Big announcement from GM !!!!!!

[Builder]

I thought the early dodge diesel was in a mini pick-up, not a full size 1/2 tonner.

International also built a Scout "Terra" SUV with a Nissan 4cyl diesel back in the late 70's.

 

[workinallthetime]

Workinallthetime:
I did not mean to slight the techs in any way. I see it as a management issue. I would NOT want to keep up w/ all the tech bulletins on every car GM made; I can barely keep up w/ what I need to keep my vehicles running.
But... for the longest time my local dealer did NOT have a diesel mechanic. and the owner (I guess it was his decision) would not get one trained. So nothing against the techs. It seemed to be a "corporate culture" thing. I grew up working on diesels (OTR trucks, farm equip) so yeah, I think they are (or at least were) simpler. I don't blame the techs, I blame the dealers for with holding the training and the company for not having it together on the parts/warranty end.

i didnt mean to go off on a rant, i had just read another post where a guy was telling everyone that the d-max was junk and was mad as heck that a tech had replaced all 8 injectors, 8 fuel lines, and his high pressure pump. The tech made money, the customer got an above average repair, and the life of the fuel pump just started over. The pumps last anywhere from 120 to 250k miles which is pretty good considering its making 23,000 psi with fuel as the lube. Everyone gets bad service from time to time its just a shame that 1 or 2 bad dealers run customers off for life.
On another note i would like everyone to take something into consideration the next time they buy any new car or truck, buy it from a local dealer not one of these giant nation wide places. I say this from personal and professional experiences.
#1 at the end of the sale you are probably paying more for the same thing
#2 service will cost you more
#3 your a number not a person
#4 the sales staff is usually new and untrained
#5 your not supporting your local economy
#6 when you finace with them they are going to find the best deal for them not you.

I was a tech for 12 years and there are huge differences in working for a corperate dealer and the local guy at every level. I worked for a local then went to a corp, the corp payed me way more than the local but the customers service was horrible. in 6 years of working for them i bought 5 new cars or trucks from another dealer because i got a better deal.

im ranting again sorry guys

 

[Mike5252]

That is great news, but the article states the engine will be available in trucks mfg AFTER 2009. I guess that means the 2010 model year?

That's going to be a long wait......

 

[dgl24087]

I remember those, a neighbor who worked for the DOT had one. 243 cid 6cyl. in a full size truck. Not much power, but cheap to operate. They were offered in the 1978 model year. Very few were built, it's hard to find any info on these trucks. Ok, corrected this with most accurate info i can find. The D50 had a 2.3L 4 cyl. diesel for a few years, but the fullsize trucks did offer a 6 cyl., low powered, poor seller.

Further research shows the 6 cyl. diesel to have had a whopping 100 HP. Here's one on eBay. eBay Motors: Dodge : Other Pickups (item 300122239007 end time Jun-24-07 11:31:06 PDT)

 

[Builder]

WOW! Great research! I guess the mitsu diesel did come in a full size 1/2 ton!

 

[dgl24087]

I picked up the August 07 issue of Diesel World Magazine this afternoon, it contains info on future diesels. The Cadillac CTS is slated for a 2.9L V6 diesel in 2009, 250 HP/406 lb-ft torque rating. Ford's new small diesel is rumored to be 4.4L (also read 4.5L), and is slated for the F150 and Expedition. Cummins, for the Dodge drivers, is slated to introduce a 4.2L V6 with 270 HP/420 lb-ft torque for the Dakota and Durango, possibly the Ram 1500 as well. Also coming will be a 5.7L V8 diesel with 325 HP/ 500 lb-ft torque. These new Cummins offerings likely will be offered in the Chrysler/Jeep/Dodge family of SUV's. Toyota is rumored to have a HD pickup powered by a Hino diesel engine by 2010, but this magazine sees that as being unlikely to be produced. Subaru has also developed a flat 4 diesel for the European market. Nissan is also rumored to have looked at HD diesel pickups, but have no current product plans in place to produce the truck, not feeling they can compete in the HD market.

 

[JESSE1]

I ordered an '82 GMC 2500 with the 6.2 diesel in August '81 and received it in October '81. First 6.2 the dealership had sold at the time. Within 3 months it had blown 2 headgaskets. Traded it in for a 3500 Dually w/6.2 in March '82. It blew 2 headgaskets and cracked a head before it was 2 years old. I believe it had 130 horsepower and about 250 lb/ft of torque. These engines did pretty good with the 4.10 rear axle and the 3 sp 400 auto trans. Got very good mileage. Found out later that the early engine's heads were not machined flat and allowed the headgasket to blow out.
I also bought a new '83 GMC Jimmy with the 6.2 diesel and 4 sp auto overdrive trans. No problem with the engine but the trans blew up at 51,000 miles. Got extremely good mileage for a 4x4, usually over 20 mpg.

 

[mjncad]

GM has been in the diesel engine business for a long time. I never understood why they didn't put a Detroit Diesel in their pickups a long time ago. If you build it they will come.

Detroit Diesel - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

I thought GM gave up their Detroit Diesel business to Chrysler some time ago. The last time I checked the DD web site, I didn't see a "Double Breasted Yamaha" anywhere in sight.

 

[Joe1]

If I remember correctly, way back around 1960 or 1961, you could order a 4 cylinder diesel in a 1/2 ton GM pickup. The option was very short lived. I believe that a 4 cyl diesel (possibly a Perkins) was an option for a short time in the Internation Harverster Scout. Neither option was popular and they were off the market in a very short time.

I would like to see the new diesels on the market for a while before I jumped into them based on past records of engine problems with both GM and the 6.0 option in the Ford. Chrysler was smart using the rock reliable Cummins (and later Mercedes in some Jeep and Van models) rather than drop a ton of cash developing their own engines.

 

[tlbuser]

a guy was telling everyone that the d-max was junk and was mad as heck that a tech had replaced all 8 injectors, 8 fuel lines, and his high pressure pump.

maybe sometimes the customer shouldn't be allowed to own what they have! If it was all covered under warranty, why was he even making an issue of it, cause he had to wait a day for them to finish ??

 

[Toiyabe]

My Ford 7.3 IDI diesel weighs about 1/2 a ton. Does that count?

 

[Z-Michigan]

Lucky. My Cummins ISB is pushing 5/8 of a ton.

 

[schmism]

cool
they should sell tons
It's the only way to fly.

so youd buy a 1/2 truck at 3/4 ton price to do the work a 3/4+ ton truck should be doing in the first place.....

As nissan about breaking D44 rear ends in there titan....

it may SOUND cool to put a diesel in it... but you just end up over working the breaks, frame everything else important.... On top of the fact you pay an inflated price for it....

Ill pass....

oh and got to do something to get the attention away from that new "jap" truck....

 

[8561]

Maybe its that some of us would prefer to have the extra horsepower and torque in our daily driver, along with the fuel economy and durability. We'd like to be able to pull our campers, snowmobiles, tractors, etc more effectively on those occassions we do that. We'd like a pickup that rides like a half ton and can do 3/4 ton type work several days a year rather than live with 3/4 ton ride all year when we don't want that. We'd like a truck with a little lower ride height that correspondingly handles and drives better, and fits in the garage easier.

If I worked my truck every day, I would already own a Max and Allie. I don't, therefore I don't own one, and I'll be looking hard at the 1/2 ton diesel when it arrives.

By the way - I take it you've seen the advance pricing on this truck, please post it for the rest of us.

 

[Toiyabe]

Why not get a car for 95% of the time when you need a car and a used 1 ton gasser for the 5% of the time you need a truck? It'll be cheaper, and you'll have the right tool for each job.

Unless you put a lot of miles on the truck, the diesel's fuel savings won't pay back its initial cost. And there's no point in putting those miles on a truck when a car will do the job.

 

[workinallthetime]

Why not get a car for 95% of the time when you need a car and a used 1 ton gasser for the 5% of the time you need a truck? It'll be cheaper, and you'll have the right tool for each job.

Unless you put a lot of miles on the truck, the diesel's fuel savings won't pay back its initial cost. And there's no point in putting those miles on a truck when a car will do the job.

a car and a truck for the price of a 1 ton? insurence on both plus repairs, doesnt sound to me like a good idea. Why not have a 1/2 ton that can do the ocasional heavy towing that got 15-22 mpg? My 07 6.0 is supose to get 15 to 19 which is prety good for a truck. A deacent new car is gonna run you 35k and a striped down 1 ton would run you 35k new, so thats 70k at least in ride payments. You could go used but even a couple year old 1 ton is still going to cost 25-30k. i guess you could go with older cars but then you get into reliabilty issues. I am looking into a 1 ton in addition to my 1/2 ton v-max next year, but thats for a dump bed and to pull greater loads for the business.

there is of corse no information on this new engine yet but i would bet we are going to see milage from conservative drivers around 25-30 mpg. when the 01 came out i had alot of customers tell me they were getting 22 mpg out of 3/4 ton units and 1 ton units. In the race for more power those figures droped to from 15-18 mpg. When i time 6.5 injection pumps on old 94/95 trucks i ask the customer if they want power or mpg, i could change the timeing a little one way or the other and help them out. All this, whos diesle has the most power hits us in the mpg area but saying a truck has 300 hp and gets 22 mpg doesnt sell trucks i guess.

oh and for the record a 2007 3/4 ton prices out 500 Less than my 07 1/2 ton duno why but the argument about 1/2 ton at 3/4 ton pricing is not valid. If you add an option of a diesel engine thats where things get expensive, but you cant ask a mfg to offer you a 6000.00 upgrade for free. right now there is 4000 off the "clasic" 07 with a d-max.

 

[Joe1]

How about the new small Diesel in a 3/4 ton truck? It has the same HP and more torque than the 6.0 gas engine, will perform adequately to carry a camper or tow reasonable loads up to 8,000 lbs and will provide better fuel economy than the gas engine and will out last the gas engine?

 

[Toiyabe]

a car and a truck for the price of a 1 ton? insurence on both plus repairs, doesnt sound to me like a good idea. Why not have a 1/2 ton that can do the ocasional heavy towing that got 15-22 mpg? My 07 6.0 is supose to get 15 to 19 which is prety good for a truck. A deacent new car is gonna run you 35k and a striped down 1 ton would run you 35k new, so thats 70k at least in ride payments. You could go used but even a couple year old 1 ton is still going to cost 25-30k. i guess you could go with older cars but then you get into reliabilty issues.

$35K will get you a new BMW, if that's your definition of decent. $25K will get you a 5 year old diesel 4x4 1 ton, at least in my neck of the woods.

How about a brand new Toyota Camry LE, MSRP ~ $20K, and a 2001 F350 dually V10 on sale near me for $11K. Think you are going to find anything that's anywhere near as comfy to drive as that car and pulls anything like that truck for $31K or even $41K?

Insurance will be a little more (two rigs instead of one) but not twice as much. The added insurance cost will be more than offset by the gas savings. Repair costs will be much less, as your putting most of your miles on the Toyota Camry. And when you decide to get a new car, your truck should still be going strong because you haven't put many miles on it.

 

[Highbeam]

Why not just drive a car? Safety, comfort, and only having one vehicle that is capable of daily driving and working.

I wouldn't put my life into the "hands" of a car and get squished liek a can of sardines in a wreck. Ask a fireman about which type of vehicle people are more likely to survive a wreck in. I did and it was a strong push in favor of a full sized truck chassis pickup or SUV. My wife and kids drive around in a full sized SUV despite the price.

Today's 3/4 ton diesels are very capable, overly capable IMO. If I could buy a somewhat less capable diesel truck and get correspondingly higher mpg then I would be happy. Who really needs 600+ ft-lbs of torque? Fun, yes, but necessary? I don't think so and would be willing to give back some torque for some mpg. Heck, just put the smaller engine in the same truck, big manly diesel option #1 or smaller diesel option number 2. And no I don't want the same diesel derated to lower HP levels like they do in OTR trucks.

On edit: Dangit-joe1 beat me to it. Cummins already makes a 4 cylinder turbo diesel that should bolt right up.