Better Chinese Tractors

[n4807g]

Hi Chip,

Haven't logged on in months but I see you visited some factories in China. My Farmpro 8240 is coming up on 50 hours and no problems. What do you think of the 82 hp tractors now that you've seen the factory, and are you concerned or not concerned that Perkins backed out of their China association? What has been the history of reliability on the "knock off" Phaser 1004T? Thanks.....

 

[bluechip]

When I was at Lovol (formerly known as Foton, formerly known as Futian), they told me they had exclusive use of the Chinese Perkins, that Perkins US wouldn't warranty them, that service would have to come through China and the Foton, er I mean Lovol group. They apparently have an exlusive, but I expect other chinese engine companies to produce larger engines. The Lovol factory has first class assembly lines, but do not make thier own parts, except sheet metal fab parts. they have indicated that they will do better on parts support, which will help. They have some interesting plans for US distribution and will probably be the one of the first Chinese factories to become their own importer in the USA and sell through a real dealer network, like the big guys. We breifly explored the idea of using the big Foton/Lovol tractors in the AgTrac lineup but they wanted us to take the whole line or none at all.... As an aside, it wouldn't surprise me if Foton importers of the Perkins engines didn't find themselves in some litigation over trademarks. The fact is however that that plant was set up to supply the chinese market, and Lovol is a chinese customer. It could be that once they licensed the Chinese plant, even if they pull out as owners, the license might still be legal. I am no lawyer however.

 

[Affordable]

Parts for the Fotons are getting better by the day,we have found the communication gap is alot of the problem.That's why we hired someone in China that goes and picks up parts for us,them ships them out.I like the Foton's in the 40 hp and up size,they start easy ,run smooth,great fit and finish,quality tractors.
I think we are going to see more and more of them.The Jinmas in the 20-35 hp range are a good bargain,and if assemblied by a reputable dealer will provide years of service.I want to see your DF tractors when you get them Chip.Everybody has a budget and mechanical skills,I think consumers should look for dealers that provide service,parts support,tech advise,ect.Most of the problems I have seen in the chinese tractors are from poor assembly,no fluid flushs,no clutch adjustments,timing adjustments ,ect.Most order a crate,assemble it and go.There is a cost involved in servicing and adjusting a tractor prior to delivery,some want to pay it some don't.

Tommy
Affordable Tractor Sales

 

[smiley]

I was glad to stumble on this thread, Especially the Dec 06 post by Bluechip who I wish was closer as I would buy from him.
I've been debating between a Chinese tractor or used US made. I've had many US made and had good service from all, but I need 4 wd. My wife wants me to buy new, but after looking at the finish quality of the Jinma's, I question if the mechanical quality is the same and if they'll hold up, like my 1950 Allis Chalmers B and ‘58 IH 350, both of which were bought used and I still use them. Other than major oil leakage on the IH, I've hardly had a problem with either.
My main concern is longevity, both mine and the tractors'. I figure I'm good for another 35 years anyway and I want to plow snow with it then, on my 100th birthday.
Is there anyone out there like a contractor or farmer that has high hrs on any of the Chinese ones?
I know were selling "China Diesels" for 20 plus years so they should have some kind of record. Does anyone know if they're still around under another name?
I prefer old technology with gear transmissions and no bells and whistles. My main use will be to set one up with a cab and front mounted snowblower and to get around without getting stuck in the summer, for general maintenance, cleanup and hauling wood. Have also been considering a used skid steer for these purposes, but all that I know of are hydrostatic and I wouldn't have the faintest idea how to fix that if it broke and I know one contractor that spent $3500 on the tranny.
Any input will be appreciated but I'm headed for Fla. next week so may not be able to reply until April.
Thanks,
Smiley

 

[SPIKER]

SMILEY:

you might want to fill out the rest of you're profile, that way people know what rea of USA you are in other than guessing.

the jinmas are built well enough but like anything can be broken, the best thing about them is they are just what you wanted, OLDER TECH nothing an average mechanic can't fix. I broke mine pretty good by accident and by longer term abuse. it cost less than 200 to repair the damage I did. (used it like a bulldozer since day one) I have 300 hrs, on it, others have well over 500 hrs, heard of at least one fella running his semi commercially with 1500+ hrs (that was last spring) one guy who got his same shipment as mine (we brought in 4 units and shared costs back in 2001) he has 1200 hrs on his, his dad uses it most of time small back hoe work and commercial brush hogging & roto-tilling. I gave him a set of tine back last spring/summer. he has had less problems but similar problems as I have.

Belts, hoses(water) FEL hose was tore lose by a tree limb broken one hyd cylinder on his JW03 hoe (same one I broke) I had rad hose blow, (seems they don't like glychol anti-freeze) at least the bypass hose didn't both had same problem with it rotting.) he wore out his tiller tines (I got extra set for him and for mine) I broke 2 tines hitting concrete and he broke 3 or 4 on rocks and having them installed backwards.

other than std upkeep those were our problems you're mileage may vary.

other tractors to consider are the FOTONS. I can recommend CHIP or AFORDABLE with out reserve, great dealers with resourcefullyr people there. I bought parts form Tommy @ affordable. Chip sells other brands too

MarkM

 

[hbaird]

A roadside dealer for Recon Tractors has a couple of new 204's that look great. My 2005 is very rough in appearance but works well.
Harold

 

[thingy]

Well they all break,,I got 565 hours on mine,jinma 254,nortrac,,,,,but,,they all break,,and you can fix any kinda thing that breaks generally speaking,,than,generally speaking,,its about as good as new,,thats just how it works,,,,but 35 years,,,yeah,,it would still probably look about like it did new,,but probably new motor,[or at least rebuilt twice],,2-3 new clutches,,probably new trans,,,tires,,brakes,,,,,,etc,,etc,,,,30 years at 150 hours a year is about 4,500 hours,,so no tractor anymores,[if they ever was] is up to that,,,look at it this way,,,you can buy two 254's for same price you can buy simular kabota,johndeere,,,,,,,you use one for spare and other for parts and,,,,,,,you might make it!!!! thingy

 

[psj12]

I bought the same Kama 554 tractor as 3RRL. I have a 6' Kioti brush hog and a LW7 backhoe. I bought from Chip and he has been invaluable for support. I have had very few problems with it. There were some hydraulic leaks early on that Chip addressed by supplying improved bonded seals (Dowty Seals). It has loads of power. I wouldn't be surprised if it dynoed above the rated 55 hp. Heavier built than Jinma, but fit and finish are typically Chinese. The small amount of maintenance work I've done on it has been quite simple.
The Chinese backhoe is very utilitarian and durable but somewhat jerky in operation. I also has the same poor leaky rubber hydraulic seals that were originaly on the tractor. I will replace them with the bonded type seals, that Chip supplied under warranty, this spring. I should have waited for the korean ones that Affordable has for sale.

 

[bjr]

My JM 354 got between 400-500 hrs. Hour meter broke. Tractor has been as advertised. Basic, tractor and easily serviced. Did the crate tractor thing and was the right choice for me. Did all the recommended service proceedures. The one thing that I feel has been the best discission was replacing the fuel tank valve strainer assembly with a plain one quarter inch needle valve. I've never had any kind of starting issuses and I live in the cold Pacific NW. One biggie for me was no FEL. I just do not feel most farm tractors can take the abuse a FEL puts on the front end. I know there's the exceptions, I talking abuse here. I think farming type people need to be able to do some mechanical work or just be willing to outsource a lot of work. Tractors take mechanical work, period. bjr

 

[smiley]

Thank's for the info fella's,
I think you have just alleviated the fears I had about buying one. I'm in upstate NY (definately need block heater) and have a dealer 20 miles away that sells Jinmas under his own brand. As I'm always building or modifying machinery anyway, I'll definately go the crate route and save the bucks.
I have most of the summer to decide as it's primary use will be snow removal. I already have the cab and blower but will have to modify it for the front, as my neck and back are to old for all that backing up in a 350 ft driway, plus parking areas, garage drives, etc. So unless some fantastic deal comes along this summer, on something else, I'll go with the Jinma. A friend bought a 35 hp Satoh 2wd at an estate sale this weekend, in nice shape but hadn't been run in several years for $800, put battery in bled it and it fired right up.
Thanks again and any more input will be appreciated.
Smiley