Electrical issue and question

   / Electrical issue and question #31  
Can you jump the starter relay by shorting between the battery power side of the relay to one of the smaller ignition studs out front of the relay... You can by pass the ignition, it won't start but you can eliminate the relay mounting and ground and maybe eliminate the starter.

I still would like to see pictures.
 
   / Electrical issue and question #32  
Ok, lets go over what we know now. It seems you have a bad battery or two right? I assume you are buying a new one now.

If that doesn't fix the problems, lets go back over the basics and define our goals.
The problem is the engine wont crank, correct? Not whether the ignition works or not. Lets just concentrate on getting the engine crankshaft to turn under power of the starter motor.

So after replacing the battery, and the engine still will not crank, lets start over by measuring for voltage on the large bolt on the starter while attempting to start. Do we have a nominal 12 volts on this large bolt? this should be a direct connection from the battery. Now what about the starter solenoid bolt/connection. ? What do we have there? Do we have a good connection from the starter to the frame?

Lets review what the starter solenoid and starter does and how they work. Now I don't know anything about a "mule" but most starters are just a DC motor that draws a large amount of current especially when it is actually spinning the engine over. What is the purpose of the starter solenoid? It is two fold, it is high current "contactor" which is like a relay in that regard, but it also has a mechanical function in that it moves the pinion gear into contact with the ring gear on the flywheel.
How does it doe this? Well it has a coil just like a relay, but this coil is very powerful and has the mechanical strength to move that gear into engagement with the flywheel against a powerful spring and at the same time its electrical function is to make a sizeable set of contacts engage to make the final connection of the battery to the stator of the DC motor portion of the starter.

So this starter solenoid portion of the starter itself draws a sizeable amount of current and is more than the little key switch could handle, so we use a starter relay that can handle this current thru its contacts that is energized by its coil which is connected to the key switch contacts which can only handle a small amount of current.

So, knowing all of this, the question becomes, Does the starter solenoid connection have voltage when the key is turned to the start positon? If not, did the starter relay coil pull in? if not did the key switch apply power to the starter relay coil? Does the other side of the starter relay coil have a ground so that current will flow thru the coil? Are there safety switches?

Answer some of these questions, and let us know what you find.:) I realize all of this is just words, but I am a bit far away to be of much actual physical help, and words are all I have to help you with.
 
   / Electrical issue and question
  • Thread Starter
#33  
OK - quick update.
A buddy of mine with a good deal of electrical experience came over last night and we got to work. He is where I am as of now:

I bought the new battery and it is on the charger
Found the brake switch is bad (all it does is the brake light so it is not related to my issue)
The interlock is working and tested good.
The starter was locked - we jumped it and nothing. Ended up pulling the starter and solenoid and ordered the new set today.
Also discovered the relay that NAPA said was an exact match was NOT. Looked the same, had the same unusual fitting but the internal "switching" was not set up the same on the same pins. Pulled it and ordered the correct replacement.
Seems to have hit several problems - not sure what happened to the battery, it was not too old (I don't think but I got the machine used late last summer) but with the other problems who knows what happened.
Anyway the new parts should be in later this week so I hope to have it up and running by next Saturday!
THANK YOU all for the help and I will let you know what happens with it next week.
The good thing is I learned a LOT and also got a crash course in reading wiring diagrams so other than $120 in parts it was a good learning opportunity....
 
   / Electrical issue and question #34  
Great update. Thanks. Keeps us posted. And Good Luck, looks like you are on the road to success.
 
   / Electrical issue and question
  • Thread Starter
#35  
I sure hope so! LOL
THANKS
 

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