Compact tractoring on the cheap!?

[s1120]

<font color="red">The 8N is a GREAT starter tractor. It's inexpensive to purchase, works great with a brush hog, is very inexpensive to maintain and a very simple machine to fix. </font>

That's one of the reason I got one. Also, how can you realy appreachate all the advances in the new tractors, without using the old ones? Plus I would think you could learn some tricks that would carry over well, to a "newer" tractor.

 

[rockyridgefarm]

I owned a Yanmar before trading for my John Deere. The Yanmar is a wonderful tractor. But I was tired of parts sources drying up, and having to do all the work myself. I loved doing it, but odds were that something beyond my desire/ability was coming.

When I shopped for a replacement I quickly discovered that in CUTs; new was hardly any more than used, sometimes cheaper.

My Deere turned out to be cheaper than Kubota, New Holland, Massey and even Long. It really wasn't much higher than a NortracJinma.

And having owned a Yanmar, I can see a whole lot of differance in the 4x10s and a Yanmar.

When buying any major purchase, total cost of ownership is very important. How much does it cost to buy, get home, keep running, and how much will it sell for. My Yanmar wasn't a whole lot cheaper than my Deere in those terms.

 

[fishman]

This thread has gotten a little off topic. The original poster was looking to spend less than $5k. No new JD/NH/Kubota tractor will even come close. /forums/images/graemlins/crazy.gif So comparisons between them and the gray market tractors aren't all that useful.

I admittedly don't have any owner experience with the greys, but the majority that I've looked at appear to be well built and very reasonable in cost. I especially liked the Yanmars and would have looked more closely at them had they been available with hydrostat and a factory ROPS.

There are a few non-gray compact tractors made in the 70's and 80's that sell for less than $5k. The various Kubotas and Fords come to mind. I think it would be tough to find a 4wd in good shape with a loader for that price, however.

 

[DavesTractor]

It's been said fairly well already, but I will chime in anyway. The quality between Yanmar and Deere (and Iseki and Massey) is equal. But the tractors are set up differently for our different markets. Most YM Yanmars and a lot of F series Yanmars do not have power steering. They also tend to be tighter in the operators area than the USA counterparts. Some are very close crossovers, such as the YM2500, the Iseki TA series, and some others. Parts are available, but sometimes a takes a few days to run them down.

The best value out there is the 20+ year old farm tractor. They are usually heavy, powerful and cheap. But they are not compact, most are 2wd's, many do not have loaders, many are gas instead of diesel.

I've had a little experience with the Chinese tractors, and they are OK for what you pay for them, but not necessarily a bargain. You will tinker with them often, and most of the technology is old, ergonomics are not so good, etc. They are getting better, and many people are happy, so this is not meant to offend any Chinese tractor owners out there.

 

[cowboydoc]

As far as my 4600 I compared everything out there when I bought it. I actually started out to go buy a kubota when I bought the 4600. Comparing apples to apples though the 4600 was the best deal out there when I bought mine. Kubota and NH were both higher. I looked at the aftermarket tractors and I wasn't impressed.

As far as the larger tractors I don't think there's any comparison. I think JD has done an exceptional job of building a tractor for every niche. John Deere has come out with the 03 series in both a 5000 and 6000 series to compete in the lower end market. You want the cadillac's you move into the 20 series in the 5000 tractors and the 20 and 15 series in the 6000 series. No tractor company out there offers as many choices as deere does with regard to finding a tractor to fit your needs.

I'm certainly not color blind either. When I grew up we didn't have alot of deere equipment. We had alot of different equipment as we had 35,000 acres to take care of. I never thought too much about it back then. I just got into whatever I was told to and went to work. I never bought any of the equipment or really cared at that time. When I do buy something, whether it's a computer or a tractor, I'll first ask people that I know that are using the equipment in a commercial use. Next I'll gather all the information out there and I'll compare what really makes that item tick. I drive my wife nuts because I analyze price, features/$ etc. for days and figure per hp cost, hydraulics flow cost/dollar, features/dollar, etc. etc.

Right now I'm in the process of buying a bigger utility tractor. Go look and drive around a JD 5000 series and compare that with other tractors. Look at the hydraulics, hp, components, etc. Look at all the different configurations of that tractor, and then look at the # of tractors you can buy and you'll see what I mean. NH or Kubota, and especially not a grey market tractor is anywhere near JD in this area. That's not my opinion that's the facts. I'm not saying what NH and Kubtoa produce isn't a good product, it is, but they aren't any cheaper when you find a dealer to deal with and you certainly have far and above many more choices with deere.

If you're looking for a cab tractor step into one of the new cab series in the 6000 or 5000 series. It's like riding in a car. Very impressive. I had no intention of getting a cab until I drove one.

As far as not improving quality Deere is constantly improving quality. Just look at the first 5000 series and now look at a 5X20 series tractor. I don't think they're just riding on their name here.

Lastly I have just been overwhelmed by the superior customer service of deere. Whatever, whenever, I need it they have been there. They haven't let me sit in the field when I needed a part and when you go for help everything is right there on the computer. You can look and tell them the exact part that you need. I have never had to wait longer than the next morning for any part. I'm certainly not colorblind but I've gotten everything I've asked and more from my deere equipment and when I needed service.

 

[fivestring]

But, one might not need all the "different" stuff on a JD for thousands more; that was my point. The poster is looking for an affordable tractor to do small to medium jobs and might not need the "JD spec" items costing much more. I personally did not need anything other that what is on my Iseki, including live PTO. Most are still made in Japan, regardless of specs.

 

[cowboydoc]

You missed my point five string. Deere does make a stripped down tractor for thousands less. They make a model to compete in every price niche. That's what the 03 series is. You can also buy a compact the same way. Whatever you want you can order it from a bare bones tractor to a decked out farming monster.

Just for example you can buy that 5103 with 44 hp, 11.4/gallon/minute SEPARATE hydraulics, with a hitch lift capacity of over 3k, and a loader lift capacity of over 2k, power hydro steering, convertible 2 to 1 links, telesc. links, etc. for around $13k with a loader. Grey, red, white, and blue you can't find any better deal than that anywhere out there.

 

[rtimgray]

I think in making so many models and so many options available to the consumer, the price of the Deeres are driven up as well (after all, if you make all your tractors the same, you should be able to do it cheaper, right). At least in my area, Deeres are ridiculously expensive, but we only have one Deere dealer in the western end of the state (although a couple more have started making inroads) that has three locations. When shopping for a 40-50 HP tractor, the quotes I received from the Deere dealers were $6,000-$10,000 above the other tractors (NH/Kubota/Kiot/Mahindra) that I was pricing. I would guess though that pricing is greatly regionalized and that Deere must be very competitive with other brands and (as CowboyDoc says) offer something for everybody. In our area, the professional full-time farmers use some John Deeres, but there are a lot more older IH tractors than anything else, along with new Massey Fergusons. The newest tractors that our heavy-hitting farmers have been using are the Cat Challengers (and hey, JD offers competition for that too). There are also alot of the 70s and 80s Fords/NH running around - not really a dominant brand here, but there are not too many dealers (1 Deere, 2 NH, 1 Kubota, 1 MF and then the "off-brands").

Anyway, back to topic: If you need a true compact tractor for under $5,000 and can live without Hydro and power steering, ROPS and live PTO, I would say go grey market Yanmar. If the grey market scares you and you can live with a slightly larger frame tractor (like a Ford 2000, MF 135, etc), go old American Iron, although many of these may not have power steering, hydro, or ROPS, depending on model. If you want new and want to take a (small) chance, go Chinese.

Good Luck

Take it Easy

Tim Gray

 

[JohnS]

Dave,

Not offended in the least /forums/images/graemlins/wink.gif 5K including implements won't buy much of a chinese Jinma tractor, either. It will get you in a Homier 2WD, but it is probably lacking allot for down the road. Might come close on a JM204 purchase, with no implements.

 

[fivestring]

"I would like the board's opinion on the following options for those looking to get dirty for small dough $$$ For example, the guy or gal looking for a tractor with an implement or 2 for less than $5,000. We all recognize this means compromises, but which is best?"
This was the original question; thanks for the reminder, rtimgray.
$5000 will not buy much JD, NH, or Kubota with an implement or two. That is the complete reason why I and many, many others choose to buy Isekis, Yanmars, Mitsubishi, Hinomoto, Shibaura, etc. These tractors do the job for less $$$$. If the poster needs a larger older tractor, by all means the Fords, Olivers, etc. are a viable option. I was also advising the poster that if maneuverability was an issue, the older American tractors might be at a disadvantage, they are larger and weigh more.
Great answers from everyone and I hope all of this information is not too confusing for him to make a decision.