Best implement/attachment for digging ditches??

jeffgbook · Jan 20, 2005

I'm trying to avoid spending $6000 on a backhoe attachment when I buy my tractor. Does anyone have any suggestions on what I can use instead?

I have some slight drainage problems in my front yard (about 1.5acre with lots of trees). I'm wanting to dig a few small, shallow, wide ditches about 150' long to my main ditch in front of my property. Wait a minute...small and wide? Sorry for the contradiction. What I mean is ditches that will eventually grow grass an be mowed like it was part of the yard. I don't know the technical term for that kind of ditch.

Friend of mine at work told me something about a kind of box blade/scoop type thing that digs a real wide ditch. Anybody know what this is called? Or would a FEL work?

Any ideas would be appreciated. Thanks. Jeff

Henro · Jan 20, 2005

I think what you want is called a swail...hope I spelled that right! /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif

Don't think a backhoe would be the tool of choice in making those.

Box blade sounds like what you may want to use. A heavy duty rear blade with tilt might work too.

I'm sure better advice will follow.

No doubt in my mind though that a backhoe is not what you want for shallow, wide angles that you want to set up for mowing. It would work, but not the best choice in my mind... /forums/images/graemlins/smile.gif

Edit: A loader could work too. The loader follows the rear wheels though, so you need to get the angle somewhat right at the start...then the loader will likely work...

An attachement on the back can cut an angle independent of the the rear wheels...this may be an advantage.

grandad · Jan 20, 2005

Jeff, a boxblade should do the trick. It's one of the handiest implements around, and they are not all that pricey either, unless you go all out and get one with the fancy hydraulic adjustments.

By adjusting the position of the 3pt links, you can change how aggressively the blade and rippers dig in and you can also tilt the blade to one side or the other, which will let you gouge a wide, shallow drainage swale just like your description.

It takes a little practice with these adjustments, but once you have used it a little, making a ditch like that should be a piece of cake.

I think you'll find the box blade better than the FEL for this because you can tilt it to an angle. The FEL makes straight cuts so it's hard to get that shallow angled ditch you want.

RobertN · Jan 21, 2005

You can get a "scoop" just for doing that. It goes on the 3pt. They can also be used to pick up and haul dirt. Some call them a "poor mans loader". They work pretty good. I had one before I got my loader... They're relatively inexpensive too. I think mine was a Leinbach

RobertN · Jan 21, 2005

Here's a link
www.free-tractor-manuals.com/consumers/implements/landscaping/dirt_scoop/dirt_scoop.html

ronnie2005 · Jan 21, 2005

I agree with Grandad. I have both, a boxblade w/rippers and a drag blade. I use both around my place for the same reason. Keep the water in the fields and not in my yard.

Whatever piece you decide on, choose and area out of the way and not close to fences to practice your trenching. With either tool if you hit something solid, like a big root, it will wipp the tractor in that direction. That can be a really fun ride sometimes but also really expensive.

Glenn9643 · Jan 21, 2005

Jeff,

Our place here is relatively flat and we had places a few years ago where water would stand for days. I decided that I needed some ditches to drain these areas to the bayou and started the job with my box blade. The primary ditch was about 650’, and pretty soon I realized that my ground wasn’t as flat as it looked. With the ditch starting at no depth at the end to be drained, it graduated to about 5’ deep at the bayou and this was with just enough drop to make the water drain. It didn’t take me long to determine that the box blade needed some help. As the ditch got deeper, I used a middlebuster to tear up the ground in the center and dropped one side of the tractor wheels in that trench and dug at an angle with my FEL. Moved MANY yards of soil. As the ditch had to go deeper, it also became much wider so I could maintain it. After moving the bulk of the dirt with the FEL, I used the box blade to finish it up. Since doing this I’ve bought a tiller, and it might work to loosen the soil with the tiller and scoop with the FEL or drag with the boxblade...
I had a 30” scoop for a while and it was of little value to me.
If your ditch doesn't need to be too deep the boxblade will do the job fine. Whatever you buy do yourself a favor and get dual remotes and top&tilt on your 3ph with the purchase. It'll probably be cheaper then and you'll never miss the money. Makes adjustments to the 3ph a snap from the seat when box blading, etc.

Tom_H · Jan 21, 2005

For the most part, I agree with Glenn regarding which implements work well and which don't. When you cut your swale (I had to look it up Henro /forums/images/graemlins/frown.gif ), the type of soil will make a difference. Sandy loam will move more easily than packed clay. With my BX2200, I do o.k. using my tiller on back and FEL with toothbar on front and with my little Gannon box, IF the clay has been slightly moistened and had time for it to sink in. A neighbor with a full sized old Ford UT just cut several big swales using his box which can rotate a ripper bar and blade separately. He can use the rippers or the box blade independently, or both together. He also has a FEL with a downsized bucket ( about 42") with a cutting bar; this enables him to scoop with the FEL after ripping better than he could with a standard bucket. In my clay soil with my BX2200, my little 24" rear scoop just won't dig, nor will my middle buster.

jeffgbook · Jan 21, 2005

Thanks fellas. I appreciate the info.

I think grandad is right. I can more that likely do it with the box blade.

What about top and tilt? I'm new so is that an aftermarket thing? Is it expensive? Is it worth it? Thanks again. Jeff.

SCB · Jan 21, 2005

I agree that the box blade will do the trick. As for the top and tilt, It is expensive. Many have made their own setups alot cheaper that the retail price. My opinion is that if you are doing alot of work with a rear blade or boxblade it may be worth the cost. If you are just doing a few projects here and there I could not justify the cost. Do I want one? Yes. But I cant justify it. They are a great way to control the cut of your boxblade though. Wait, Maybe I just talked myself into one /forums/images/graemlins/blush.gif.

jeffgbook · Jan 21, 2005

Now for the really dumb question.

I haven't got my tractor yet, but how exactly do I tilt the blade? Do I adjust all the way out on one side and all the way in on the other?

Sorry for the extreme dumbness of this question, /forums/images/graemlins/confused.gif but like I said I have no 3pt to look at so I just want to make sure I can do it when I get it (which will be soon, very soon /forums/images/graemlins/smirk.gif). Thanks. Jeff

TWINKLE_TOES · Jan 21, 2005

Jeff, maybe not "all the way" but you have the idea. I would like add to your question, how do folks handle grader ditches along side the road when you can't straddle the ditch.

SCB · Jan 21, 2005

Jeffgbook,
I can't speak for all three point hitches, but the one on My kubota has a tilt adjustment on one side only. You just raise or lower that side to create the amount of angle that you need. Someone on this board purchased an extra adjustment linkage and installed it on the other side as well and now gets twice the angle adjustment. Most standard top and tilt systems that I have seen only have a tilt cylinder on one side as well. Although I think Henro has been working on a dual cylider system.

jeffgbook · Jan 21, 2005

Good deal. Thanks a bunch. See now I'm less dumber /forums/images/graemlins/tongue.gif. Jeff

grandad · Jan 21, 2005

Twinkle, one of my summer jobs was working with the local township road crew back where I grew up in Ohio. We used a loader to clean out the deeper sections of ditches the road grader could not get to. So they did it one bucket load at a time. On my place today, I use a similar technique for some parts of our privately-maintained dirt road. It takes some practice to get an even profile running down the ditch. I am nowhere near as skillful as the old guy who did it for the township years ago.

We also have an 84", HD scraper blade that that tilts and can offset behind the tractor. It does a nice job of ripping open a shallow ditch furrow, particularly when the ground has some moisture in it. You need some weight and HP to handle it, however.

JimMorrissey · Jan 22, 2005

Actually a back hoe with a 36"+ "clean-out bucket" and a smooth cutting edge would be an excellent way to re-grade the ditch/swale. You could rent one and finish the job in a hurry if it becomes overwhelming for your machine. You should be able to get a clean-out for a mini-excavators too.

Jackrabbit_Slim · Jan 22, 2005

Sorry the quality of the photo isn't better.

I cut this last fall with a 5 foot box blade on my B2710. I ran the left side of the scraper lower than the right side to get an angle on the ditch. Basically, I just went around in a big loop, dumping out of the frame on the left. When I was at the depth I wanted, I ran the left wheels of the machine up on the high side and cut another angle to give me a gentler slope into the ditch. This will be a swale, but the rain started a little early last year and I couldn't finish up so I knocked some reclaimation mix on it overseeded with Fall Rye to hold things in place.

As you can see, it drains into quite a pool at the bottom. (I think I saw the "Edmund Fitzgerald" in there.) That pool is currently drained by a small relief ditch. This ditch will be widened into a swale through the trees as soon as it's dry enough to get the tractor in there.

Slim

Jackrabbit_Slim · Jan 22, 2005

This is the ditch that's draining the pool. Hard to see in this shot, but there's a shovel stuck in the ground on the left. Not exactly the way I would have liked to do this. Lots of rock and root (R&R takes on a whole new meaning in this part of the world) in this dirt making for a rather crooked effort. I'm in the process of cutting a line from the other side of this, and will pull stumps and continue the swale in the spring.

Slim