Comparison BX vs GC vs SC vs Max

[pbeamtn]

This thread may not be novel as countless others have gone through the pains of selecting the "perfect" tractor. For weeks now, I have been scouring Craigslist in the southeast, and visited/emailed several dealers. I'm shopping for "cash price" since there is no such thing as free financing, and I feel the best way to see all the costs involved is to shop for the best cash price.

I started with the Kubota BX series, and I really liked what I saw. I could find a number of used BX's, but the price was too close to that of a new one or was not equipped the way I wanted. I drove almost 2 hours to look at a Mahindra Max 25, and I really liked it. It is probably my favorite, but the best price I got was $14,800 + tax, which pushes it closer to $16K. I went to another dealer to compare the Max with the MF GC2400, but this dealer refused to sell a Max with a MMM because of some problems they have had in the past with MMMs from Mahindra -- something I have heard nowhere else. The price on the GC2400 was $13,900 + 9.25% tax. This was not enough to put the GC2400 ahead of the Max in my mind.

So, I called a closer Kubota/Massey dealer, and received a price of $13,300 for the GC2400, and he had a few used ones. So I visited. None of the used ones had MMM's, and pricing was going to be in the $11K - $13K range for a used tractor with no warranty. So, we started to get serious about pricing a new GC2400 and see really how it compares. For reasons I cannot explain, I was quoted $11,700 for a new GC2400 + 60" MMM + FEL including delivery + 7% tax. Suddenly, used tractors became much less attracting, and even though I like the Max 25 better, I don't think it is $3,000 better. Then, to enter the dream arena, the GC2410 TLB was quoted at $17,200 with 60" MMM.

I visited 2 Cub Cadat/Yanmar dealers, and received wildly different prices. One gave me a price of $14,700 ($15,800 with tax), and the other gave me a price of $12,500 -- he might even have some more he could go. It is a fine machine, and I like the position control, but I really like the GC2400 a little better and the dealer seems better.

For grins, I decided to check out JD when I was getting some parts for my old 316. He had a 2007 2305 with 200 hours on it for $11,800. A new 1026R prices out ~ $17,900 with tax, and I just don't see enough difference to give it serious consideration. I was very interested in the 2305 until I found a new GC2400 for essentially the same price -- new is better, right?

So now this is all coming to a head. From the reviews I have read, all of these are good machines and owners have been happy with them. All would be more than I probably "need" for my 3 acres, but I expect this machine to last me 20 years. In the past 8 hours, I have both been certain the thing to do is get the GC2400, and certain the thing to do is splurge on the 2410 since any hole I dig in the future will cause me to resent the fact that I did not go ahead and get a machine that would make digging more enjoyable. I wish I had a business or a large farm that would justify the added expense, but I just want to occasionally dig out stumps and clear out the trash left my generations past who thought the woods were a good place to dump their waste. Does that really justify $5,900?

Not sure there is much to ask here. My story is probably not that atypical. The MF dealer told me it usually takes 6 visits to buy I tractor -- I'm only on 3! I hope to report ownership soon. These incentives are only good until July 31, but it seems to me likely they will be in August as well. One piece of wisdom, perhaps, to others who are shopping: make sure your dealer checks all the latest incentives, which appear to come out at the beginning of each month. The worst prices I received were from dealers that just look the prices up in a book and write them down. The best price came from the dealer who got on the computer and checked every current deal. YMMV.

 

[murphy1244]

Does that really justify $5,900? Oh yea it does. Trust me, get the BH or you will be kickin your butt a year from now.

 

[pbeamtn]

I would like to hear more stories like that. Over the course of the years of service I expect to get from this machine, it is not a lot. Renting is probably more responsible. Emotionally, I want it, but my practical side is having some trouble with it. I really wish the GC were made so that you could add the factory BH later. You can add the Woods, but the seat will not be as nice, the ROPS is smaller, and the frame would not have as much reinforcement.

If everyone who bought one writes and says how wonderful it is, and everyone who did not writes and says they wish they had, then maybe I can finally reach a decision.

 

[radioman]

I wish the kubota BX's were ALL made same way too with subframe as well for BH, but for that reason alone is why I got the BX24 and I love it on my 2 acres. BH is easy off and I love fact I can dig holes with BH anytime with no time restrictions like a rental does and its easy to put back on. With BXpanded accessories and others available for BX, I can easily add on more goodies anytime. who cares if the BH sits for awhile - when you do need it, its worth it.

 

[uglyboywith11fingers]

who cares if the BH sits for awhile - when you do need it, its worth it.

I agree !:thumbsup:
I was looking at renting a small excavator for a few weeks over this summer, to do some drainage ditches, etc. at $800 a week.
Instead, last Sept. I bought a used (235Hrs) BX24 with MMM, rear snow blower & back blade for $16000. My line of credit currently charges 6%, so my annual cost of having this thing available 24/7 is under $1000. This is a no-brainer. What do you do with your weekly rental when it rains for 2 days?
And the way these machines hold their value when properly cared for, I can probably sell the package in 5 years for $13000.

You will never regret getting a 'useful' machine.

Pete

 

[uglyboywith11fingers]

who cares if the BH sits for awhile - when you do need it, its worth it.

I agree !:thumbsup:
I was looking at renting a small excavator for a few weeks over this summer, to do some drainage ditches, etc. at $800 a week.
Instead, last Sept. I bought a used (235Hrs) BX24 with MMM, rear snow blower & back blade for $16000. My line of credit currently charges 6%, so my annual cost of having this thing available 24/7 is under $1000. This is a no-brainer. What do you do with your weekly rental when it rains for 2 days?
And the way these machines hold their value when properly cared for, I can probably sell the package in 5 years for $13000.

You will never regret getting a 'useful' machine.

Pete

 

[swick1]

I got a 1026r with hoe and it never comes off. These small tractors need the ballast and it's worth 5k when you get unstuck with it and use it to tear out bushes.

 

[radioman]

I agree !:thumbsup:
I was looking at renting a small excavator for a few weeks over this summer, to do some drainage ditches, etc. at $800 a week.
Instead, last Sept. I bought a used (235Hrs) BX24 with MMM, rear snow blower & back blade for $16000. My line of credit currently charges 6%, so my annual cost of having this thing available 24/7 is under $1000. This is a no-brainer. What do you do with your weekly rental when it rains for 2 days?
And the way these machines hold their value when properly cared for, I can probably sell the package in 5 years for $13000.

You will never regret getting a 'useful' machine.

Pete

thats exactly what I was thinking too. so far I used my backhoe for digging out 7 big stumps, fixing sewer line, fixing mailbox post twice, moved a few trees, fixed above ground pool as a ram to push a wall/post straight back up that still had water in it, dug holes for posts for my add on garage ... I could keep going on and on with what I done with BH so far. So far it really proved itself in terms of cost and no rental hassles.

 

[jim_wilson]

If you plan on keeping the tractor for 20 years - there may be multiple times over those twenty years when you find the need for a backhoe.

Here are some "justifications" you might think about when deciding whether or not to spend that extra $5900:

1) How many times over 20 years do you think you might have the need for a backhoe? Around here (Eastern MA/Southern NH) - anything with a backhoe on it (Terramite, small excavator, etc.) is going to rent for somewhere between $180 to $250 a day. Extrapolate out over 20 years how many times you might rent - and come up with a $$ number. Right there is money you would have spent anyway, apply that towards the cost of the backhoe.

2) Things will only cost more in the future. $5900 now will cost a lot more 20 years from now. The rentals you might paid for 10 years down the road - that might cost $180 a day now - will cost $300 10 years from now.

3) Never pick up a shovel again. The backhoes on any of the sub-compact tractors ( I used to have a BX23 now I have a B3200) - are so convenient to use that even if you might have just a small hole to dig to put in a tree - the backhoe is worth pulling out instead of the spade. Think of every time you might have had to take out a shovel to do even the most minor work - and now you can do it with the backhoe.

4) Unforseen jobs. Once you have the backhoe you will "find" all sorts of jobs to do with it that you might have (maybe even subconciously) - not even thought of doing before. I dug down the whole back foundation of my house (down to the footer) with my BX23 - and waterproofed the concrete and put in footer drains. It took me a couple of weeks from start to finish - and it all started because we were getting some water coming in thru cracks in the foundation. If I didn't have the backhoe sitting there - I would have likely either not even considered doing the job - or I would have had to rent (probably a good 3-4 days of rental once it was all said and done) - or paid somebody to do it. Both of the latter options would have easily doubled or even quadrupled the cost of the job.

5) Like radioman said: Hassle elimination. Just having it there means you have instant pull the key and insert to start access to getting a job done. Instead of waking up early - reserving a rental, or dealing with contractors - you just insert key and start to get working. Nothing in life is free (unless you work for the govt.) - and hassle reduction is worth some sort of $$ amount.

 

[pbeamtn]

Wow! So far everyone is anxious for me to spend more of my own money!

I'm going to procrastinate the decision for a couple of weeks to make sure I don't screw up my anniversary, and to make a bit more progress on the "honey do" list before getting distracted by something new. Pricing is good at least until the end of the month, and I really need to go back and operate the BH a little -- I have only only operated the tractor and the loader. I'm sure I can come up with a list of jobs that will keep me occupied for a while, and right now, I am inclined to spend the extra and do it.

 

[catskinner]

When you look at used prices, they are not like a car or truck, you might make money on the TLB later down the road. Thats why I'm only going new when I pop for my next tractor. Like they all say, if you have it, you'll find a use for it.

 

[CHDinCT]

Let's see, $5,900 amortized over 20 years is $295 per year. But that assumes it has $0 residual value which it won't. More than likely, with inflation, you'd recoup 50% of the backhoe cost after 20 years whether you sold the tractor or traded it in. So, that brings your annual cost of ownership (excluding maintenance) to less than $150. That's less than the cost of renting a machine for one day a year. So, it basically pays to own your own backhoe.

 

[pbeamtn]

The plot thickens....
I received an email from Mahindra USA, so I responded by saying I liked the Max it it was priced much higher than competing models from Cub/Yanmar and Massey Ferguson. At lunch, I received a call from Mahindra's VP of Sales, and by the time I returned from lunch, I had a much more attractive quote from a dealer! I never expected this kind of attention!

I liked the Max better, and I believe it has the option to add an OEM BH later. I have been somewhat distressed by feeling forced into a BH now or never have one. Of course, if I don't buy it now, what is the likelihood I would buy it later...

 

[pbeamtn]

The plot thickens....
I received an email from Mahindra USA, so I responded by saying I liked the Max it it was priced much higher than competing models from Cub/Yanmar and Massey Ferguson. At lunch, I received a call from Mahindra's VP of Sales, and by the time I returned from lunch, I had a much more attractive quote from a dealer! I never expected this kind of attention!

I liked the Max better, and I believe it has the option to add an OEM BH later. I have been somewhat distressed by feeling forced into a BH now or never have one. Of course, if I don't buy it now, what is the likelihood I would buy it later...

 

[jim_wilson]

The plot thickens....
I received an email from Mahindra USA, so I responded by saying I liked the Max it it was priced much higher than competing models from Cub/Yanmar and Massey Ferguson. At lunch, I received a call from Mahindra's VP of Sales, and by the time I returned from lunch, I had a much more attractive quote from a dealer! I never expected this kind of attention!

I liked the Max better, and I believe it has the option to add an OEM BH later. I have been somewhat distressed by feeling forced into a BH now or never have one. Of course, if I don't buy it now, what is the likelihood I would buy it later...

I'm not sure how Mahindra sets up their sub-compact tractors to accept a backhoe - but if it was me, I would ask about whether or not you can add a backhoe to the Mahindra later. You probably have at least two options: Mahindra backhoe, or possibly Woods has a setup that will fit on the Mahindra.

The reason why I say this is: When Kubota sells their BX tractors with a backhoe - it's a specific model, there is no option to add the backhoe later (from Kubota). To add a backhoe later - you would need to go with a Woods backhoe. I'm pretty sure the Massey-Ferguson is the same way on the GC. If you want a sub-compact from Massey with a backhoe on it -you need to buy the model that includes the backoe. You can't get a backhoe from Massey later to add onto the GC. You would have to go with Woods to add one later.

 

[pbeamtn]

That is correct, hence my quandary with MF. The Mahindra loader has the subframe for the BH, so you can add later. Unfortunately, I misread the Mahindra quote -- the FEL was not included. Still, pretty cool to have a Mahindra VP call and make a pitch. I could buy the Max 22 for $15,900 and add a $6K BH later, buy a GC2400 for $12,600 and possibly add a Woods BH later, or buy a GC2410 for $18,484 and have everything. (Prices inclusive of sales tax.) Max - GC2400 = 1/2 BH

 

[kootch88]

That is correct, hence my quandary with MF. The Mahindra loader has the subframe for the BH, so you can add later. Unfortunately, I misread the Mahindra quote -- the FEL was not included. Still, pretty cool to have a Mahindra VP call and make a pitch. I could buy the Max 22 for $15,900 and add a $6K BH later, buy a GC2400 for $12,600 and possibly add a Woods BH later, or buy a GC2410 for $18,484 and have everything. (Prices inclusive of sales tax.) Max - GC2400 = 1/2 BH

I have the Max 22, which is the same other than the HP, and I was told no problem on adding it later as it is frame mounted. I won't ever be adding one, but was curious sine I like to research all options.

 

[madmax12]

That is correct, hence my quandary with MF. The Mahindra loader has the subframe for the BH, so you can add later. Unfortunately, I misread the Mahindra quote -- the FEL was not included. Still, pretty cool to have a Mahindra VP call and make a pitch. I could buy the Max 22 for $15,900 and add a $6K BH later, buy a GC2400 for $12,600 and possibly add a Woods BH later, or buy a GC2410 for $18,484 and have everything. (Prices inclusive of sales tax.) Max - GC2400 = 1/2 BH

I went with Max28XL for capability for the size . It was not my cheapest option. But it was the strongest and widest stance (safer against tipping?). Also, I was told the BH was same price to add later, from dealer I bought it from. No pressure, no time limit. Other companies did not have same flexibility/price for later went up. I went with the Max28XL instead of the 22/25 for the capability leap... 1400 lift vs 900 lift... and for comfort of tilt steering, foot/leg room, and joystick mount/position.

 

[Carl_NH]

Get the BH now - whether its the Max or Massey you wont find cheaper $$ in the coming years - interest rates are at all time lows. When you look at the package its "todays" prices, guess what when you want to add the BH it's another trip to the dealer and a new sale - get what you want NOW - not later.

I started with a Mitsubishi 15HP 3 Cyl, with FEL for $6K sold that for what I paid and bought a used Kubota L175 TLB (3 PT BH) for $5K completely refurbished it and sold it for $10K bought the B21 new and I will never NOT have a BH again for reasons the others mentioned.

Get what you want now - you will get the best price, setup and warranty for the entire package - if you want to try to add it later it will cost more.

As my wife said - get what you want but its the last one in a long time - so bite the bullet and get what you want - the BH is a no brainer so go for it.. you will not regret it.

Carl

 

[pbeamtn]

Filled out the paperwork on a GC2410 this morning with 60" MMM! Had really, really wanted to find a good, used TLB for less, but they seem rare, cost almost as much as new, and don't stay for sale long. This actually convinced me to go ahead with a new BH, since they appear to maintain their value well. In 4-5 years, if I get all my projects done, I can probably sell it for most of what I paid, which really makes the buy vs rent comparison a lot less clear.

Pictures when the unit shows up later this week.