Diabetes

[Gale Hawkins]

'Keto', is that some oriental person? me, I'm totally carnivorous. No vegetable and fruit diet here. Gimme lean beef anyday. I do consume fruit but in moderation and so far at 74 years old, no issue with it and I tend to consume meat that I have raised myself or shot during season.

Typically Keto means eating at or under 50 grams of carbs daily the major source of glucose. Some protein gets converted to glucose. Fats don't convert to glucose. Ketones can improve damaged hearts ejection rates and help reduce brain fog caused by high glucose life styles.

The transition from burning mainly glucose to burning mainly ketones will change one's gut microbiome. I found it to be hell for the first month as the microbiome that was killing me died off.

It became clear to me in 2014 that I was going to die is if I didn't get off of high carbs and move to a ketogenic Way of Eating. Long COVID caused me to forget that fact.

Keto is not magic but it can seem that way for some of us.

Finding healthcare providers that understand the pros and cons of a ketogenic Way of Eating is advisable.

There's no one way of eating that fits everyone.

In 2014 the arthritis was so bad our 16 year old son was helping me get in and out of vehicles.

My wakeup call came when doctors scheduled me to start Enbrel injections in 90 days. 60 days later I was still living on carbs so I went Keto cold turkey. It was a hellish 21 days but when I went back for my 90 day appointment I was able to say no to the Enbrel injections because my pain was already being managed by my diet. It took me about a year to lose 80 lb and rebuild enough muscles where I could get around well.

 

[daugen]

Gale, that is quite a success story. I have SDDD, fused neck, back giving out, and am overweight.
236 isn't so terrible when i was 5'11".
But my spine has collapsed enough I'm now down to 5'9"
I don't get credit for those two inches I lost...

I take a lot of extra vitamins and mineral supplements to help out but wonder if I simply would hurt less
if I gave up all those carbs. I've been on Celebrex for over ten years and it's hard on my stomach. And maybe even my heart.

I guess I should stroll through the special food section in local higher end market, see what they have.
Like Keto bread. I wonder what I can eat...surely do love my seeded rye, and pumpernickel, and sourdough, and...............

sometimes you just have to try different things, particularly if what you are doing isn't working so well
makes sense that how we fuel this engine will affect how it runs and lasts.

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Gale, that is quite a success story. I have SDDD, fused neck, back giving out, and am overweight.
236 isn't so terrible when i was 5'11".
But my spine has collapsed enough I'm now down to 5'9"
I don't get credit for those two inches I lost...

I take a lot of extra vitamins and mineral supplements to help out but wonder if I simply would hurt less
if I gave up all those carbs. I've been on Celebrex for over ten years and it's hard on my stomach. And maybe even my heart.

I guess I should stroll through the special food section in local higher end market, see what they have.
Like Keto bread. I wonder what I can eat...surely do love my seeded rye, and pumpernickel, and sourdough, and...............

sometimes you just have to try different things, particularly if what you are doing isn't working so well
makes sense that how we fuel this engine will affect how it runs and lasts.

What we put in our mouths is pretty much controlled by what our gut microbiome commands of our brains.

It's makeup and balance determines our health outcomes.

Most of us prefer a ugly premature death over giving up bread.

Thankfully most don't have a sugar problem and can eat what they want when they want it.

My form of arthritis (Ankylosing Spondylitis) has been with me for 60 years. Walking is key for my longevity. I took a lot of damage from Rx meds but take no prescription meds for the last decade.

Best of success in finding a diet that manages your health well.

 

[daugen]

I guess it pays to hustle a little bit...

https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/28/health/walking-speed-lowers-diabetes-risk-wellness/index.html

 

[Gale Hawkins]

Carbs burned the day they are consumed are not hanging around causing inflammation.in the body.

Cancer risk could increase with consumption of certain foods and drinks, study finds

Carbs strike again?

 

[BnRidge]

It's a good idea to be critical of published studies, and how they are reported.

Parachute use to prevent death and major trauma when jumping from aircraft: randomized controlled trial - PubMed

Parachute use did not reduce death or major traumatic injury when jumping from aircraft in the first randomized evaluation of this intervention. However, the trial was only able to enroll participants on small stationary aircraft on the ground, suggesting cautious extrapolation to high altitude...

pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[ArlyA]

I guess it pays to hustle a little bit...

https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/28/health/walking-speed-lowers-diabetes-risk-wellness/index.html

Ya, we all need to move around some.

 

[scootr]

I've been on a Keto diet and Turmeric for 6 months. Arthritis greatly reduced. Bad back pain reduced. Lost weight. Growing clear toenails. Prostate shrunk. Getting my 5k steps in each day. Monitoring blood sugar and pressure. I supplement with Flaxseed oil and few other essentials.
I eat mostly eggs, meats, and veggies. Seriously limited carbs. No sugar. Selected fruits. My a1c is dropping like a stone. I feel better burning fat instead of carbs.
There are many reduced carb breads from "Killer Dave's Bread" at most grocery stores with lots of seeds. And a 1 carb per slice white bread at Walmart for those who still can eat breads.

 

[scootr]

True. I went in for a diabetic dietary class mandated by my health provider about 15 yrs ago. They still advocated eating carbs 3 times a day with veggies and meat as a way to control BS levels...and that may work for somebody without diabetes

 

[dmccarty]

This is an ancient discussion and I may have mentioned this in the past but it bares repeating...

My granny always talked about The Three Evil White Foods, white flour, white sugar and white rice, which are all carbs and processed. I am attending a weekly nutrition class just to learn things and one of the issues they keep mentioning is that the more processed the food, the worse it is for your health. Granny was telling me that when I was a kid.

While I do not have diabetes, I did fall into the trap of eating carbs, especially the more processed "stuff." Over the years, I have reduced the processed carbs from what I eat, which has helped me loose and keep weight off.

More by dumb luck than anything else, I started Intermittent Fasting to loose weight, to keep it off, and be healthier. I am really surprised at how much I don't eat anymore, nor do I feel the need to eat, i.e., I don't fee hungry. Five days a week, which is more than is recommended, I only eat in a 6-8 hour period thus fasting for 16-18 hours. Over the Thanksgiving break, I went 20ish hours without food a couple of day because I was busy and not really hungry. Surprisingly, I don't feel hungry or tired fasting like this.

Having said that, before Thanksgiving my weight popped up a bit so I have to get it back down a bit, and I still want to loose five or so pounds.

One of the reasons I gained some weight prior to Thanksgiving was carbs. I really stay away from carbs, especially donuts, sweet buns, cake, pie, etc. However, I was craving some pie so I had some a month or so ago. Then I had some breakfast sweet buns. The other craving was for biscuits and sausage.

I had the biscuits and sausage a couple of times, which added weight but made me feel tired and sluggish. It was the white flour.... To put it another way, I was more tired after eating some biscuits than when I don't eat for 16-18 hours, or even 20ish hours.

A family member had cancer twice. They were addicted to carbs, the more processed the "better" and I really think the processed carbs had something to do with the cancer.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

You are looking at the numbers wrong. You might be comparing people with people-years?

https://www.cnn.com/2023/10/19/health/red-meat-type-2-diabetes-risk-study-wellness/index.html

By the end of the follow-up periods, nearly 22,800 people developed type 2 diabetes, and those who ate the most total red meat had a 62% higher risk of developing the disease, compared with people who ate the least. Eating the most processed or unprocessed red meat was linked with a 51% and 40% higher risk of type 2 diabetes, respectively.



The Keto diet - "More Heart Trouble for the Keto Group After an average of nearly 12 years of follow-up, individuals on a keto-like diet had more than double the risk of having several major cardiovascular events, such as blockages in the arteries that needed stents, heart attack, stroke, and peripheral arterial disease."

MSN

I didn't read all the details, but didn't see where they controlled for obesity.

I used to be diabetic, but am not any more, thanks to a 70+ lb. long term weight loss. Another 30 lbs. and I'll be to my ideal weight (215), so you can see I used to be morbidly obese, but am not any more. Shedding 70 lbs. was not easy, but I was motivated. I have friends who have died of diabetes. A neighbor down the road has had parts of his feet amputated because of diabetes.

My physician (a Chinese MD with a specialty in geriatric medicine) counseled me that diabetes can be controlled with weight loss and exercise. I listened. Red meat is very calorie rich, particularly the fatty cuts like prime ribeye. An example of my red meat consumption was a package of 93% lean burger, fried wiht the same amount of onions, and mixed with Sloppy Joe tomato sauce, so only about 1/3 is actually meat, the rest vegetable. Then I nuke a baking spud, mash it up, add a topping of Sloppy Joe, and that's a meal. We eat a lot of crock pot soup, often vegetable beef. My urologist says not to eat nuts because they are high in oxalates, and give me kidney stones. I have pretty much eliminated high carbs from my diet. No maple bars. No pancakes with syrup. Sarah Lee 45 calorie per slice multi-grain sandwiches. And no freaking pizza. Pizza is my downfall.

The secret to a healthy diet is a variety of meaty and planty bits. Fish and fowl along with red meat, plenty of vegetables, home made probiotic fermented foods like pickles and kraut, and drink water instead of soft drinks. Over the last 3 years my A1C has gone for 8.3 to 5.6. Dying from diabetes is not pretty. I don't know what will get me, but blood sugar is not going to be it.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

This is an ancient discussion and I may have mentioned this in the past but it bares repeating...

My granny always talked about The Three Evil White Foods, white flour, white sugar and white rice, which are all carbs and processed. I am attending a weekly nutrition class just to learn things and one of the issues they keep mentioning is that the more processed the food, the worse it is for your health. Granny was telling me that when I was a kid.

And the more expensive. A can of soup costs $2.50 any more. Soup. It's mostly water. We do a crock pot full of soup, mostly home canned tomato sauce and vegetables, with a little meat, and get the same thing for less than 50 cents. People who buy Hamburger Helper are paying for the box. The food only costs pennies. We processed 20 lbs. of squash from unsold Halloween pumpkins that people were giving away.

If you buy it in a box or wrapped in plastic, you are paying for cardboard and plastic, not food. I'm with you about carbs. Donuts are the devil's food, sugar and grease with enough white flour to hold it together. Donuts kill. My primary carb source is potatoes, often as a soup ingredient.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

What we put in our mouths is pretty much controlled by what our gut microbiome commands of our brains.

My gourmet urges made me ferment my own pickles and kraut. Then those same urges made me eat them raw instead of canned, because cooking them kills that wonderful crunch. I still have some fresh dills in the refrigerator from the last batch, and make kraut several times a year. The acidophilus yeast is a wonderful probiotic. I had digestive problems for years when I was younger, but they have all gone away. I don't know for certain that the pickles did it but, "Don't mess with success."

 

[ArlyA]

I didn't read all the details, but didn't see where they controlled for obesity.

I used to be diabetic, but am not any more, thanks to a 70+ lb. long term weight loss. Another 30 lbs. and I'll be to my ideal weight (215), so you can see I used to be morbidly obese, but am not any more. Shedding 70 lbs. was not easy, but I was motivated. I have friends who have died of diabetes. A neighbor down the road has had parts of his feet amputated because of diabetes.

My physician (a Chinese MD with a specialty in geriatric medicine) counseled me that diabetes can be controlled with weight loss and exercise. I listened. Red meat is very calorie rich, particularly the fatty cuts like prime ribeye. An example of my red meat consumption was a package of 93% lean burger, fried wiht the same amount of onions, and mixed with Sloppy Joe tomato sauce, so only about 1/3 is actually meat, the rest vegetable. Then I nuke a baking spud, mash it up, add a topping of Sloppy Joe, and that's a meal. We eat a lot of crock pot soup, often vegetable beef. My urologist says not to eat nuts because they are high in oxalates, and give me kidney stones. I have pretty much eliminated high carbs from my diet. No maple bars. No pancakes with syrup. Sarah Lee 45 calorie per slice multi-grain sandwiches. And no freaking pizza. Pizza is my downfall.

The secret to a healthy diet is a variety of meaty and planty bits. Fish and fowl along with red meat, plenty of vegetables, home made probiotic fermented foods like pickles and kraut, and drink water instead of soft drinks. Over the last 3 years my A1C has gone for 8.3 to 5.6. Dying from diabetes is not pretty. I don't know what will get me, but blood sugar is not going to be it.

Ya, you got that right. Nuts do contain some nutrients you can't get elsewhere.

 

[daugen]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/30/health/vegan-twin-study-wellness/index.html

identical twins, one had 25% drop in insulin in 8 weeks going vegan

 

[ArlyA]

https://www.cnn.com/2023/11/30/health/vegan-twin-study-wellness/index.html

identical twins, one had 25% drop in insulin in 8 weeks going vegan

This is too small a study. They state "However, the recruitment of identical twins into dietary intervention studies is challenging; this is why the design has been rarely used in nutritional studies,” Hu said. “Also, the findings from identical twins may not be generalizable to the general population."

We are omnivores, a balanced good tasting diet is best.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

A neighbor just gave us a fresh elk liver. We'll serve it with vegetables. Mmmm, onions.

 

[dmccarty]

And the more expensive. A can of soup costs $2.50 any more. Soup. It's mostly water. We do a crock pot full of soup, mostly home canned tomato sauce and vegetables, with a little meat, and get the same thing for less than 50 cents. People who buy Hamburger Helper are paying for the box. The food only costs pennies. We processed 20 lbs. of squash from unsold Halloween pumpkins that people were giving away.

If you buy it in a box or wrapped in plastic, you are paying for cardboard and plastic, not food. I'm with you about carbs. Donuts are the devil's food, sugar and grease with enough white flour to hold it together. Donuts kill. My primary carb source is potatoes, often as a soup ingredient.

Yep, the more process, the more it costs, both to buy the "food" and then the cost to one's health.

Before my wifey lost the ability to eat beans, we ate them all of the time. I would make a big pot of beans on the weekend, can four quarts, and we would eat the rest during the week. The beans were cooked with carrots, onions, garlic, and mushrooms. If I had left over smoked pork loin, I would dice that up and put it in the beans. This could be eaten as a soup, put over rice, or pasta. Add a bit of grated cheese would change the dish too. From one pot of beans, one got a variety of meals/flavors, it was CHEAP and HEALTHY.

I LOVE Krispy Kreme donuts, aka, Fat Pills since they are fried dough coated in sugar. When they are warm and fresh from the oven, I could eat at least six of them, if not a dozen, but they will kill you. Donuts were at work they other day, I did not go look at them to stay away from temptation. I don't think they were Kripsy Kreme donuts, but I did not want to break my fast, and certainly did not want to do so with donuts, so I just stayed away from them.

 

[Larry Caldwell]

Yep, the more process, the more it costs, both to buy the "food" and then the cost to one's health.

Before my wifey lost the ability to eat beans, we ate them all of the time. I would make a big pot of beans on the weekend, can four quarts, and we would eat the rest during the week. The beans were cooked with carrots, onions, garlic, and mushrooms. If I had left over smoked pork loin, I would dice that up and put it in the beans. This could be eaten as a soup, put over rice, or pasta. Add a bit of grated cheese would change the dish too. From one pot of beans, one got a variety of meals/flavors, it was CHEAP and HEALTHY.

I LOVE Krispy Kreme donuts, aka, Fat Pills since they are fried dough coated in sugar. When they are warm and fresh from the oven, I could eat at least six of them, if not a dozen, but they will kill you. Donuts were at work they other day, I did not go look at them to stay away from temptation. I don't think they were Kripsy Kreme donuts, but I did not want to break my fast, and certainly did not want to do so with donuts, so I just stayed away from them.

Beans and cabbage go great in soup. We make a lot of minestrone and go heavy on the beans. A 2 day soak and rinse will get the farts out of the beans. They have complex sugars that the human digestive tract can't handle, but the little gas bugs love. I put a splash of vinegar, just a little, in the water to give the acidophilus yeast a jump on the competition and soak them until they start to form a yeast scum on top, then rinse thoroughly and cook. Soup, chili, ham and beans. Lots of cheap boiler onions in the ham and beans.

We make at least one soup a week, not always with beans, but we never throw out produce, just toss it into the soup. The most expensive food in the world is the food you buy but don't eat.

 

[daugen]

another study in, this one a British 12 year study
simply reinforces links between diabetes and obesity and certain life style choices, like being a vegetarian

https://www.cnn.com/2023/12/19/health/healthy-vs-unhealthy-plant-diets-wellness/index.html

Larry, living alone makes it hard for me to buy lettuce and other veggies that are highly spoilable.
So sadly I wind up throwing out stuff because in some cases I forgot it was in that drawer....
Your soup pot sounds good, particularly
during the winter.

I baked some potatoes this past week. I put one pat of butter on each potato.
I wonder what else I could have used (sour cream likely lower in fat?) that is healthier but gives the potato
some moisture and flavor.
no bacon, no cheese, the old favorites, what else can I use?

if I make my own potato chips and air fry them, is that healthier than baking???
with potatoes, always seems to come down to what are you going to put on top and usually that's the part
that's not so healthy.

I love baked potatoes. Always eat the skins. Love crunchy skins.
I do try to eat sweet potatoes/yams at times. Their skins can get kinda leathery...