and updates that data - consumers need it for self protection. If it's unavailable - bout time for a law!

5) I never wanted to start a war between Canada and the US! I'm an American citizen and a permanent resident in Canada - for me the 49th parallel is nonexistent - I wanted my kids to have more opportunity as they too are American/Canadian. Also just as a historical aside Americans have to remember what happened last time there was a war between Canada and the US. White house was burned but Dolly madison saved some stuff.

-Ed-

 

[Tim C.]

Lgim, you switched boats mid river.

A:"similar to the local grocery store delivering stuff to your house while you are out of town and hitting your credit card for the cost".

B:"I don't see why they would ask for anything other then the terms of the contract, they make money by lending it out. The fact that the dealers don't/can't sell their inventory or the customers are not getting a check for 度 from Farmtrac is irrelevant to Textron, as it should be."

You can't logically connect the dots on those two statements. You have to take one side or the other. It is invalid or valid debt. It can't be both.

Tim