B21 vs B7800 w/ Woods - opinions/advice

[The Gardener]

I am comparing the possibility of a B21 or a B7800 with a 7' Woods backhoe. I have only spoken on the phone with the sales person. We haven't sat down to discuss the various Woods backhoe options available.

Could someone please clarify the various Woods backhoe options for a B7800 basing your input on the pros and cons of each backhoe.

I would sure appreciate any input regarding this tractor comparison. I very much like the BX24, but I decided to focus on the next size up for some anticipated projects that could use the additional FEL capacity and overall ground clearance.

I was pretty much set on a used B21. The sales person said that I could do just as well buying a new B21 or a new B7800 w/ a Woods backhoe. He made no mention about 0% financing from Kubota. He said they would offer an immediate $1500 rebate on the price of the B21 and 5.99% for 60 months. The B7800 w/ a Woods backhoe also received a rebate and the same financing offer.

The used B21 required a 20% down payment and the financing was 48 months at ~ 7.2%.

I could sure use some advice and some input.

Many Thanks!
The Gardener

 

[Timber]

Well Being a B7800 owner I am a big fan of this tractor. I do not have a BH but I did discuss it when I was buying it an for my the cost did not make sense to me for my needs. The woods is a better unit and certain models off the hydraulic thumb attachment. I am surprised they didn't mention the 0 percent financing but I would certainly talk about that. Be sure to have it paid off in 3 years or have another loan ready for the balance when the time comes. If these are the units you considering I would go with the 7800. Perhaps a better description of your plans would help. You might also want to consider the New B26. It is quite a machine but I bet you will have to wait for 1

 

[The Gardener]

I wonder if he chose not to mention the 0% since I asked for a longer loan period than three years at the outset. Either way, I will ask him about the 0%option. Maybe the $1500 rebate is the counter offer to 0%. ?

Our project list for the property [and this tractor] is very consistent with most other users. Lots of rock wall work, lawn removal for garden expansion, removing [or burying] the many partially buried rocks in our lawn and fields to simplify the mowing, transporting materials [loam and mulch primarily], dredging a couple of overgrown creeks, some stump and tree removals, and etc. The tractor will not be used for cutting grass. It'll also be stored for the winter months.

Not needing a mowing option was the reason I initally considered the B21 as the perfect match for our needs figuring that I didn't need a PTO for a MMM or any front implements.

I hadn't even considered the B7800. It was the sales rep who brought that tractor into our discussion stating that he could assemble a B7800 TLB at a similar price point [using a 7' Woods backhoe]. Both tractors are terrific. I am sure I would be elated with either choice.

I then got to reading more threads on this forum and I realized that there are different Woods backhoe options available [different models]. I initially thought they had one specific Woods model made for the B7800. I do like the fact that the B7800 is a 4 cylinder engine in that it should require fewer rpm's to operate the backhoe. Maybe that is incorrect. The B21 is appealing in that it is a commercial design, it seems to dominate the rental fleet which speaks to its rugged construction, and it appears to lift a bit more weight than the B7800. Yet, the B7800 has a slightly larger FEL and a little more interior capacity for materials and rocks/boulders.

I think I am splitting hairs [what few I have remaining] since each tractor seems ideal, and the cost is almost the same. I guess my only real question is the model number I should request for the Woods backhoe.

Sincerely,
The Gardener

 

[hosejockey2002]

I'm thinking that the Woods BH70X would be a good match for the B7800, possibly the BH80X. The 70X has digging forces close to the B21s BT751, but not quite as much depth or reach The 80X has slightly more capacity in all catagories. The B7800 has a lot more PTO hp than the B21, but it seems as though that's not an issue for you. The B7800 has a 1/4 inching 3 point valve vs. position control on the B21. FWIW, I was considering a used B21 as I have rented them in the past and have been very impressed. The used ones I looked at were either hammered pretty good or priced over $20K. I ended up ordering a new Kioti CK20HST with a Woods BH70X. It should be ready in another week. If I wanted to spend another $10K I would have been all over the new B26.

 

[mike69440]

Based on what you described how you will use the tractor, clearly the B21 is better suited.

B7800 is the more versitile machine however.

If close to same cost, I suggest the B21.

 

[The Gardener]

Agreed. I think both tractors are superb. In my case, the B21 seems to be perfectly matched to the projects we hope to achieve. I would prefer a hydraulic thumb, but its cost exceeds my budget so I will look to add a fixed thumb.

 

[The Gardener]

FWIW, I was considering a used B21 as I have rented them in the past and have been very impressed. The used ones I looked at were either hammered pretty good or priced over $20K. I ended up ordering a new Kioti CK20HST with a Woods BH70X. It should be ready in another week. If I wanted to spend another $10K I would have been all over the new B26.

The used B21 tractors that I have asked about appear to be well maintained and fairly well kept. The price for three of them was $23,900 [from trade-ins]. A fourth was priced at $21,900 [from their rental fleet].

I can buy a new B21 for $25,590. To me, it is well worth paying the additional money for a full warranty, dealer support, loaded tires, front and rear roof lights, and some additional perks that are sure to follow when we shake on a deal.

The B26 looks amazing. No doubt, that will be a fantastic tractor. But, for us, it's out of reach financially. We're already taxing the budget with the B21.

 

[bandit67]

A few comments:

The B7800 has the hp advantage for running 3 pt hitch PTO powered attachments, so you should think long and hard about whether you'll eventually want any of those.

The B21 has the position control 3ph, which is worlds better than any non-position control 3ph machine if you will be doing a lot of work with rear implements - that was a huge issue for me with my former little machine when I was doing a major re-landscaping project. I cursed the non-position control quite often, and promised myself I will never do without it again.

As long as you do not foresee a lot of rototilling, I think the B21 would run circles around the B7800 because it is a heavier duty machine. As with the suggestions I've received on the B3030 in another thread, and since the B7800 is the same size frame as the B3030, you might want to consider the Woods BH80X for it, as I think it would be a better comparison to the B21 backhoe's abilities.

The other big difference is that the FEL stays on the B21, so if you can come up with reasons for wanting to be able to remove the FEL, you'll have to go with the B7800.

And unless you have something really, really special to deal with snow, I suggest you at least try whichever machine you end up with once the snow starts flying. I've used all three, and my opinion is there's no way a snowblower or a pickup mounted plow is more fun in the snow than a tractor.

 

[MarkV]

Not sure it has been mentioned but one of the big advantages to the Kubota TLB’s over adding a backhoe to one of the CUT’s is the backhoe sits closer to the tractor. This give much better approach angles on slopes or trailers as well as allowing you to use the operator’s seat rather than a separate seat on the backhoe.

MarkV

 

[The Gardener]

Thanks you guys!

I believe the B21 is the best fit for our specific needs. I was not aware of the closeness advantage of a TLB backhoe vs an add-on backhoe. That is very nice, indeed!

We need a backhoe. The project list is seemingly endless. First, my wife and I will need to learn how to use one. Hopefully, that can happen fairly fast. The FEL is another huge need. I have considered the many rear attachments available, and we just don't see ourself requiring any of those items.