Attaching pto implements

[WinterDeere]

Sounds like its only needed for older tractors that have a clutch that when pushed in doesn't disengage the PTO, where having a rotary cutter can still be engaged and push the tractor forward.

That's the original intent, indeed. But folks have found many other uses for them, over the years.

Also the overriding clutch will extend the PTO shaft which may cause issue with extra length.

In the case of adding a quick hitch to an existing tractor/implement pairing, this can have the advantage of extending the driveshaft by an amount similar to that by which the quick hitch extends the link arms. So it works out nicely, in such cases.

 

[LouNY]

Since no one else will explain it, for those, like myself, who have no clue what an overriding clutch is and why you need it, this video explains it.

Sounds like its only needed for older tractors that have a clutch that when pushed in doesn't disengage the PTO, where having a rotary cutter can still be engaged and push the tractor forward.
Also the overriding clutch will extend the PTO shaft which may cause issue with extra length.

On more modern tractors an over riding clutch will save your pto brake. Any implement with any rotating mass puts a tremendous strain and wear on the pto's internal brake. An over riding clutch eliminates that issue. And when you consider that many tractors will require splitting or at least an upper transmission case removal to access and replace.

 

[5030]

Since no one else will explain it, for those, like myself, who have no clue what an overriding clutch is and why you need it, this video explains it.

Sounds like its only needed for older tractors that have a clutch that when pushed in doesn't disengage the PTO, where having a rotary cutter can still be engaged and push the tractor forward.
Also the overriding clutch will extend the PTO shaft which may cause issue with extra length.

Actually, any tractor with a clutch brake can benefit from an over riding clutch especially when using implements that will drive the pto when freewheeling like a shreder for instance. The clutch brake is designed to 'hold' the pto stub stationary when the pto isn't engaged but it's nit designed to hold it against a freewheeling implement and will fail more quickly is an over riding clutch brake is not installed.

Most large implements like hay mowers have them already in the driveline and some shredders do as well. All depends on the maker of the implement and how much inertia is generated by the freewheeling implement.

I run over running clutches on all my equipment just because the clutch brakes on my Kubota M series are marginal (as in single plate brakes) and easy to fail and replacement requires extensive work, as in splitting the unit ro access it.

 

[shooterdon]

Do you recommend an over running clutch if you do not disengage the PTO until the implement until it stops rotating?

 

[LouNY]

What makes me think and wonder some times is how poor service and repairs are thought about on many of the newer tractors.
My IH 574 you can pull the pto shaft, clutch and brake out of the tractor just using an access cover. Many of the IH's up to and including the 7100 and 7200 series and maybe more, you could park the tractor facing downhill and pull the entire pto out of the tractor to work on it, just a few hours to replace clutch disc's. Then the older Olivers the entire clutch and brake for the pto was an external dry disc unit.
Progress???

 

[LouNY]

Do you recommend an over running clutch if you do not disengage the PTO until the implement until it stops rotating?

How would you accomplish this?

 

[WinterDeere]

What makes me think and wonder some times is how poor service and repairs are thought about on many of the newer tractors.
My IH 574 you can pull the pto shaft, clutch and brake out of the tractor just using an access cover. Many of the IH's up to and including the 7100 and 7200 series and maybe more, you could park the tractor facing downhill and pull the entire pto out of the tractor to work on it, just a few hours to replace clutch disc's. Then the older Olivers the entire clutch and brake for the pto was an external dry disc unit.
Progress???

Mixed bag, I think. So much of the older stuff had to be serviceable, simply because it broke and required servicing so much more frequently, or because the failure rate wasn't known or easily predictable with the design tools available in that time.

But if a design can be made better, stronger, cheaper, and failure rate is well-understood enough to justify making it non-serviceable, then I can understand manufacturers going in that direction. Why add $100 to a design, just to make it more easily serviceable, if the fleet-average repair cost savings isn't diminished by more than $100 over the average ownership period of the initial buyer?

I know auto manufacturers look at total lifetime cost, in making these decisions, and even factors like reputational cost (you don't want mechanics to hate your brand) go into those decisions. I suspect that happens a little less with tractor design, but probably still more today than in the past.

 

[LouNY]

My IH 574 has in excess of 7000 hours on it and to the best of my knowledge the pto clutches have never been replaced. When I had to replace the pto shaft it's self we looked at the clutch discs with the thought of replacing them but comparing to the new ones (that we returned) they had minimal wear we did replace the piston actuator sealing rings while it was out and apart.
The IH's on the farm some of them have needed new clutch packs over the years, again with several thousands of hours on them with heavy pto usage.

 

[jyoutz]

Don't most tractors have a lever to take rear pto out of service ( eg change from rear pto to mid pto) my Kubota I just put lever out of rear pto position and then I can spin it by hand to line up with driveshaft spline and click in driveshaft, then board the tractor and put lever into rear pto position....away we go, until I realized this implements like rototiller or brushhog were a bear !

Most larger tractors don’t have a mid pto, and many now have an electric switch for engaging the pto.

 

[5030]

What makes me think and wonder some times is how poor service and repairs are thought about on many of the newer tractors.
My IH 574 you can pull the pto shaft, clutch and brake out of the tractor just using an access cover. Many of the IH's up to and including the 7100 and 7200 series and maybe more, you could park the tractor facing downhill and pull the entire pto out of the tractor to work on it, just a few hours to replace clutch disc's. Then the older Olivers the entire clutch and brake for the pto was an external dry disc unit.
Progress???

Not so with Kubota's, least the ones I own. Removing the front cover exposes everything including the PTO chutch pack, BUT while you can see it, it's not accessible from the back, only from the front and that entails a split which is why, at least for me, every implement I own has to have an over running clutch built into the implement driveline or I install one on the PTO stub. Least I can chage the stubs from 540-1000 without loosing any fluid if I park them on a hill, nose down....lol