FarmPro 2425 No start and died while running!

[pollolittle]

Trying to help a neighbor fix his ride! He's convinced the motor is locked up and is on the fence to go buy a zero turn and turn the tractor out to pasture. I thought I would lend a hand, but unfortunately it appears this won't be simple and I am now in learn mode.

So, it is a FarmPro 2425. Was running fine and mowing, drove it up to the house, and while sitting there it died. Would not kick over or even attempt to kick over. Push the clutch in, and turn the keyswitch and it sounds like the starter engages for about a second and then stops. The motor doesn't budge or move or wink or dance, just stays stationary at the crank pulley.

If you jump the solenoid the starter will whirrrrrrr, but will not engage the flywheel.

He has already had the starter rebuilt, thought about taking it to autozone or somewhere to test it. Seems you could test it at the house also, just never done it. Pulled the starter off and made sure there was nothing jammed up inside the starter or against the flywheel. The bendix seems to be free and moves back and forth. The flywheel has some light wear on the outside edges of the teeth, but none are missing. Doesn't look like it has been trying to engage the flywheel. The bendix looks fine tooo.

We tried turning it over by hand, then by wrench, off of the crank pulley bolt. Unable to get it to budge, which is where neighbor thinks it is frozen. Should we be able to turn it and how hard should it be to turn it. I thought if we put it in high gear we might be able to push it and see if the motor would turn, we couldn't! Then we tried my small JD 4200 and we couldn't budge it either, so I'm thinking without a lot of effort it ain't moving anyway.

What is the shiny silver handle that goes from the operator station to the top of the valve cover?

 

[Bob Rooks]

If the engine locked up while slow idling it's most likely a hydraulic lock from coolant drawn in to the combustion chamber through a leaking/blown head gasket. What does the engine oil look like? What does the coolant look like, does there appear to be oil mixed with it?

Another possible scenario is that the hydraulic pump deadheaded.

That shiny little handle is probably your compression release.

I don't pretend to know much about the wheelies, but there are a lot of very knowledgeable members here that can help. Just thought I'd get the ball rolling.

 

[Rich Waugh]

That shiny silver handle is the compression release - turn it and it opens the exhaust valves to relieve compression. You should try that while cranking it - it sounds to me as though the engine is hydro-locked, that is, liquid (either fuel or oil) in one or more cylinders is preventing the piston form going over TDC. If the compression release doesn't work (some are not hooked up correctly) you can remove either the glow plugs or injectors to relieve compression. Then try turning it over and see what, if anything , comes out of the cylinder(s). Unless the engine was overheated it shouldn't be "siezed." Hydro-locking is a more common cause of the problem you describe, due to faulty injectors or other causes like Bob mentioned. Check the fluids as he suggested.

If you had managed to turn the engine over with a cylinder hydro-locked, you would have broken a piston or cylinder liner - that pre3ssure has to be relieved somewhere.

 

[Affordable]

Also look to see if there is a small gap between the back of the engine block and the flywheel housing , I have seen many times the bolts worked loose in the flywheel housing and caused the engine to act like it was locked up,I would bet that this is the problem, however to fix it you have to split the tractor and remove the flywheel. This FarmPro tractor 2425 is the same as the Jinma 200 series 254/284.We keep all the parts in stock for this tractor from a O-ring to a complete new engine


Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[pollolittle]

thanks so far for the replies, keep'em coming!

Affordable - that comment above would be a good time for a picture.

The radiator flluid looked okay, no oily mixture. He said he had checked the oil and it just looked dark black, no milky chocolate flavor.

Thanks for the heads up on the shiny silver handle or the exhaust compression release, that ya'll refer to. I was turning the handle and trying to turn the motor at the crank pulley and still couldn't get the motor to turn. Didn't try that before I took the starter off.

I still don't understand why the key makes a different engagement when starting and the starter whirrs, when jumping the terminals.

Also, what about the push start or how hard to turn the motor by hand, or can you, without releasing the glow plug or injectors?

 

[pollolittle]

Affordable - it is also leaking like a flour sifter, says it started leaking oil when he pulled it in his garage. It has been leaking hydraulic fluid for a while. Do you have better parts for it or is it the same stuff from the factory, which will then fail soon again? I like to fix and forget!

 

[Affordable]

If it's leaking motor oil between the flywheel housing and block its prob. what I said it is.If the seal is bad it's because the housing came loose and damaged it.I think you jumped across the wrong small wire. If you try jumping across the other small wire it should kick the starter drive out

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[pollolittle]

Thanks again, didn't expect so much help so quick. Ahhh, it makes sense now for the starter. Jumping across the two larger terminals just turns the motor, possibly, if I got that right. Then, jumping across the smaller wire should kick out the bendix and engage the flywheel. I have to go test that piece of info now.

So, apparently, there is a flywheel housing attached to the back of the motor. The housing comes looose and does what? Is it binding against the flywheel and putting pressure on the seal area of the crank and then oil is leaking out? Is there a parts diagram I can see?

 

[Affordable]

Yes that's prob, whats going on.there is a Yangdong Y385 parts book that has a breakdown of that area with part numbers The flywheel housing is # 61, the oil Seal is # 66,

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[pollolittle]

Clicking on your link to your site. I don't see that model. Will go Google it! Thanks interesting so far.

 

[pollolittle]

Found it very interesting and that is the area I saw oil seeping on the pavement. Right about mid tractor. Should be interesting to go look at it this evening.

Found the parts breakdown on johnsjinma.c** If nothing else, I should have more info tomorrow.

 

[pollolittle]

Is there a way to relieve the pressure off the crank to see if that's the problem without disassembling. Like jack up the center or pry the edge back and see if the crank will turn?

 

[Rich Waugh]

You can take a pair of jacks and carefully jack the engine with one and the transmission with the other until the bellhousing and flywheel covers are aligned with no visibly tapered gap anywhere, but that's still no guarantee that things won't still be binding inside if the flywheel has shifted any.

I had a problem with my 304 Jinma where the flywheel cover bolts weren't properly torqued down at the factory, causing shifting and a torn gasket, resulting in that telltale oil leak at the back of the engine oil sump. Had to split the tractor to fix it, which was intimidating to a novice, but iI managed it okay and all is well since then.

 

[pollolittle]

We tried to jack up the back half next to the flywheel housing and as it went in the air nothing moved. I can insert a screwdriver tip in a gap right above the starter, about the same height on the other side. I figure there shouldn't be a gap there and looks like gasket material above this point and I am unable to insert a screwdriver in that area. Appears to be where it is leaking oil also.

So, it would seem we are close! So, possible the flywheel is loose too and is binding on the housing or something.

 

[Affordable]

I'm pretty sure that's the problem,if you are mechanical and have a shop it's not that big of a deal to split the tractor.You just need to block it good and wedge the front pivot to keep it straight.More labor time than parts.You will prob. need a Oil seal, Flywheel gasket, bell housing gasket I would also replace the flywheel bolts with grade 8 bolts and locktite.You may also want to get one of our clutch alignment tools

Tommy
Affordbale Tractor Sales
"Your Jinma Parts Superstore"
Home of compact Jinma, Foton, and Koyker Tractors and Parts, Wood Chippers, Backhoes - Affordable Tractor Sales Company

 

[Rich Waugh]

You will absolutely want to get one of Tommy's clutch pilot tools! It will make lining up the clutch possible, even easy. I did mine before Tommy was selling those and had to make my own. Good thing I have a lathe.

While you have it split, this is the time to carefully do the clutch setup all over again and also to replace the throwout bearing if it looks at all suspicious. Cheap insurance. Also, when you're in there, replace the roll pin in the clutch actuator fork with a nested pair of roll pins or one of the better spiral spring pins - they've been known to shear, leaving you with no clutch and having to split the tractor to replace a fifteen cent part. Do it now!

I had to do all this to my tractor a couple three years ago and I documented it here: CHINESE TRACTOR WORLD FORUMS - Major Tractor Woes in Paradise You may find it helpful to check that out if you've nevr split a tractor before. It was my first time an I got a lot of good advice from both Tommy and Ronald from RanchHand Supply.

 

[quicksandfarmer]

To answer some of your other diagnostic questions: with a socket on the crank pulley it should take about 10 ft/lbs to turn the motor -- i.e. ten pounds of force on a 1-foot wrench. Not a whole lot.

Another thing to investigate: these tractors have quick-connects on the hydraulic lines. If one of them comes loose it will stop the flow of hydraulic oil, which will stop the pump, and either the motor will stall or the pump will self-destruct. I know from personal experience that the starter is not powerful enough to turn the engine with one of the quick-connects disconnected. While oil leaking from the midsection is obviously a problem, your immediate problem might be as easy to fix as reconnecting a hydraulic line.