Deep well / tank question

[GA Cracker]

Deep well / tank question

I never had a deep well before and probably should have done a some research before putting my well back together. I purchased a Florida property with a mobile home about the time Hurricane Helene hit. A huge tree landed square on top of the well. Parts, plumbing, tank, check valve etc scattered around the yard. After cutting the tree off, discovered a 4” steel well casing with a well cap shoved down 18”inside the casing with a broke off 2-1/4” Tee and 12” nipple (all galvanized steel) laying inside. By luck the well pipe was still barely hanging in the rubber of the well cap and didn’t fall in.

I cut the well casing off just below the stuck well cap. And struggled to get well pipe up high enough to weld the casing back on. I cut the top of the damaged well pipe off, re threaded it, installed a new well cap and threaded a new 1-1/4” tee on top. The well is now hanging from the Tee that is supported by the well cap. With it powered up, the well still pumps good.

I found that the tank had all the fittings broke off with the remains of a float switch still in it. I put in a new Air Volume Control unit with float, pressurized the tank and checked for leaks. All is well. I thought it odd there wasn’t a Schroeder valve on the tank. I then discovered there wasn’t a bladder in the tank. Didn’t know there was such a thing as a bladder-less tank. I started reading about tanks, AVC valves, etc. I read that a check valve should be installed in the well if using an ACV float valve system.

Trailer will only be visited a few times a year, not concerned with smell or freezing.
The well is extremely difficult to pull up, although it will sure fall down in a hurry. I suspect pump may be swelled up. I’m unable to make any modifications or install a check valve below the well cap without opening up a can of worms..

My question is, does a check valve need to be installed at the top of the well? Does one need to be installed at all? Can i use the system as is, plug the tank where the float valve is, be vigilant about keeping the tank at 38 PSI ( 60/40 pressure switch) and have a working water system.?
Or can I have a check valve before the tank and keep the float (AVC) valve?

 

[part-time-Farmer-NC]

My "check valve" is on the pump at the bottom of the motor. We call them footer valves too. It is there to stop water from running out of the pipe back into the pump when it turns off.

 

[part-time-Farmer-NC]

The layout of the pump wiring etc depends on the well pump used. Mine is a 220 starting at the bottom of the well, pump + wires (mine I think was 3 might have been 4 wires) _ plumbing pipes. Plumbing goes to the pressure tank. Pump has the check valve at the bottom of it.

The electrical goes to a box that controls the starter and from the starter to the pressure switch. Plumbing continues into the house.

The pump before this one didn't need the electrical box and the pump was controlled by the pressure switch. Not sure when they changed that design.

I think that is all correct.

 

[GA Cracker]

I think i found the answer to my question. This old system probably has a bleeder valve on the well pipe below ground and is supposed to have a sniffer valve between the well and the tank. if i want to keep this tank, i'll have to find the old sniffer valve or purchase a new one if i can't find it.

I'd like to go with a new bladder tank, but appears the bladder tank should not have a bleeder valve or a sniffer valve. But since i can't pull the well up far enough to remove the bleeder valve, I'm stuck with this old system.

 

[jyoutz]

I think i found the answer to my question. This old system probably has a bleeder valve on the well pipe below ground and is supposed to have a sniffer valve between the well and the tank. if i want to keep this tank, i'll have to find the old sniffer valve or purchase a new one if i can't find it.

I'd like to go with a new bladder tank, but appears the bladder tank should not have a bleeder valve or a sniffer valve. But since i can't pull the well up far enough to remove the bleeder valve, I'm stuck with this old system.

I just had my well pump replaced. The 2hp pump is at 660’ (33 20’ pipe sticks). The well service company brought the truck with the A frame rig, pulled and replaced the pump and controller and charged $800 for the service labor. It took them all day so I thought the price wasn’t bad (for labor). The new pump and controller price made me cry. Maybe you need to get someone with a A frame to pull your pump and pipes.

 

[steve tym]

You don't need the system to automatically add air if you do it periodically with an air compressor.
If you add a schrader valve to the check valve before the tank, it has to have a light spring in it so it will open under a vacuum. The bleeder in the well opens when it is not under pressure, the schrader valve opens and allows air into the pipe. When the pump turns back on, it pushes that air into the tank keeping it balanced. When too much air is in the tank, the air volume control lets the excess air out. If you put in a captive air tank (bladder tank) and don't remove the bleeder in the well, you will probably end with air in the system.

 

[GA Cracker]

That makes sense. Very helpful. thanks for the replies!

 

[TheGoose]

As stated , you have a bleeder system.

Bleeder has 4 parts. The bleeder itself, usually a rubber device with a flap. Opens when pressured up, relaxes when no water pressure present. Check valve between the pump and tank, keeps the water from continuously draining via the bleeder.

Snifter valve, looks like a schraeder valve except it has a light spring. Usually placed on the check valve, called a double tap check. One tap for the snifter, one for a pressure switch or gauge. One tap is tank sides one is pump side.

Finally, an air release on the tank.

Pump kicks on, flapper closes, water fills tank. Pump shuts off, check valve closes. Flapper opens up, water drains out. Snifter releases the vacuum, fills the pipe with air. Next cycle pump kicks on, shoves the air forward back to the tank. Tank fills with air, air release opens and lets out excess air via the float.

 

[TheGoose]

Most people don’t understand how a hydro pneumatic tank works. The air pressure in the tank has zero relevance. The only thing that’s relevant is the VOLUME of air when the tank is pressured up.

 

[Valveman]

In many areas, and GA is one of them, there is sulfur or iron in the water. The air over water or "hydro" tank system aerates the water and dissipates or precipitates the sulfur and/or iron. Many people switch from a hydro tank to a bladder/diaphragm tank and then start smelling rotten eggs. There are ways to treat iron/sulfur and use a bladder/diaphragm tank. But it is usually not needed if you stay with the old hydro tank as that has apparently been working all along. No iron or sulfur, a diaphragm tank system has a lot fewer moving parts and needs much less maintenance.