Buying Advice Extra weight or Backhoe?

[sbeausol]

My research has finally narrowed down my choices somewhat, but I'm still hoping for feedback on a tractor. If you want the back story, go here http://www.tractorbynet.com/forums/buying-pricing-comparisons/334055-cut-sizing-advice.html, but in summary, I have 2.5 acres in MA which needs lots of overgrown shrubs/bushes cleaned up, lots of invasive bittersweet, saplings, small trees <6", and about 40 spruce trees all <16" in diameter (old christmas tree farm I think). In terms of the spruce trees, I figured I would cut them down with the chainsaw, move them with the tractor and either higher out the stump removed, or get them out with the tractor. I don't have a need to mow since I have a zero turn lawn mower, but I need something to help clear out the trees/bushes, level things out, and plant grass. I also could use something for snow removal, as well as patio work (brick). With these uses in mind, I've narrowed things down to two options:

1) A heavier L-series (L3301) with FEL and bucket spade (~$21k)
2) A B series with FEL and backhoe (B2620 or 2601 or 2650) (~$25k)

I have limited applications for the 3pt hitch. Maybe a log splitter, or wood chipper. I only burn a cord of wood a year so I'm not against old fashion splitting, but the wood chipper might be of use with all the trees I need to take down. For the work I'm thinking, it seems weight would be more useful than a backhoe, but I'd like to get others input. Here is a shot of the spruce trees I have to deal with...

 

[jeff9366]

This LINK will take you to a fairly complete list of implements, many of which would serve as counterbalance on your 3-Pt.:

http://www.lsuagcenter.com/NR/rdonl...45263BDD8/11557/pub2917tractorimplements1.pdf


Three Point Hitch mounted CARRYALLS (KK = $130) are another good option. Carryalls are customized in amazing ways.

Search Results - TractorByNet.com

 

[aginn]

I would be tempted to see if those trees could be pushed over. Before they are cut down you have a heck of a lot of leverage on them. It would save you a ton of digging the stumps if they can be pushed over.

 

[sbeausol]

I would be tempted to see if those trees could be pushed over. Before they are cut down you have a heck of a lot of leverage on them. It would save you a ton of digging the stumps if they can be pushed over.

Are you talking dig out around the tree with a backhoe then push it over?

 

[Oldoak]

You will be able to cut the those spruce trees and haul them away with either tractor you are looking to purchase. However, you might better plan on hiring those stumps removed using an industrial size machine. You are not going to push that size spruce trees over and are really going to really struggle trying to dig the stumps out with either tractor you are considering purchasing. A small backhoe can dig out some good size boulders but a ball of tree roots on >16 diameter stumps is much tougher. If you don't have much use for a backhoe, if it were me, between the two tractors, I would buy the L3301.

I don't know what you are planning for the area where the spruce trees are, but another option may be to just have the stumps ground down to ground level with a stump grinding machine. That would also eliminate the extra work of filling in the craters if the stumps are dug out or the entire trees are uprooted by toppling them over.

 

[2458n]

Looks like the trees are serving as a windbreak for a above ground septic system. Trees suck up a good deal of water.

 

[JOHNTHOMAS]

I bought some acres to build my home on 12 years ago. I cut cedars with a chain saw for a month. Neighbors had a man with a dozer on their land clearing site for their house and I had him come clear my home spot while he was here and seeing how quick he did it with the right size machine and experience I had him attack the balance of the trees I hadn't cut down yet. He did in about two or three hours what would have taken me another couple of months. I would have had several piles of downed trees to burn. He put all I had cut and what he pushed down root and all in one big burn pile. Some times it's best and cheapest to pay some one with the right equipment to do those one time jobs and then buy the machine for the 98% of the on going jobs you'll have. I've had him come back a couple more times to do some dangerous hillside cuts for me and I figure it was a cheap $200 to $300 each time.
Bs are work horse but Ls have the weight to do the heavy pushing work. Bs have more power than they have traction.

 

[cartod]

I bought some acres to build my home on 12 years ago. I cut cedars with a chain saw for a month. Neighbors had a man with a dozer on their land clearing site for their house and I had him come clear my home spot while he was here and seeing how quick he did it with the right size machine and experience I had him attack the balance of the trees I hadn't cut down yet. He did in about two or three hours what would have taken me another couple of months. I would have had several piles of downed trees to burn. He put all I had cut and what he pushed down root and all in one big burn pile. Some times it's best and cheapest to pay some one with the right equipment to do those one time jobs and then buy the machine for the 98% of the on going jobs you'll have. I've had him come back a couple more times to do some dangerous hillside cuts for me and I figure it was a cheap $200 to $300 each time.
Bs are work horse but Ls have the weight to do the heavy pushing work. Bs have more power than they have traction.

This^^^^^

You are not going to push the trees down, and digging the stumps with a small tractor is IMO a waste of time. Get past the trees and get the tractor you need. The hoe is good for planting trees, digging trenches for water lines etc. You will find that the hoe is a great counter weight but seldom do you need it. Mine rest comfortably in the barn waiting for a reason to be hooked back up. A box blade is a much more useful implement.

 

[jeff9366]

1) A heavier L-series (L3301) with FEL and bucket spade (~$21k)

If you decide on a Kubota 'L' series opt for the L2296 Heavy-Duty, Round-Back Bucket, which specs standard with desirable SSQA.

 

[sbeausol]

Ok good points. Seems I'm better suited for a heavy tractor w/FEL as opposed to a backhoe. Right now I'm looking at a used L3240 for $20k just have to determine private financing options...

 

[nybirdman]

The L3240 is a lot more tractor than the other two,no tier 4 stuff either.I had a L3130 ,the L3240 is it's replacement.They did offer two different loaders;a five series(maybe 514) and the 723 which has more lifting capacity.
I assume 4WD and HST but they did offer a glide shift transmission
Back hoes are nice if you have a "lot" of work for them,expensive lawn ornament when you don't.

 

[IslandTractor]

I've cleaned up very similar land here in coastal New England using a couple of different approaches with both a smaller (Kioti CK) and larger (Kioti DK) tractor. It can be done either way successfully. If time is important get the biggest heaviest tractor with a strong loader and grapple. If time is not critical but money is, then use the smaller tractor in conjunction with chain saw, grapple bucket and then go back with a rented mini excavator to dig out stumps.

I'm not sure that an L3301 is heavy enough to push over 6" trees. My Kioti DK is considerably heavier and using a grapple to dig up roots before pushing, I can get those sort of trees out without needing to cut them down. MUCH cleaner and less work in the long run than coming back to dig out a stump. To be clear, my standard approach involves a backhoe with ripper attachment to more efficiently tear out the side roots before pushing the tree over but if I don't have the backhoe mounted I can still get the job done with the loader. Again though, the Kioti DK loader is substantially stronger than the Kubota L series loaders so YMMV.

If clearing the trees and similar non mowing work is you main goal, you might consider Mahindra or Kioti in addition to Kubota. Generally, Kubotas are lighter and optimized for mowing. The other two are heavier and that can be an advantage doing land clearing. You get more loader for the buck too which is particularly useful in ripping up roots with a grapple.

 

[sbeausol]

I've cleaned up very similar land here in coastal New England using a couple of different approaches with both a smaller (Kioti CK) and larger (Kioti DK) tractor. It can be done either way successfully. If time is important get the biggest heaviest tractor with a strong loader and grapple. If time is not critical but money is, then use the smaller tractor in conjunction with chain saw, grapple bucket and then go back with a rented mini excavator to dig out stumps.

I'm not sure that an L3301 is heavy enough to push over 6" trees. My Kioti DK is considerably heavier and using a grapple to dig up roots before pushing, I can get those sort of trees out without needing to cut them down. MUCH cleaner and less work in the long run than coming back to dig out a stump. To be clear, my standard approach involves a backhoe with ripper attachment to more efficiently tear out the side roots before pushing the tree over but if I don't have the backhoe mounted I can still get the job done with the loader. Again though, the Kioti DK loader is substantially stronger than the Kubota L series loaders so YMMV.

If clearing the trees and similar non mowing work is you main goal, you might consider Mahindra or Kioti in addition to Kubota. Generally, Kubotas are lighter and optimized for mowing. The other two are heavier and that can be an advantage doing land clearing. You get more loader for the buck too which is particularly useful in ripping up roots with a grapple.

I've poked around at the Kioti's and I've certainly noticed they are heavier in general, but looking at the CK35 it comes in around 3200 lbs. The L3240 is the same with a wider wheelbase, and the L3301 comes in around 2800 lbs with the same wheelbase. I'm not sure how loader strength compares. The DK40 looks like a beast at around 4,000 lbs, but in fairness the L3940 comes in at 4,000 lbs as well. Of course I have no idea on price, but I'll ask around. Coming from someone who went from a CK20 to a DK40, is it safe to assume you undersized your first tractor? Maybe I'm putting too much into it, but I guess I'm trying to create the opposite problem - large tractor which I sell when the work is done for a smaller one...

Regardless of brand, it sounds like the backhoe might not be as useful for me as a grapple?

 

[landpride64]

Sbeausol. I'm in central MA and have a l3240 hst w la724 loader for sale. PM me if interested.

 

[sbeausol]

Sbeausol. I'm in central MA and have a l3240 hst w la724 loader for sale. PM me if interested.

PM sent

 

[IslandTractor]

I've poked around at the Kioti's and I've certainly noticed they are heavier in general, but looking at the CK35 it comes in around 3200 lbs. The L3240 is the same with a wider wheelbase, and the L3301 comes in around 2800 lbs with the same wheelbase. I'm not sure how loader strength compares. The DK40 looks like a beast at around 4,000 lbs, but in fairness the L3940 comes in at 4,000 lbs as well. Of course I have no idea on price, but I'll ask around. Coming from someone who went from a CK20 to a DK40, is it safe to assume you undersized your first tractor? Maybe I'm putting too much into it, but I guess I'm trying to create the opposite problem - large tractor which I sell when the work is done for a smaller one...

Regardless of brand, it sounds like the backhoe might not be as useful for me as a grapple?

1) I agree with John Thomas that if you have just one task requiring big equipment it makes sense to rent the equipment or hire it out.
2) As I recall from when I compared them, the DK40 is significantly heavier and has a stronger loader than the 3940. Just compare at the front axles. I think DK40se can be had for about $22K these days with loader if you can find one new. 2700+lbs of lift from the loader is a beautiful thing when combined with grapple for clearing land but, see #1.

 

[HarryN]

I vote for the backhoe!