Computer selection - please advice

[Alan L.]

Consider a hybrid drive. SSD even faster, but I have had 40% failure rate on 5 Crucial SSDs. So far so good on 2 Intel SSDs. Both extremely fast and you will find that conventional hard drive a real bottleneck on that otherwise fast system.

 

[ArtMech]

\
Money well spent by "DAN" too For what you're doing, you may be glad you spent the extra vs wishing you'd done it.

Yes, I hope so. And it makes me optimistic.
BTW, Dan is a very good guy!

 

[ArtMech]

I'd start with an Intel i3 or i5. At those lower end cpu's I've heard those are the better choices. A laptop might be handy -- depends on what you are doing. But you can take it from the shop, to breakfast table, to bathroom if you need. An i3 will run sketchup, do email, run Excel, and browse the net ( I use Chrome). I don't like win8 -- hate it in fact. But if you get it, and don't like the wizbang user interface, you can download 'classic shell' and get your start menu back. I say this because you may find that win8 comes installed and you have no choice. I don't think one brand has a big advantage over another. I have heard good things about Asus. I bought my daughter a HP, which seems decent. I have a Toshiba and older Lenovo. My son has an Acer. The old Lenova has the best keyboard -- but the newer ones are probably not as good. We test drove an Asus. I liked the keyboard, but the HP had the i3 for just a bit more $. The HP's keyboard is better than the Acer.

I'd probably look for best price on an i3 or i5. Then shoot for the Asus, HP, Dell, Lenovo, and last Acer. Our i3 HP was $380 I think. 4GB RAM, 500 GB disk. I'd buy a cheap external disk also -- and then backup the important stuff. Try to get one that has space for 8GB RAM if possible. But that depends... I figure the i3 will last us at minimum 3 years -- more likely 5 -- and possibly 7.

If you are going to get a desktop -- those can be pretty cheap also. And you already have the keyboard, mouse, and display (or will have). Then you can just focus on the CPU really. The laptops are handy.. but more flimsy.. so if you are hard on things, consider that.

I look for where there is a big price drop-off. Right now that seems to be the i3 or i5. You go above that you and you are paying for the privilege to own newer technology. I let those who need it pay for it, and I take the sweepings that give me all I need at sub $500 prices. My 2 cents.

PS -- but I don't use Autocad. And I don't do anything graphics intense. I find sketchup is all I need -- and more -- and runs fast on the i3, or in fact, older CPUs.

Thanks for useful write up.
No, all three versions of computers presented here are not installed with any of OS, I can choose whatever I want and will have to pay separately. I took a look at Lynux desktops. These are good, some with i7 and cheaper ones, but already installed. However I'd like to stay with Windows. My most preferable version is W7.

The brand names you have mentioned are known here too, I've checked Dell and Lenovo. Agree, the deeper you're in, the wider vision opens to make correct decision. What I don't like is to walk around the shops looking for something. Well, you may choose internet search and/or phone calls, but for me it's better to talk eye-to-eye although you're burning lots of time and fuel to reach the shops. And I'd prefer to assemble all necessary fast and from nearly first attempt. In this case yes, I'm not looking for anything else except desktop. My display, keyboard and laser mouse are working perfectly for the time being, so why should I replace them. And I'm deliberately bypassing a laptop not because I hate them, I'm not, but just to avoid some specificity of use and work with them.
I'm hunting above i3 or i5 just because I want it to fit my present requirements having nothing to think about IT issues at my work today and to move next step of upgrade for the future as far as I can. Again, to avoid extra visits of the shops.

Next week I'll have to choose a desktop of two - newer version of the 3rd (i7-3770, 16 GB DDR3) and the 2nd (i7-3770, 8 GB DDR3) proposals described in the above replies. Both equipped with GeForce GTX660, 2GB VGA. The 3rd proposal's price is not known yet.
So I wouldn't like to hesitate anymore, unless any joker will come on.
And thank you again.

 

[troutsqueezer]

Just so you know, i3, i5 and i7 are all current technology. In fact, the way it works is, we design the i7 mask (for the silicon) and put in fuses along the way that get blown to disable some of the circuitry on the die. This brings the CPU performance down from an i7 to an i5 or i3 level. The silicon for all three is the same and by default, so is the technology. This saves having to manufacture three different CPU's/wafers and cuts down on mistakes. When the silicon is sawed from the wafer, all the substrates are i7's until the fuses get blown. When you buy an i3, all the circuitry for the i7 is there, you just can't access it. If the designs were broken down into three different wafers, the cost of manufacturing would not be any different among the three to any large degree. Actually, it would be higher as mask design and tooling costs would rise. Profit for the i7 is, of course, much higher than the i5, i3 since there is no difference in manufacturing costs.

BTW, when I say "we", I retired from Intel less than a year ago so officially, its now "they".

 

[dmccarty]

...
So you're really good my money spender... :muttering:

Just to give you even more to think about... :laughing::laughing::laughing:

You can always go for a cheaper CPU now, something that you think will work for you, and in the future put in a faster CPU.

I was going to do this with my desktop but I waited too long. :shocked::laughing::laughing::laughing: By the time I needed to upgrade the CPU, the CPU technology had moved on and the old CPU were not being made to fit my mother board. Oh Well. :laughing::laughing::laughing:

That desktop is most likely going to be moved to the living room so we can more easily stream video from the Internet to the TV, and for that application, it has plenty of CPU HP.

Later,
Dan

 

[Western]

How long did you wait Dan?? a week!!:laughing: Technology changes so fast. I built my pc on a SandyBridge board, then 3 months later Iveybridge shows up....go figure.

 

[ArtMech]

Just so you know, i3, i5 and i7 are all current technology. In fact, the way it works is, we design the i7 mask (for the silicon) and put in fuses along the way that get blown to disable some of the circuitry on the die. This brings the CPU performance down from an i7 to an i5 or i3 level. The silicon for all three is the same and by default, so is the technology. This saves having to manufacture three different CPU's/wafers and cuts down on mistakes. When the silicon is sawed from the wafer, all the substrates are i7's until the fuses get blown. When you buy an i3, all the circuitry for the i7 is there, you just can't access it. If the designs were broken down into three different wafers, the cost of manufacturing would not be any different among the three to any large degree. Actually, it would be higher as mask design and tooling costs would rise. Profit for the i7 is, of course, much higher than the i5, i3 since there is no difference in manufacturing costs.

BTW, when I say "we", I retired from Intel less than a year ago so officially, its now "they".

Should I ask seller for greater discount if the manufacturing costs of all three processors are equal? :laughing:
Unfortunately all I can clearly understand is what are they made for: Intel Processor Comparison
But thanks, Dennis, for patience to train me :drink: .

 

[Western]

You could build your own, if you decide what you want and need and post it on Hard forums I referenced before. Those guys will have you ready to go in a day or two. You will get much more PC for the $$ and it isn't hard at all, picking the components that "play well together" is the tricky part and those guys will set you up great. I will never buy a "store brand" again after building my 1st one. After you get the parts, it takes about a day or two

 

[ArtMech]

Just to give you even more to think about... :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Later,
Dan

Seems like I made a drama out of attempt to obtain nothing else but a ... desktop. :comedy: :laughing:

 

[ArtMech]

You could build your own, if you decide what you want and need and post it on Hard forums I referenced before. Those guys will have you ready to go in a day or two. You will get much more PC for the $$ and it isn't hard at all, picking the components that "play well together" is the tricky part and those guys will set you up great. I will never buy a "store brand" again after building my 1st one. After you get the parts, it takes about a day or two

:confused2::confused2::confused2:
How much time will you give me to decide?

 

[Western]

:confused2::confused2::confused2:
How much time will you give me to decide?

:laughing: right!, I searched/ researched for over a month, partly because I wasn't sure if I could put a pc together from scratch! No way would I have tried it without the help from HardForums, it was so easy, I cant believe more people dont do it. The beauty of it is you only have on it what you put there, no bloatware. You get a 1000% better PC for your money IMO.

 

[dmccarty]

How long did you wait Dan?? a week!!:laughing: Technology changes so fast. I built my pc on a SandyBridge board, then 3 months later Iveybridge shows up....go figure.

I waited something like 2-3 years! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

The laptop I am thinking of buying has had discounts of 15-28%. A few days ago the discount was 25% but today it is 15%. It will be interesting if the discount goes up in the middle of the week...

I REALLY hate spending money.

Later,
Dan

 

[dmccarty]

Seems like I made a drama out of attempt to obtain nothing else but a ... desktop. :comedy: :laughing:

Well....

I have a multiple page spreadsheet that tracks system prices and component prices for a desktop, laptop, HTPC case and a NAS device. I think I have an entire Broadway Production out of buying a PC! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Later,
Dan

 

[ArtMech]

I REALLY hate spending money.

Later,
Dan

W H O S E ??? :fiery:
Yeah, yeah remind please! :yes:

 

[dmccarty]

W H O S E ??? :fiery:
Yeah, yeah remind please! :yes:

Yeppers, you are right! I like spending YOUR money but no mine! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Buying a new system right now is problematic because my old system, while old, works just fine. Its only limitation is the huge photo files I am processing.

I look at the cost of a new PC and think of the mulch and gravel we could buy with less money. Or new tables for the study. :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Then there is the temporary well house that I built in 2004 that looks like he...ll.

Or the root cellar I want to build.

I have also noticed that with PC's, I am willing to spend a certain amount of money, but take the same amount of money for a tractor attachment, say a hydraulic post hole digger, it would be way too much money! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Later,
Dan

 

[ArtMech]

Yeppers, you are right! I like spending YOUR money but no mine! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Buying a new system right now is problematic because my old system, while old, works just fine. Its only limitation is the huge photo files I am processing.

I look at the cost of a new PC and think of the mulch and gravel we could buy with less money. Or new tables for the study. :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Then there is the temporary well house that I built in 2004 that looks like he...ll.

Or the root cellar I want to build.

I have also noticed that with PC's, I am willing to spend a certain amount of money, but take the same amount of money for a tractor attachment, say a hydraulic post hole digger, it would be way too much money! :laughing::laughing::laughing:

Later,
Dan

Same here. Lots of investment scheduled: new barn building, tractor attachments to be obtained, house decoration and many more other things unrelated to the computer to do. I was postponing new desktop obtaining as far as I could. But I can't wait anymore.
You're probably going to buy the Danuser auger drive. Similar to what I'll need in the nearest future. But I'm not going to obtain any tractor auger. I'll better hire it just to make the holes.
Seems we're in the suchlike situations. :drink:

 

[ArtMech]

There are three recent proposals I've got from the net shops. :confused2:

Two of them are from the net shop - onnet.lt. I'll mark them 4 and 5 so not to muddle them up with previous three versions.
4. Dell Vostro 470, 3 yrs Warranty, +keyboard, +mouse, W7 Pro, $1138 (data pic attached)
5. Locally Built, 2 yrs Warranty, $1250 (data pic attached)

And one more (6th) Locally Built from 1a.lt net shop:
6.1A_ELITE i7 (Ivy Bridge) Advanced GTX, 2 yrs Warranty, $832
Processor Intel® Core™ i7 (Ivy Bridge) series:
Intel® Core™ i7-3770 Processor (8M Cache, 3.4 GHz)
Max Turbo Frequency - 3.9 GHz
Intel® Hyper-Threading Technology
Intel® Virtualization Technology (VT-x)
Intel® Virtualization Technology for Directed I/O (VT-d)
Intel® Trusted Execution Technology
AES New Instructions
Intel® vPro Technology
Motherboard:
GIGA-BYTE H77 s1155
Memory:
Kingston HyperX 8 GB DDR3 1600 MHz
Hard disc:
500 GB
Optical storage:
DVD-/+RW
Graphics:
GeForce GTX 650 1 GB 128 bit GDDR5
NVIDIA PureVideo® Technology
NVIDIA PhysX™ Technology
NVIDIA CUDA™ Technology
Microsoft DirectX 11
OpenGL 4.1
Video card memory:
1 GB GDDR5
Power:
PSU - 600 W Chieftec
Ports:
PS/2 / USB / D-Sub / RJ-45 / DVI-D / Audio jacks (Line In/Line Out/Microphone)

I'm sorry to disturb you guys again, but just in case if someone would name the best one of all these 6 versions saying "If it was me I would pull a trigger on this one". My question is: which one? :anyone:

View attachment Desktop Dell Vostro.pdf View attachment Desktop Locally built.pdf

 

[rekees4300]

Sometimes it's hard to see the forest because of the trees...analysis paralysis. If it was me I'd pull the trigger on the Dell. I've had several Dell PC's over the years and never had any major problems with any of them.

 

[troutsqueezer]

For the money, I would go with the last one you listed (Elite) and since the price is so low you can probably upgrade with the following changes and still keep it around $1k.

Swap the DVD burner for Blu-Ray burner. Fry's sells them for $57 now so you know the prices are coming down.

Up the hard drive to 1 or 2 TB.

The GE Force GTX 650 is an OK video card (it does have HDMI out which is very handy in this day and age and easier to hook up) and the 600W power supply is good to have in case you want to upgrade the video card even more or add more drives.

Make sure the USB has version 3.0 capability.

Hyper Threading technology will likely never get used unless you use intensive video encryption programs.

 

[Western]

I like #6 Looks to have plenty of power for what your doing.

I dont know that PSU, I would double check if I where you on the quality of that brand. PSU is often over looked for quality and a big problem area for PC troubles.
Antec, Corsair, Seasonic, Enermax make great PSU's and get one that is Gold or Silver certified, cot more, but that's the heart of your PC bad PSU can fry a PC.



If graphic are concerned there are better cards (VGA) out there if you have the budget
heres a card performance graphic to look over
http://tpucdn.com/reviews/EVGA/GTX_650_Ti_SSC/images/perfrel.gif

Just my 2 cents,

I Still think you would do good to post the same query on Hardforums and let the worldwide community help you, then take the specs they recommend to your builder and get a quote.

Or buy me an airline ticket to the EU and I'll get on hardforums for you:laughing::laughing: