Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?!

   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #71  
If I remember (hah!) I'll try to snap a photo at my filing station. The trouble here is we think of "cutting" like with a knife. That's fine, as most of our chainsaw cutting is with the bottom of the bar guide - just like using the knife with the cutting edge on the bottom of the blade.

But - with the chainsaw chain - I sharpen on the TOP of the bar guide in the vice. This means you sharpen the opposite way because the chain on top of the bar is traveling AWAY from you, not toward you as on the bottom of the guide.

The easiest thing to do is visualize cutting upward into a tree branch - which way is the wood traveling relative to the chain? TOWARD the chain, right? Then this is also the dirction needed to sharpen with the file also - when sharpening on TOP of the bar.

With any knife - you sharpen from the sharp edge toward the blade - not from the blade toward the sharp edge.

Does this help?
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #72  
If I remember (hah!) I'll try to snap a photo at my filing station. The trouble here is we think of "cutting" like with a knife. That's fine, as most of our chainsaw cutting is with the bottom of the bar guide - just like using the knife with the cutting edge on the bottom of the blade.

But - with the chainsaw chain - I sharpen on the TOP of the bar guide in the vice. This means you sharpen the opposite way because the chain on top of the bar is traveling AWAY from you, not toward you as on the bottom of the guide.

The easiest thing to do is visualize cutting upward into a tree branch - which way is the wood traveling relative to the chain? TOWARD the chain, right? Then this is also the dirction needed to sharpen with the file also - when sharpening on TOP of the bar.

With any knife - you sharpen from the sharp edge toward the blade - not from the blade toward the sharp edge.

Does this help?

So I'm doing it backwards?? I'll hafta try it the other way. I've never seen that done. But if it improves sharpness, I'm all about it
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #73  
Please clarify this for me. When I'm sharpening I am looking at the discharge side of the tooth I'm working on. I push the file away from me or "out" the face of the tooth, opposite direction of the wood chips that are cut. Am I doing that backwards???

I understand you to say when you are sharpening you are looking at the intake side of the tooth that you are working on. You can't see the filed edge?? Then you push the file past the tooth just like the wood chip would flow??

I've never done it that way.

CM, how do you do this??

Here's a picture (pictures worth a thousand words). I push away from me .



If I remember (hah!) I'll try to snap a photo at my filing station. The trouble here is we think of "cutting" like with a knife. That's fine, as most of our chainsaw cutting is with the bottom of the bar guide - just like using the knife with the cutting edge on the bottom of the blade.

But - with the chainsaw chain - I sharpen on the TOP of the bar guide in the vice. This means you sharpen the opposite way because the chain on top of the bar is traveling AWAY from you, not toward you as on the bottom of the guide.

The easiest thing to do is visualize cutting upward into a tree branch - which way is the wood traveling relative to the chain? TOWARD the chain, right? Then this is also the dirction needed to sharpen with the file also - when sharpening on TOP of the bar.

With any knife - you sharpen from the sharp edge toward the blade - not from the blade toward the sharp edge.

Does this help?

So in the picture you should be pulling the file.
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #74  
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #75  
Yes - I recall 25 years ago when I started hand-filing learning from an old guy - a professional forester. "Pushing" the file against the direction the wood comes through the saw barely sharpens the edges.

Take a kitchen knife out - now take a file & file the edge from the handle down the edge. How sharp does it get? Not very, right? If you use a hand gauge as in the photo above, you don't have much choice because you need to "push" to control it.

I will try to take a photo tonight. Second, if you leave chain on bar, all the filings can get into the bar groove = faster wear. I use an off-saw worn out bar clamped in a vice as a sharpening fixture.
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?!
  • Thread Starter
#76  
Please clarify this for me. When I'm sharpening I am looking at the discharge side of the tooth I'm working on. I push the file away from me or "out" the face of the tooth, opposite direction of the wood chips that are cut. Am I doing that backwards???

I understand you to say when you are sharpening you are looking at the intake side of the tooth that you are working on. You can't see the filed edge?? Then you push the file past the tooth just like the wood chip would flow??

I've never done it that way.

CM, how do you do this??

Here's a picture (pictures worth a thousand words). I push away from me .



As you are standing your saw body is to your left, in your pic, and the tooth your holding your file guide on, push away from your body, through the tooth, from the center of the bar to the outside edge of the tooth/POINTY end, which hangs furthest from the center. Only forward away from the square back of each tooth toward the tip of the tooth, parallel to the floor, and with the same pressure on the groove of each tooth and at the angle cut into the tooth by the manufacturer, if present.

In other words, think of how each tooth grabs the wood. If you stand over the bar and look down on the chain, if each tooth alternated from left to right side of the bar and didn't overhang no cutting would be accomplished. The cut starts at the pointed edge overhanging the bar and the wood is drawn from that edge to the center of the bar and then cleans itself of the chips as the chain draws them around the bar to the bottom of the chain/saw body entry where things fly out. The chain runs forward pushing the teeth into the wood. That is why a good sharp chain, with a straight, no pinched bar, with clean oil passages and groove in the bar, will pull the saw into the wood and you toward the log, in a crosscut, for example. There is less to no effort for the cut to happen the torque and chain teeth do the cutting, NOT the operator pushing on a dull, poorly maintained saw. When a dull chain or any of the other items just mentioned are not fully functional the saw bar/chain can bind. It can also bind or pinch when sharp, but there is less chance/frequency to this happening. Pinching occurs due to not knowing whether to top or undercut a log, tree, branch, etc., and gravity moves the wood and the sawcut closes on the chain/bar and renders it immovable without releasing the pressure by moving the wood in the opposite direction. This happens to less experienced sawyers regularly. The thing to do is not fight the pinch by trying to wrestle the saw out of the pinch. It can often take having another saw handy to free the stuck saw. Fighting the pinch can damage/pinch the bar and in extremes bend it beyond fixable. In situations where kickback occurs the saw chain and bar tip are often trying or are pushing the saw up and away from the log/tree, (if the bar tip gets under the log), without the saw operator controlling that situation the saw bar/chain can fly up at tremendous speed and hit the sawyer or other objects/people in the nearby vicinity. Many sawyers are injured/killed because of uncontrolled kickback. This is why all saws come standard with chain brakes, low kickback chain, etc.
Proper stance, and clear escape paths when felling trees is essential to staying alive.
Hope I've answered your question in an understandable way?
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?!
  • Thread Starter
#77  
Ovrszd, take a look at this entire video from Stihl, once they get into the actual filing it's got lots of useful tips and techniques....

How to Sharpen Your STIHL Chainsaw Chain - YouTube

NOTE: at 6min/15 seconds into the video it shows and states ALWAYS file from the inside OUT, and again at 6min/38seconds.
Inside out means from the inside, (center of the bar), to the outside of the tooth's extended edge beyond the confines of the actual chain and bar.

Filing the opposite way is INcorrect, period.


Oh, I've forgotten to mention the importance of adjusting the depth gauges as well as the teeth. This video also shows exactly how to do this correctly. If not done, or done incorrectly everything else being done right won't matter much because the chain still won't cut properly....

CM
 
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   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #78  
Seems they sharpen from back to front like Ovrszd
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #79  
When I started filing, I would file "into" the teeth, meaning from the outer edge to the center. Watching a few online videos, including the Stihl one, made me second guess myself, as they show to file from the center to the outside. All other things that I have sharpened in my life contradict this, (knives, mower blades, drill bits, etc...) so I really don't know which is best. This is an interesting conversation.
 
   / Chainsaw sharpening, hand or grind?! #80  
I file. But use a granberg jig. For me, a filed chain cuts faster than a factor stihl edge. Proved that before.

As to the direction to file, and being bass-ackwards from everything else, has to do with the design of the teeth.

They arent just a hard piece of steel. They are chrome plated. Chrome hard. by filing inside to out (or back to front) you are actually removing the softer material of the tooth, and allowing the chrome to chip/break off.

By filing the other way, it dulls the file quicker, and results in a slightly less sharp edge. Not really noticeable in the cut, but certainly noticeable in how fast you go through files.
 

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